If the Armed Forces fail to utilise even the budget getting allocated to them, then increasing the defence budget to 2.5-3% of GDP isn't going to solve anything.
Defence Budget Allocation & Defence Procurement Procedure : News & Discussions
- Thread starter Ashwin
- Start date
Its not theirs failure, the tortuous natute of tendering does. In reality goi is failing them.
IDDM equipment stuck in endless loop of trials after trials is definitely their failure.
Budget isn't a problem now for us. And stop shilling about imports as our current desi drive is the correct way to go.
5 year change in BE allocation. Army is the clear looser here.
House panel flags low Army budget for modernisation, urges hike for sufficient deterrence capacity
Standing committee has urged focus on procurement of state-of-the-art equipment & keeping Army expenditure ‘in proportion to increase in defence spending of our neighbours’.
theprint.in
The army has the lowest capital expenditure allocation among services. Additionally, the army is the only service that surrenders funds due to non-utilization.
- Force modernisation through capability development is progressing at a steady pace. Cognisance is being taken of the hi-tech warfighting equipment being developed and used across the world especially in active war zones. Acquisition procedures are being reviewed and renewed to boost ‘Aatmanirbharta’. Defence Acquisition Procedure 2020 is likely to undergo a complete revamp in 2025 and efforts are being made to make it amenable to service requirements. More than five hundred schemes have been planned for acquiring potent fighting capability in next 15 years. The broad categories of acquisition schemes include Force Application, Battlefield Awareness, Command & Control, Sustenance & Support, and Protection. Defence Procurement Board (DPB) has approved the Annual Acquisition Plan 2024-26 in May 2024. Based on prioritisation of schemes in AAP 2024-26, a total of 25 schemes costing approximately ₹40,695 crores have been identified and targeted to be concluded in FY 2024-25. To address any capability void and induct niche technology, a special provision was accorded in the form of EP-IV by DAC on 22 August 2023. A total of 73 Capability Development schemes were contracted in the domains of Drone/Counter-Drone, Weapon systems, Mobility & Protection, Survivability etc.
One of the most eventful days of the year & it's evening now but I've yet to see any discussion of the day's events.
https://www.indiabudget.gov.in/
CAPEX goes up to 1.8 lakh crores from last year's 1.6 lakh crores. It's ~ 12 % hike.
The going ons in this forum reminds me of this Kabir Doha -
https://www.indiabudget.gov.in/
CAPEX goes up to 1.8 lakh crores from last year's 1.6 lakh crores. It's ~ 12 % hike.
The going ons in this forum reminds me of this Kabir Doha -
Nothing has changed regarding the defense budget. Based on the RE, it appears that the services are struggling to spend even the allocated money. Pensions have increased substantially as usual.
Its basic arithmetic. Increase is inconsequential 4.65%.
Its basic arithmetic. Increase is inconsequential 4.65%.
It's just starting to sink in- tax rebates, and all. Ms. Sitharaman in a benevolent new avatar. It's times like these that make you go, "You know, maybe coalition govts aren't so bad after all".
Roughly $25b, I reckon? A double digit hike though the overall allocation is still under 2% of GDP.
They lost the income tax narrative war to the Congress. And even the govt was like it was high time the income tax needed restructuring. They should have done it before the LS polls though.
To be fair, people with children shouldn't be paying taxes up to 20 or 24L. They can bring in children-specific standard deductions.
Another one of my predictions came true, that I'm sure even Ignorants remembers. Double digit growth in capital acquisitions will ensure the IAF and IA's modernization budgets will eventually double and stagnate for a decade or so, while the IN's will continue increasing. This will allow us to modernize at the same rate as the US, Russia, and China.
Ashwin's post 246 shows how the IN's budget has started overshadowing the IA/IAF's. You can also see that the govt has started matching their spending requirements. Overall allocation is irrelevant as long as economic growth is delivering double digit growth and the forces are receiving their projected spending needs.
I'm afraid the BJP has lost the plot. Until recently, they justified higher taxes as the price of better infra, good governance and economic growth. Fiscal deficit was the buzzword. Now, you can barely tell the difference. They've been doling out freebies like there's no tomorrow, back pedalling on PSU disinvestment, increasing salaries for govt employees under the 8th Pay Commission. 'When you can't beat them, join them' seems to be the MO.
