Astra Series Air to Air Missiles

[Optimist]

Isn't bigger fins means more drag hence much higher energy bleed during any manures ?

And how (in case of ASRAAM) , a cylinder body is able to generate enough lift ?

And do you know the advantage and disadvantage of fins like in Astra, Mica(or SM 3/6), Aim 120 and no fins llke Aim 260.

Like all 3 have very different fins, which is better in which case ?

And do you think/know that , Aim 260 will be menurable enough to take on fighter jet with target >200km ?

And how you see Astra Mk3, Aim 260 and PL-16 ? Like which one will be better at long distances against fighter jet ?

And is the air intake of Astra Mk3 or meteor has any nagative effect except for extra weight ? Like reduced menurabality ? Or reduced effect at less altitude ?

(I know very little about air to air missiles, that's why i asked, and if you have any good materials/videos on BVR A2A missiles and combat that i would love to read that)

I will leave it to you to work out the designs of 'lifting body' a wing and wing size needed, There is a lot to it

The body lift asraam I gave as another method of control, was just for information on designs
The AIM-9X has wings

Ai

• Fuselage as a Wing: Instead of relying on large wings, the missile’s body is shaped to generate lift when flown at an angle of attack (tilted slightly relative to the oncoming air).
• Tail Control: ASRAAM relies on small control fins at the tail to pitch or yaw the missile. By adjusting these tail fins, the missile pivots its entire body into the airflow, allowing the main body to create massive amounts of aerodynamic lift.
• The missile is designed to be inherently unstable, meaning it naturally wants to pitch off-course. Its computer-controlled autopilot constantly adjusts the tail fins to maintain or alter the flight path, resulting in ultra-fast reaction times and extreme turn rates

 

[Choice_of _inevitability]

Sounds like a fiction, best to avoid giving it traction

I remember this video from months back and found it quite interesting to watch although I personally can't confirm the contents in it.

 

[Kimjongun]

I remember this video from months back and found it quite interesting to watch although I personally can't confirm the contents in it.

You cant strip mutch from burnt away rocket propellent , Most of these missiles were without their warheads (cuz they exploded) , seeker also doesnt tell you much . Its a good war booty ig .
Map reader guys is BS , Utterly wrong info posted with cheeky english to boast to his teenage audience . Same guy said Nurkhan had a deeply burried underground Node which is false , The Target were those two trucks and the above ground building not a non existent node. lol

 

[TARGET]

You cant strip mutch from burnt away rocket propellent , Most of these missiles were without their warheads (cuz they exploded) , seeker also doesnt tell you much . Its a good war booty ig .
Map reader guys is BS , Utterly wrong info posted with cheeky english to boast to his teenage audience . Same guy said Nurkhan had a deeply burried underground Node which is false , The Target were those two trucks and the above ground building not a non existent node. lol

The missile's failure will definitely cost pakistan, It will provided valuable intelligence at no cost. One more thing: if you compare the PL-15 wreckage with the AIM-120 wreckage, the PL-15 appears to have retained most of its overall structure. The PL-15 missile and its seeker are now with DRDO, they could be used for detailed analysis, including wind tunnel testing, evaluation of its design limitations, and trials using a dummy PL-15. Studying the seeker's operating frequency and other characteristics could help develop more effective countermeasures against missiles of the same production series.

 

[FalconSlayers]

You cant strip mutch from burnt away rocket propellent , Most of these missiles were without their warheads (cuz they exploded) , seeker also doesnt tell you much . Its a good war booty ig .
Map reader guys is BS , Utterly wrong info posted with cheeky english to boast to his teenage audience . Same guy said Nurkhan had a deeply burried underground Node which is false , The Target were those two trucks and the above ground building not a non existent node. lol

Yes the youtube account is absolute bullcrap but there have been some seeker(s) recovered in somewhat decent condition.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1920143533744554337

As far as targets in Nur Khan goes, IAF has explicitly stated targets were underground C&C nodes so it's not his claim. And the fact that they were targetted with not one but 2x SCALP-EG missiles that carry the bunker-buster BROACH warhead instead of something conventional. You don't need two 450kg each bunker busting warheads for two trucks, that were at best collateral damage. Or if those trucks indeed were the real targets then it means they must've been extremely valuable an asset for IAF to have prioritised hitting them with 2x SCALPs over the multiple C-130s and Il-78s parked over the tarmac nearby.

