Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

Ofcourse - you can't start a Ramjet from the ground, the missile already needs to be in subsonic flight for the Ramjet to start functioning.

Ramjets, like Scramjets have no moving parts. There are no spinning blades like on a turbofan that force air into the chamber - air already needs to be moving at a certain rate through the chamber prior to ignition.



The test was SFDR which means it's a project meant to develop Ramjet propulsion for a variety of applications, although most probable use is for Astra Mk-2.

DeiaF-WXkAIJfa2.jpg


But in Air-to-Air application you don't need that huge booster because you are not starting from zero kph. The launch aircraft is already flying at speed. For any additional push, an integrated mechanism within the cumbustor takes care of that (like on Meteor).



Cryogenic cooling of onboard seeker is for IIR-guided missiles. And that's for two reasons:

1) Keeping the seeker cool increases its sensitivity against heat emissions from targets, not doing so would reduce sensitivity (as a result there hasn't been such a thing as uncooled IIR AAM for a long time).
2) IIR seeker has to stay 'on' for much longer periods than RF seeker. Some planes even use the seekers on IIR missiles as IRST while still attached to the pylon.

RF seeker stays 'off' for most of the time. Before launch, during launch and for a significant amount of time after launch, the RF missile is simply relying on the launch aircraft's radar. It's own seeker only comes online when it is already very close to the target - so the actual period where the seeker is online during a fire mission is all of a FEW SECONDS.

You don't need cooling for that. At least not for present generation of RF seekers which are of slotted-array type.

But once you move to AESA seekers (like on Japanese AAM-4B, Russian K-77M project and the new UK-Japan project for Meteor) then you might need liquid cooling.
Hi,
Detailed comment. Me liky.
The ramjet duct can be seen dangling underneath the missile.
Yes you don't need the huge booster shown in this picture if the missile is launched from a moving aircraft.
This kerosene burner missile is too big by the looks of it. But that's a requirement for any internal combustion engines, it needs space and increases size and weight of carrying vehicle.
The cryogenic cooling you are on about Is usually very simple. It's just one or few small metal cylinders containing carbondioxide at incredible pressure. As the missile is fired the tiny cylinders are discharged and pressurised gas liquefy on release. The liquid gas provides cooling for a few seconds or tens of seconds before evaporation , and then the electronics heat up within tolerance brackets until impact.
But obviously flight times need to be few tens of seconds not more. More elaborate cooling systems cannot be used on Air to air missiles due to size and weight restrictions.
A ram jet is used for much longer flights.
I will wait for more details on the system.
 
The booster is a new design without nozzles. So it looks crude and fat at the bottom. Otherwise it is pretty clear that it is the AAM design which has been tested which can be converted to a SAM with the addition of this low cost nozzleless booster which can be used multiple times.

I got doubt regarding what booster they are talking about ,
So I referred about meteor missile .
There is integrated booster with the missile it seems.

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Meteor missile

Propulsion
The propulsion sub-system (PSS) is a Throttleable Ducted Rocket (TDR) with an integrated nozzleless booster, designed and manufactured by Bayern-Chemie. TDR propulsion provides a long range, a high average speed, a wide operational envelope from sea level to high altitude, a flexible mission envelope via active variable thrust control, relatively simple design
,..

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I think the newly developed booster is integrated booster within missile.
 
I got doubt regarding what booster they are talking about ,
So I referred about meteor missile .
There is integrated booster with the missile it seems.

------------
Meteor missile

Propulsion
The propulsion sub-system (PSS) is a Throttleable Ducted Rocket (TDR) with an integrated nozzleless booster, designed and manufactured by Bayern-Chemie. TDR propulsion provides a long range, a high average speed, a wide operational envelope from sea level to high altitude, a flexible mission envelope via active variable thrust control, relatively simple design
,..

-----------

I think the newly developed booster is integrated booster within missile.
You could be correct here. But a nozzleless booster is designed to give a very large amount of thrust in a very short time. Such boosters are ideal for launching air breathing weapons to allow them to quickly reach self sustaining propulsion.
 
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Akash Missile system also use the Ramjet propulsion system but the range is not much ,I wonder with this new technology, can we impact the range ?
 
I got doubt regarding what booster they are talking about ,
So I referred about meteor missile .
There is integrated booster with the missile it seems.

------------
Meteor missile

Propulsion
The propulsion sub-system (PSS) is a Throttleable Ducted Rocket (TDR) with an integrated nozzleless booster, designed and manufactured by Bayern-Chemie. TDR propulsion provides a long range, a high average speed, a wide operational envelope from sea level to high altitude, a flexible mission envelope via active variable thrust control, relatively simple design
,..

-----------

I think the newly developed booster is integrated booster within missile.

You could be correct here. But a nozzleless booster is designed to give a very large amount of thrust in a very short time. Such boosters are ideal for launching air breathing weapons to allow them to quickly reach self sustaining propulsion.

Just like Akash , the SFDR also uses Ramjet Rocket Propulsion Technology ..... the combustion chamber of ramjet itself act as booster in initial phase .

meteordetalh.jpg


J1sBt5r.png
 
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India tastes only partial success in Ramjet test

NEW DELHI: A landmark missile test— acclaimed as a unique achievement placing India in a select set of nations with Solid Fuel Ducted Ramjet— did not fully demonstrate the technology it claimed before the weapon tumbled and crashed after firing, telemetry studies undertaken after the launch have shown.