IN's budget has been increasing coz of the simple reason they've planned their modernization / upgradation program with much greater diligence & care than the other services besides there's not much the IAF can acquire in a jiffy.
Their last big ticket acquisition was the C-295 & before that 36 nos Rafales & if there's been no follow thru on the latter on expected lines which'd have materialised by now award a PVSM to rtd ACM Chaudhari & few Padmas to our babooos & dhotis.
There are Refuellers , AWACS , FAs etc which are in the pending list of which we've seen some movement only on the AWACS front. Mk-1a acquisition has been stalled while the other FAs are in various stages of realisation.
As far as the IA goes , up until the 3 years it was the ATHOS vs ATAGS saga they were caught up in , followed by the Javelin vs Spike vs Nag & its various derivatives & right now it's the Stryker vs WhAP with all 3 comedies still running without the concluding episode .
Will let everyone here know if something new as in a new comedy show comes up but I have a strong feeling the next one due is whether to give the rest of the Light Tank order to L&T or have another circus by inviting a tender and spend the rest of this decade in technical evaluations up & down Ladakh.
This is for RST's information unless he's arguing that people here contested a rise in our GDP growth & consequent revenues wouldn't be reflected in defence budgets particularly given the prevalent situation in our neighborhood.
I mean it's all very well to think of oneself as intelligent & consequently others as "unwashed civilians" but I wouldn't be that someone who then calls the Mk-2 an Mk-1a with 2 plugs , hence the same plane.
Their last big ticket acquisition was the C-295 & before that 36 nos Rafales & if there's been no follow thru on the latter on expected lines which'd have materialised by now award a PVSM to rtd ACM Chaudhari & few Padmas to our babooos & dhotis.
There are Refuellers , AWACS , FAs etc which are in the pending list of which we've seen some movement only on the AWACS front. Mk-1a acquisition has been stalled while the other FAs are in various stages of realisation.
As far as the IA goes , up until the 3 years it was the ATHOS vs ATAGS saga they were caught up in , followed by the Javelin vs Spike vs Nag & its various derivatives & right now it's the Stryker vs WhAP with all 3 comedies still running without the concluding episode .
Will let everyone here know if something new as in a new comedy show comes up but I have a strong feeling the next one due is whether to give the rest of the Light Tank order to L&T or have another circus by inviting a tender and spend the rest of this decade in technical evaluations up & down Ladakh.
This is for RST's information unless he's arguing that people here contested a rise in our GDP growth & consequent revenues wouldn't be reflected in defence budgets particularly given the prevalent situation in our neighborhood.
I mean it's all very well to think of oneself as intelligent & consequently others as "unwashed civilians" but I wouldn't be that someone who then calls the Mk-2 an Mk-1a with 2 plugs , hence the same plane.
They can't do anything more without supermajority in both houses. Hopefully they get that in 2029.
IA's high-end financial requirements are for 2030+ in some cases and 2035+ for their most expensive ones.
IAF's was stymied by the failure of MMRCA, but their biggest financial outgo will be for 2030+.
IN's modernization has been going on since the late 90s, it's the continuation of the same plan.
Of the three, IA was cheated out of their deals due to DRDO, which is the reason why PMO now wants to remove DRDO's ability to veto acquisitions.
IN's works 'cause its procurement is iterative and the ToT demand is significantly lower, unlike the IAF's mass requirement and ToT. Which means, IN is fine with buying multiple batches of 36 Rafales with limited or not ToT, but the IAF cannot operate that way because their operational environment is different. IN has no competiton in the IOR, but IAF does. So IN prefers to develop new technologies at their own pace via indigenous means, whereas IAF needs significant control over imported tech while also develop new tech indigenously.
IA too requires significant control over the tech they use, whether domestic or imported.
It's simple things like this that escape the notice of unwashed civilians that like to simplify complex information.
Anyway, the IN's increased budget has nothing to do with all of this. The Modi govt had decided a decade ago that the IN will get the most money eventually to match India's economic status, which is why their budget will take the longest time to stagnate. The USN too has the biggest budget.