 

[Kimjongun]

Yes the youtube account is absolute bullcrap but there have been some seeker(s) recovered in somewhat decent condition.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1920143533744554337

As far as targets in Nur Khan goes, IAF has explicitly stated targets were underground C&C nodes so it's not his claim. And the fact that they were targetted with not one but 2x SCALP-EG missiles that carry the bunker-buster BROACH warhead instead of something conventional. You don't need two 450kg each bunker busting warheads for two trucks, that were at best collateral damage. Or if those trucks indeed were the real targets then it means they must've been extremely valuable an asset for IAF to have prioritised hitting them with 2x SCALPs over the multiple C-130s and Il-78s parked over the tarmac nearby.

Bhai , there was no "underground c&c node" in Nurkhan , none of the infra matches existent node architecture , The target priority were those two trucks and the missile was AFAIK brahmos and not scalps , Underground c&c nodes require ventilation and other stuff which isnt seen , The above ground building also took hits or maybe shocks of the missile which caused them to demolish and rebuild it .

Those trucks were the main targets cuz they were rare expensive pieces of equipment under no cover . Somewhat hiding them in a garage or a building would have helped in not loosing them.

Do you have any links where the IAF explicitly said the target was underground nodes??

And please refrain from that yt channel , he saw pics of some TSTs maybe and called them drone operators coming from US to help us , let him be

 

[TARGET]

Yes the youtube account is absolute bullcrap but there have been some seeker(s) recovered in somewhat decent condition.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1920143533744554337

As far as targets in Nur Khan goes, IAF has explicitly stated targets were underground C&C nodes so it's not his claim. And the fact that they were targetted with not one but 2x SCALP-EG missiles that carry the bunker-buster BROACH warhead instead of something conventional. You don't need two 450kg each bunker busting warheads for two trucks, that were at best collateral damage. Or if those trucks indeed were the real targets then it means they must've been extremely valuable an asset for IAF to have prioritised hitting them with 2x SCALPs over the multiple C-130s and Il-78s parked over the tarmac nearby.

Is this a complete intact seeker ?

Why Pakistan-fired PL-15E missile’s debris in India is China’s worry

The remnants, while proving China’s role in the India-Pakistan conflict, open up reverse-engineering potential for New Delhi to bolster its own missile programmes

www.indiatoday.in

Amidst the three days of intense missile and drone exchanges between India and Pakistan, debris from a Chinese PL-15E missile, launched by a J-10C or JF-17 jet of the Pakistan air force, was found near Kamahi Devi village in Punjab’s Hoshiarpur district.

Significant portions of the missile, including its propulsion, data-link, inertial unit and advanced active electronically scanned array (AESA) seeker, were found to be intact. The debris find has drawn global attention, with the Five Eyes alliance (United States, United Kingdom, Canada, Australia and New Zealand), Japan and South Korea having requested access to study its dual-pulse motor and AESA technology. This reflects global concerns about China’s advancing military technology.

Indian defence scientists now possess this debris, leading to speculation about potential reverse-engineering to bolster India’s own beyond-visual-range missile programmes, such as the upgraded Astra missile, and to probably rule out technical glitches in its development.

 

[Choice_of _inevitability]

Is this a complete intact seeker ?

