LCA Tejas Mk1 & Mk1A - News and discussions

The size of the aircraft does not determine the size of the RCS, depending on whether you are designed to control its main radiation source. For example, the J 10 uses a DSI inlet to shield the engine blades and a metal-coated canopy
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To determine the RCS of the Tejas, it should be measured rigorously using a microwave anechoic chamber

LCA has Y-inlets. It's better for stealth than chin inlets.

Similar to this:
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You can see here that the engine is hidden from view.
 
LCA has Y-inlets. It's better for stealth than chin inlets.

Similar to this:
View attachment 32836

View attachment 32837

You can see here that the engine is hidden from view.
Not all single-shot fighters with two-sided intakes have Y-shaped intakes that shield the engine blades
Of course, if the horizontal propagation of radar waves will not affect, but for some angle of radar waves, it is not difficult
 

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Not all single-shot fighters with two-sided intakes have Y-shaped intakes that shield the engine blades
Of course, if the horizontal propagation of radar waves will not affect, but for some angle of radar waves, it is not difficult

It's too far in to be visible.

This image is even more clear, the landing carriage blocks the view.
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To prevent cavitation, the inlet will get RAM treatment.
 
It's too far in to be visible.

This image is even more clear, the landing carriage blocks the view.
View attachment 32839

To prevent cavitation, the inlet will get RAM treatment.
You can tell if you have more detailed photos of the Tejas inlet, and the radar beam isn't always perpendicular to the plane, as I said, When it has an angle, it's reflected directly on the engine blades
 
Then what is the expected range it could achieve, if not 0.5m²?
Even the Chinese have done well in material technology and building composites but I think no Chinese light weight or medium weight fighter like J17 or j10c can achieve 0.5 m² so far from their designs from every angle.
Overall, I don't think non-stealth fighters can reach 0.5. Stealth design is much more complicated than most people think. Even a tiny gap between the fuselage skins can cause an aircraft's RCS to increase dramatically at a certain angle
 
I think we can compare it with the JAS 39, whose RCS is 1.5 ~ 2 ㎡ in X band
He also used what the Indians call a Y-shaped inlet
And its surface doesn't have as many bulges and cooling air intakes as the Tejas
In my image, the red arrow refers to the boundary layer barrier of the tejas inlet
This is a natural giant corner reflector
The blue arrow refers to the large number of cooling ports on the surface of the Tejas, and the effect on the RCS is large

Overall, I don't think non-stealth fighters can reach 0.5. Stealth design is much more complicated than most people think. Even a tiny gap between the fuselage skins can cause an aircraft's RCS to increase dramatically at a certain angle
You're both right and wrong! Why? Cause RCS isn't a static thing but is very dynamic. It depends upon multiple factors like external weapons load, aspect angle etc.

So, Gripen-C does have average loaded RCS of 1.5m2-2m2 but its clean frontal RCS is indeed 0.5m2. Similiarly Tejas' RCS when loaded with drop tanks and 6 BVRs is around 1.5m2-2m2. Though clean frontal is between 0.3m2 - 0.5m2.


But you're correct that only VLO planes have average RCS of below 0.5m2 from all aspects.
 
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In the early days, the Tejas did have a 45% design goal of using composite materials, but whether this goal was achieved, given the fact that Tejas is now substantially overweight, I doubt it,
Where did you get this idea that Tejas is substantially overweight? Navy wanted it even lighter because their ships do not have catapult assist.

It has decreased weight since 2017 or so when it was reported to be overweight by Navy.


Composite structures comprise over 90 per cent of its surface area and 45 per cent of its airframe by weight. This is one of the greatest composite utilisation rates for any aircraft worldwide. This substantial use of composites has decreased the aircraft’s weight by 21% and its component count by 40% compared to what would have been the case if it had been made entirely of metal.

, the reflection of electromagnetic waves on non-metallic surfaces is weaker than that on metallic surfaces, but this does not mean that it does not reflect electromagnetic waves. JAS39E/F has covered the scattering source on the surface during design, which reduces its RCS. As for the 0.5 you mentioned, it may occasionally be achieved at a certain angle, but the actual situation will never be so ideal
I never claimed all aspect RCS to be 0.5. And to be honest for a fully loaded Tejas it will be significantly higher.
But then, to be honest does J-20 has all aspect radar stealthy? Its low RCS is only when seen from certain profile.

And yes, tejas has substantial composits. About 90% of its surface is composit. Which is why its RCS is low.
 
I think he is ex pd-f. Gave it away when he claimed DSI part of "stealth".

A decade back on that forum, DSI was the greatest invention since sliced bread.
Oh well... these days everyone is really gungho on anything even remotely Turkish there.
 
You can tell if you have more detailed photos of the Tejas inlet, and the radar beam isn't always perpendicular to the plane, as I said, When it has an angle, it's reflected directly on the engine blades

If there's no direct line of sight, then the only problem is cavitation, which means the signal will bounce around. To deal with that, LCA will have RAM. Plus bouncing around also helps absorb energy, which is one of the advantages of a Y-inlet.

In fact, cavitation is a much bigger problem for chin inlets, like the F-16, Typhoon and J-10.
I think he is ex pd-f. Gave it away when he claimed DSI part of "stealth".

A decade back on that forum, DSI was the greatest invention since sliced bread.

The Chinese pushed that story first.
 
I think he is ex pd-f. Gave it away when he claimed DSI part of "stealth".