IAF's was stymied by the failure of MMRCA, but their biggest financial outgo will be for 2030+.
IN's modernization has been going on since the late 90s, it's the continuation of the same plan.
Of the three, IA was cheated out of their deals due to DRDO, which is the reason why PMO now wants to remove DRDO's ability to veto acquisitions.
IN's works 'cause its procurement is iterative and the ToT demand is significantly lower, unlike the IAF's mass requirement and ToT. Which means, IN is fine with buying multiple batches of 36 Rafales with limited or not ToT, but the IAF cannot operate that way because their operational environment is different. IN has no competiton in the IOR, but IAF does. So IN prefers to develop new technologies at their own pace via indigenous means, whereas IAF needs significant control over imported tech while also develop new tech indigenously.
IA too requires significant control over the tech they use, whether domestic or imported.
It's simple things like this that escape the notice of unwashed civilians that like to simplify complex information.
Anyway, the IN's increased budget has nothing to do with all of this. The Modi govt had decided a decade ago that the IN will get the most money eventually to match India's economic status, which is why their budget will take the longest time to stagnate. The USN too has the biggest budget.
Defence ministry paves way for faster weapon acquisition
The Defence Acquisition Council will today agree to compress time-lines for capital defence procurement.New Delhi: The defence ministry today will seek approval from the Defence Acquisition Council (DAC) headed by Defence Minister Rajnath Singh to drastically compress timelines for the procurement of defence equipment in an effort to ensure that the country’s ability to defend itself doesn’t fall victim to bureaucratic procedures.
The ministry wants the average time taken for defence acquisition to be cut from the present 96 weeks (two years) to only 24 weeks (six months).
According to at least three top officials who spoke on condition of anonymity, the defence ministry wants the cumbersome capital acquisition procedure, governed by a voluminous Defence Acquisition Procedure (DAP) manual, running into 657 pages across two volumes, to be made more efficient so that acquisition of much-needed platforms is not delayed. The tedious DAP document was last amended in 2020. Over the years, there have been acquisition delays in the procurement of Rafale fighters, Rafale-Maritime fighters (still to be cleared by CCS), additional three Scorpene class submarines, Project 75 I air-independent propulsion submarines and Predator Drones.
HT learns that the proposal before DAC lays down strict timelines for Request for Proposals (RFP), Field Evaluation Trials and Contract Negotiation Committee (CNC), so that the entire process is completed within six months.
According to the officials cited above, the Modi government wants armed forces to get the RFP ready even as they move (or ideally, before they move) the defence ministry for Acceptance of Necessity (AON) for a particular platform to be acquired. Until now, the whole process of RFP by the armed forces started after DAC gave an AON for a particular capital acquisition.
The next step is Field Evaluation Trial of a weapon system, which currently takes years as the armed forces want the system to be tested in polar conditions as well as the desert. Given that conditions can now be simulated, the defence ministry wants the trials to be completed parallelly by testing the capital equipment under simulated conditions
The final step, which involves CNC, driven by top defence ministry mandarins, must also be completed within six months rather than being negotiated with the supplier ad nauseam. It is only after the contract price has been negotiated and approved by the finance ministry, that the matter reaches the Cabinet Committee on Security headed by the Prime Minister.
By compressing the timelines of the capital acquisition process, the defence ministry wants faster decision-making when it comes to the procurement of high-end platforms. It wants to hold both the armed forces and itself accountable in case the price of the platform changes due to delays. (EOM)
Everything is fine but we shouldn't be compromising on field trials and whatever this "Simulation trials" idea is floated shouldn't be entertained. Simulations cannot match proper field trials, this might overlook finer details of the product. This will only help corporates and may hamper the militaries overall capabilities.
Btw I don't think simulations are even possible for every defence product so, don't know how it will turn out. More information is needed about this.
DAC clears capital acquisition proposals worth over Rs 54,000 crore to enhance defence capabilities
Under the chairmanship of Raksha Mantri Shri Rajnath Singh, the Defence Acquisition Council (DAC), o
pib.gov.in