View attachment 52830

Why Pakistan-fired PL-15E missile’s debris in India is China’s worry

The remnants, while proving China’s role in the India-Pakistan conflict, open up reverse-engineering potential for New Delhi to bolster its own missile programmes

www.indiatoday.in

Amidst the three days of intense missile and drone exchanges between India and Pakistan, debris from a Chinese PL-15E missile, launched by a J-10C or JF-17 jet of the Pakistan air force, was found near Kamahi Devi village in Punjab’s Hoshiarpur district.

Significant portions of the missile, including its propulsion, data-link, inertial unit and advanced active electronically scanned array (AESA) seeker, were found to be intact. The debris find has drawn global attention, with the Five Eyes alliance (United States, United Kingdom, Canada, Australia and New Zealand), Japan and South Korea having requested access to study its dual-pulse motor and AESA technology. This reflects global concerns about China’s advancing military technology.

Indian defence scientists now possess this debris, leading to speculation about potential reverse-engineering to bolster India’s own beyond-visual-range missile programmes, such as the upgraded Astra missile, and to probably rule out technical glitches in its development.

Yes, seeker assembly with the antenna sheared off

 

[FalconSlayers]

Bhai , there was no "underground c&c node" in Nurkhan

Again, neither you nor I know what military intelligence guys remain aware of each other's capabilities. If you've tracked the reconstruction works going on at the site of impact at Chaklala, you'd notice that the targets weren't mere NG-MMCC trucks and neither does one need 2 bunker busters to take them out unless they're extremely valuable an asset.

, none of the infra matches existent node architecture , The target priority were those two trucks and the missile was AFAIK brahmos and not scalps , Underground c&c nodes require ventilation and other stuff which isnt seen , The above ground building also took hits or maybe shocks of the missile which caused them to demolish and rebuild it .

It were SCALP missiles and its quite evident from the turbojet engine sounds that can be heard in the video, similar to the sounds of Ukrainian SCALP hits on Russian targets.

Maybe the building that was demolished had a lot to do with the U/G facility including ventilation. A similar U/G facility was hit in PAF Murid and Jacobabad too where to munition punched through what looked like an HVAC centre but was likely something else too.

Those trucks were the main targets cuz they were rare expensive pieces of equipment under no cover . Somewhat hiding them in a garage or a building would have helped in not loosing them.

The C-130s and Il-78s were a lot more expensive pieces of equipment with a lot more value for propaganda though.

Do you have any links where the IAF explicitly said the target was underground nodes??

IAF's press conference on 11th May as well as AVM Tiwari's presentation on NDTV in September last year.

And please refrain from that yt channel , he saw pics of some TSTs maybe and called them drone operators coming from US to help us , let him be

I know the channel is crap. Anyways this is offtopic for this thread.

 

[FalconSlayers]

The defence ministry will soon float a request for proposal inviting private firms and conglomerates to manufacture the Astra Mark 2 missile, HT has learnt.​

Centre set to open missile sector to private Indian firms

The defence ministry will soon float a request for proposal inviting private firms and conglomerates to manufacture the Astra Mark 2 missile, HT has learnt. | India News

www.hindustantimes.com

This shift comes as the state-owned manufacturer, Bharat Dynamics Ltd, cannot cater to the growing demands of the armed forces and missile exports to friendly third countries.

Extremely ironic

https://sansad.in/getFile/loksabhaquestions/annex/1711/AU2982.pdf?source=pqals

QR-SAM and Akash-NG are all awaiting orders, with new massive Ibrahimpatnam line and ATGM+Grad line in Jhansi, where exactly are the orders? Amravati line was temporarily shelved due to no VSHORAD orders (although I wonder if StarsStreak order would lead them to build the new plant).