A decade back on that forum, DSI was the greatest invention since sliced bread.
The Chinese pushed that story first.
Oh well... these days everyone is really gungho on anything even remotely Turkish there
No, this myth was driven by the U.S. Air Force, which began developing compact inlets in the 1980s, through Boeing, Lockheed Martin, McDonnell Douglas and other aviation giants, the DSI inlet is the most suitable, simple structure, light weight, no complex boundary layer barrier, There's no huge shock resistance,
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If there's no direct line of sight, then the only problem is cavitation, which means the signal will bounce around. To deal with that, LCA will have RAM. Plus bouncing around also helps absorb energy, which is one of the advantages of a Y-inlet.

In fact, cavitation is a much bigger problem for chin inlets, like the F-16, Typhoon and J-10
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This is called stealth inlet, India as long as from the oblique side can see the engine blade, I am afraid that only Indians will think he is invisible
 
A decade back on that forum, DSI was the greatest invention since sliced bread.
A tailless delta-wing aircraft has a maximum Mach number of 1.6. Anyone with a sense of aerodynamics would laugh their heads off
The Tejas' inlet problems will be the sword of Damocles hanging over his head
 
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This is called stealth inlet, India as long as from the oblique side can see the engine blade, I am afraid that only Indians will think he is invisible

You are free to believe what you want, but, even if that's the case, the LCA Mk1 has an RCS 3 times smaller than the M2000, which is already <1m2.

This is official data from the Swedish AF from early 2000s.
  1. Gripen's acceleration in sub-sonic and trans-sonic domains: faster than F/A-18C/D and M2000-5, but slower than F-16C.
  2. Gripen's instant turn rate: significantly better than F-16C, F/A-18C/D, and M2000-5.
  3. Gripenss sustained turn rate: worse than F-16C, F/A-18C/D, but better than M2000-5.
  4. The Gripen achieved the AoA of more than 100 degrees during the flight test, but due to the reason for flight safety, the normal setting of the upper limit of the AoA for the Gripen's FCS is 50 degrees now.
  5. Gripen's frontal RCS: about 1/5 of F/A-18C/D's, 1/3 of F-16C/D Block40/42's, and 1/2 of Mirage-2000-5's.
  6. Detective range of PS-05A radar (JAS-39): a little shorter than AN/APG-65/73 (F/A-18C/D), but 20% longer than RDY (M2000-5), and 40% longer than the AN/APG-68 for F-16C/D Block40/42.
  7. While combating with the basic type of MIG-29 (MIG-29G??) in BVR engagement:
    • JAS-39A: the effective range for Gripen to detect MIG-29 is 60 km longer than the effective range for MIG-29 to detect Gripen.
    • M2000-5: the effective range for Mirage to detect MIG-29 is 32 km longer than the effective range for MIG-29 to detect Mirage.
    • F/A-18C/D: the effective range for Hornet to detect MIG-29 is 25 km longer than the effective range for MIG-29 to detect Hornet.
    • F-16C/D: the effective range for Falcon to detect MIG-29 is 5 km longer than the effective range for MIG-29 to detect Falcon.
  8. Maintenance of GRIPEN:
    • The MTBF for JAS-39A is 7.6 flight hours, and the SAAB declared that the MTBF for the USAF's frontline fighters (except F/A-22 perhaps) is no more than 4.1 flight hours.
    • The man hours of maintenance for each flight-hour: 12 man-hours initially, than reduced to 10 man-hours (F/A-18 E/F: 15 man hours of maintenance for each flight-hour).
    • The charge for each flight-hour: 2,500 USD initially, than reduced to 2,000 USD.


F/A-18 is 2 m2, F-16C is 1.2 m2, M2000 is 0.8 m2.

2/5 = 1.2/3 = 0.8/2 = 0.4 m2

LCA is 3 times smaller than M2000. So 0.8/3 = 0.267 m2.

95% of the LCA's surface area is composites. Although it wasn't designed for stealth, its still quite a small aircraft. So the combination of small size and composites has significantly reduced RCS compared to the all-metal Mirage. The LCA Mk1A will see further improvements in RCS.

We are being modest by saying LCA's RCS is 0.5 m2, but we know for sure it's better than Gripen C's 0.4 m2.

Aircraft like LCA, Rafale, Typhoon, Super Hornet and Gripen are called "reduced observable." Meaning, these are aircraft with RCS below 1m2.

The Koreans seem to have invented the term for the KF-21.

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The Koreans have 4 categories.
MIN = Minimum Treatment. This is aircraft like the F-16C/E, J-10C, J-16, JF-17 B3, F-15EX, Su-35S, Su-30MKI, Mig-29M etc.
RO = 0.1 m2 class. Rafale, Typhoon, LCA, Gripen C/E, B-1B, Super Hornet etc. You can see some of these names in the image.
LO = 0.01m2 class. F-117.
VLO = 0.001m2 class.
 
A tailless delta-wing aircraft has a maximum Mach number of 1.6. Anyone with a sense of aerodynamics would laugh their heads off
The Tejas' inlet problems will be the sword of Damocles hanging over his head

The maximum speed is not a problem for LCA. Mach 1.3-1.4 is the most it needs. Top speed is not operationally employable from the locations they are expected to operate from, like 50-150 km from the frontline. So dash speed is meaningless. Plus it's more important for the aircraft to conserve fuel for dogfights.

The distance involved is so small that the enemy cannot make use of their own top speed, or they will risk overshooting. Not to mention the fact that LCA will exclusively operate under the cover of bigger ASFs and SAMs, so the aircraft that's overshot will get attacked.
 
A tailless delta-wing aircraft has a maximum Mach number of 1.6. Anyone with a sense of aerodynamics would laugh their heads off
The Tejas' inlet problems will be the sword of Damocles hanging over his head
Most jet with outer ordnance hardly cross Mach 1.6. Some like F-35, despite IWB, have their top speed capped at the same 1.6 Mach.
 
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