Sources have told ET that the Solid Fuel Ducted Ramjet (SFDR) test carried out on Wednesday succeeded only in the initial booster stage but did not activate the second leg that is crucial to propel a missile for a longer distance. As result, the missile crashed before the technology could be fully tested.

This solid fuel-based propellant technology is being developed for use on a new class of next generation missiles to more than double their range and speed to take down enemy targets. Applications include air-to-air missiles and surface-to-air weapons that will power future indigenous defence projects.

While it was an initial trial and more tests would be required to master the technology that greatly enhances the range of a missile by doing away with the need of an oxidizer, the failure to activate the Ramjet during the flight will be examined. Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) officials said the Ramjet activation would be demonstrated in a later flight.



Master.jpg

TELEMETRY STUDIES

It is learnt that the booster phase of the test was successfully carried out that took the missile to high speed. However, the booster did not separate from the missile, resulting in the sustainer Ramjet engine not being tested. This could now be carried out in subsequent tests.

Telemetry studies confirmed that the missile tumbled and crashed after the booster stage. The booster for the yet to be named missile has been developed by DRDO while the Ramjet engine is being developed with Russian assistance. In response to ET queries, DRDO said that all mission objectives were met during the test but confirmed that the Ramjet was not engaged.

An official statement said that the technology of “nozzle less booster has been successfully demonstrated in the mission for the first time in the country”. The French Meteor air-to-air missile uses the Ramjet technology, giving them a range of close to 300 km — a cutting edge on the aerial battlefield.
 
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AS PER MOD

Successful Flight Test of SFDR


The technology demonstrator flight test of ‘Solid Fuel Ducted Ramjet (SFDR)’ propulsion based missile has been carried out successfully from the Launch Center-III of ITR, Chandipur, Orissa on yesterday. The flight test met all the mission objectives. The technology of nozzle less booster has been successfully demonstrated in the mission for the first time in the country.

I feel this test is all about the nozzle less booster.:unsure:
 
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AS PER MOD

Successful Flight Test of SFDR


The technology demonstrator flight test of ‘Solid Fuel Ducted Ramjet (SFDR)’ propulsion based missile has been carried out successfully from the Launch Center-III of ITR, Chandipur, Orissa on yesterday. The flight test met all the mission objectives. The technology of nozzle less booster has been successfully demonstrated in the mission for the first time in the country.

I feel this test is all about the nozzle less booster.:unsure:

The warning of that test was for approx 50 km range . So in no way the ramjet was tested.
 
DRDO turns Pinaka rocket system into guided missile, developmental trials soon

THE indigenous Pinaka rocket system of the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO), known for firing a salvo of 12 rockets in just 44 seconds, is being evolved into a precision-guided missile, with enhanced range and accuracy to hit its targets. The missile, which has completed the initial trial, will undergo developmental trials next month and is expected to be delivered to the Army in two years, said senior DRDO scientists.

The initial version of the Pinaka rocket was further developed into Pinaka Mark II, which has an enhanced range of 70 to 80 km compared to Mark I, with a range of 40 km. The rocket has been developed by the Armament cluster of the DRDO, with a lead from Pune-based Armament Research and Development Establishment (ARDE). Along with ARDE, the High Energy Material Research Laboratory in Pune and two DRDO establishments in Hyderabad have contributed to the development.

Speaking about the development of the Guided Pinaka Mark II, ARDE Director K M Rajan said, “Pinaka is originally a 30 to 40 km range rocket… in subsequent developments, the range was increased. But with the increased range, the user, the Army, wanted it to be more accurate. So, the guided version of the Pinaka is currently being developed and the first demonstration has taken place one year ago. In the maiden trial, we have been able to achieve a 75 km range with a five metre accuracy. We feel it is phenomenal. Next month, we will be going for a series of developmental trials of the guided Pinaka. The project duration is three years. We have already completed one year and are on time. We can expect the induction of the Guided Pinaka into the armed forces in the next two years.”

On the various trials to be conducted on Guided Pinaka, Rajan said, “Initially, there are ground-level trials for the evaluation of the propulsion. Once those parameters are met, we go for instrumental flight trials… we will see if the performance is as per our prediction and subsequently, if fine-tuning is needed, that will be done. Then there will be actual ground trials at Pokhran. After we are satisfied with all the aspects, the user, which is the Artillery, will be invited for independent evaluation. If that is cleared, we will go for production.”

P K Mehta, director general of Armament and Combat Engineering Systems, DRDO, said, “We also need to understand why the Guided Pinaka is important. What we always want is to avoid any collateral damage. Pinaka is a rocket system that has been developed to nullify a particular area. We are now trying to work out a missile from a rocket. We have a set pattern of trials. One is internal trials, then user-assisted technical trials and then user trial. The parameters, which make Pinaka a guided missile, will be evaluated in these trials. Pinaka per se has already been tested. But the guided Pinaka will be a very small number compared to the entire inventory of the Pinaka.”

While Pinaka Mark I had been used in the 1999 Kargil conflict, the guided version follows the policy of the Indian Army to use precision weapons. “The rocket has been named after Pinaka, the bow of Lord Shiva. The Pinaka system is like a quiver of 12 rockets. But the guided version serves a different purpose. In future, the Pinaka and Guided Pinaka will co-exist in the proportion that the user wants. Pinaka will continue as a weapon that can destroy an area and the guided version will add an edge to it when a specific target has to be hit,” said a DRDO scientist.


Israel Turns Artillery Rocket Into Supersonic 'Rampage' Air-Launched Stand-Off Weapon

Hopefully DRDO will develop the air launched version as well like above.
 
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