 

[South block]

The defence ministry will soon float a request for proposal inviting private firms and conglomerates to manufacture the Astra Mark 2 missile, HT has learnt.​

Centre set to open missile sector to private Indian firms

The defence ministry will soon float a request for proposal inviting private firms and conglomerates to manufacture the Astra Mark 2 missile, HT has learnt. | India News

www.hindustantimes.com

Extremely ironic

https://sansad.in/getFile/loksabhaquestions/annex/1711/AU2982.pdf?source=pqals

QR-SAM and Akash-NG are all awaiting orders, with new massive Ibrahimpatnam line and ATGM+Grad line in Jhansi, where exactly are the orders? Amravati line was temporarily shelved due to no VSHORAD orders (although I wonder if StarsStreak order would lead them to build the new plant).

This dispensation is all about enriching Dhandho who are themselves compromised bunch. Expect massive devastating leaks in future on critical core technologies to our enemies.

 

[FalconSlayers]

This dispensation is all about enriching Dhandho who are themselves compromised bunch. Expect massive devastating leaks in future on critical core technologies to our enemies.

Yeah, imagine what happened to TEPL happening to TASL if it ever gets contracts for strategic projects including AMCA. But these guys are going to do screwdriver work only i.e. assembly and testing. Adani has invested in backward integration at their new plant in Shivpuri but I hope they don't get anything for something as critical as air-to-air weapons. At best leave that to Bharat Forge (Kalyani) since they've started work on their new massive "energetics" plant in Andhra and will help prevent having all eggs in one basket.

 

[Kimjongun]

Again, neither you nor I know what military intelligence guys remain aware of each other's capabilities. If you've tracked the reconstruction works going on at the site of impact at Chaklala, you'd notice that the targets weren't mere NG-MMCC trucks and neither does one need 2 bunker busters to take them out unless they're extremely valuable an asset.

It were SCALP missiles and its quite evident from the turbojet engine sounds that can be heard in the video, similar to the sounds of Ukrainian SCALP hits on Russian targets.


Maybe the building that was demolished had a lot to do with the U/G facility including ventilation. A similar U/G facility was hit in PAF Murid and Jacobabad too where to munition punched through what looked like an HVAC centre but was likely something else too.

The C-130s and Il-78s were a lot more expensive pieces of equipment with a lot more value for propaganda though.

IAF's press conference on 11th May as well as AVM Tiwari's presentation on NDTV in September last year.



I know the channel is crap. Anyways this is offtopic for this thread.

Sorry to the mods for continuing off topic coversations ,
Bhai the Supposed underground facility does not match with exsistent nodde infra structure , Murid and othe nodes have similar design and have been built in a time where we can see its construction , how ever the building which got demolished was nothing more then an air operations building/tower , there is no presence of ventilation shafts or other things.

Also A vent shaft is not made exactly over a bunker rather is at 90 degree's to the entrance to avoid radiation or other Contaminants from entering .
Kher these topics have probably been discussed to death here , so lets just agree to disagree .

 

[ShiroBarks]

Centre to allow private firms to manufacture missiles; Astra Mark 2 likely first

The defence ministry will soon float a request for proposal (RFP) inviting private-sector firms and conglomerates, including ICOMM, Adani, Bharat Forge, the Tata group and the Mahindra group, to manufacture the 180-200km range Astra Mark 2 missile, HT has learnt. The successfully tested missile counters the long-range PL-15 E air-to-air missile provided by China to Pakistan in the run-up to Operation Sindoor last year. The Astra Mark 2 will be integrated with Tejas Mark 1-A, MiG-29, Su-30 MKI and Rafale Marine fighters.

According to people familiar with the matter, the next missile to be offered to the private sector for both development and manufacturing is the two-stage, 500km-range Pralay tactical ballistic missile. Flying at six times the speed of sound, Pralay is part of the integrated rocket forces, which includes the newly developed long-range land-attack cruise missile (LRLACM), the next-generation BrahMos and the extended-range Pinaka multi-barrel rocket launching system, which can target enemies at a distance of 300km.

People familiar with the matter told Hindustan Times that the Pralay tactical ballistic missile is likely to be the next missile system opened to private companies for both development and manufacturing.