National Security Architecture Reforms & Theatre Commands : Discussions
- Thread starter Himanshu
- Start date
I would like to see three unified geographical commands and 5-6 functional commands.
- East/China Command
- West/Pakistan Command
- South/peninsula Command
- Strategic Force Command
- Special Force command
- Air Defence Command
- Cyber Command
- Space Command
@Milspec @randomradio @vstol Jockey @DivineHeretic @Falcon
Manu Pubby (@manupubby) Tweeted:
Work divided for CDS:
Admin and revenue procurement matters of the armed services to department of military affairs led by Gen Rawat.
Any matters related to defence policy to be dealt by defence secretary.
Work divided for Rawat-led dept of military affairs Manu Pubby on Twitter ( )
Work divided for CDS:
Admin and revenue procurement matters of the armed services to department of military affairs led by Gen Rawat.
Any matters related to defence policy to be dealt by defence secretary.
Work divided for Rawat-led dept of military affairs Manu Pubby on Twitter ( )
Instead of having country specific JTCs I suggest we should form Region specific JTCs.
1 - North-Western JTC covering the area from Uttarakhand ( and adjacent part of Western UP) to Gujarat. Comprising resources from northern and western commands of IA. Same with IAF. It should be commanded by a 4 star general from IAF.
2- Eastern JTC - covering the the area from UP( excluding area covered by NW JTC) to whole NE in East and Orissa to South. Comprising resources from related services.It should be commanded by a 4 star general from IA.
3- Southern or Peninsular JTC covering rest part of country and whole and A&N island chain.It should be commanded by a 4 star general from IN.
The biggest opposition of JTCs is coming from IAF that since it has very thin resources ( eg just 4 AWACs ) hence further dividing them in theatre commands would significantly reduce its capabilities. And in the exercise Gaganshakti IAF has demonstrated it's ability of quickly switching it's resources from western to eastern theatre and vice versa but it would not be possible if the resources will be divided specifically in theatres and hence will have disastrous implications in a two front war scenario .
That is why we should have a JTC specifically oriented towards two front war scenario in form of NW JTCs because this is the only theatre where we will ' actually ' fight a two front war. And if this JTC will be headed by an IAF officer it will enable the quick switch of resources needed to fight the two front war.
Regarding eastern command barring China relationship with all other neighbouring countries is somewhat peaceful and only thing that is needed there is ground vigilance. The border with China will too mostly be dominated by army actions in a case of war since there is no question of naval engagement and given thin border lines limited airforce engagement. Hence an army general should command this JTC.
I don't think I need to explain the working of Peninsular command or why a Navy admiral should command it.
Since the core thought behind making the post of CDS was integration I think that should be followed not only in geographical commands and but also in functional commands. That is why instead of having separate SFC, ADC, SC, CC we should integrate them into one strategic command like US. It will result in a force capable of launching offensives anywhere on the enemy mainland ( probably whole world) and also defending our mainland from enemy strike. Such a coordination is needed as to why I will give only one instance regarding to ADC.
Now if we will have separated Space command then ADC may not be able to use space based sensors ( utterly necessary for intercepting hypersonic cruise missiles) for target acquisition hence less situational awareness. Second if ADC will also have offensive capabilities of SFC then it may compensate the low number of AD assets in an area by launching offensive strikes on enemy weapon systems something not possible if the commands are separated.
Apart from this we should develop a transportation command just like US and a separate Intel agency like DIA solely focussed on providing Intel to armed forces regarding military capabilities of enemy.
You can make multiple setups but war is very unpredictable. Sometimes men get caught, sometimes weather is not in favor or sometimes communication goes missing. The reality is very different.
You may be able to switch the resources quickly, but then weather can hold your actions or some sort of other problems may arise, thus delaying your action. So not just theater commands.
Initially, there should be only 2 geographical commands. North and South. This way air force resources can be used effectively against China and Pakistan.
Once the IAF has enough assets to split between China and Pakistan, this could take as much as 15 years with our current procurement plans, the North command should be split into East, West and Central, with Central being a reserve command.
Or they may not care about IAF's problems and split into East, West, Central and South. And Central may hold all the primary force multipliers and can be shared with the other three commands when necessary, a reserve command. Or just East, West and South.
In the long run, we will need global commands, like Indo-Pacific dealing with East Asia, Indo-Atlantic dealing with Africa/South America, Indo-CAR etc.
There, threw in my 2 paisa.
Hindustan Times (@htTweets) Tweeted:
CDS to oversee all border matters with China, Pakistan
(reports @rahulsinghx)
CDS to oversee all border matters with China, Pakistan Hindustan Times on Twitter ( )
CDS to oversee all border matters with China, Pakistan
(reports @rahulsinghx)
CDS to oversee all border matters with China, Pakistan Hindustan Times on Twitter ( )
Sorry sir, but I failed to get your point.
It is a fact that unexpected situations always arise in a war but I don't know why this should prevent us from restructuring our military for optimal utilisation of our resources.
The great kings & conquerors like Ashok, Kanishka, etc always consulted the astrologers & oracles before getting into wars. They never had NSA , NSC & all that BS.
They mostly relied on Rajpurohits, their small council of ministers & their gut instincts while taking such brave decisions. Mind you their armies were also in their millions.
Look at our situation today. We barely have a million man army and a COAS, a CDS, A defense secretary, A defense minister so many joint, additional principal secretaries & we still cant reach any fruitful decision.
My point is rather restructuring the military commands on the basis of theoretical scenarios, send your men for expedition to small countries and insurgency effected areas. Learn from their experience situation there and then implement in the restructuring.
Not exercises but actual battle. (excluding Afghanistan)
The Pakistanis have served in ME, The americans are there the Russians are there, Chinese have their different presence, British French Canadians, Aussies, every one has served in real battle scenario. India being the second largest force is stuck in Kashmir. I am sure Indian military is not raised to complain about food or sit in mess or cantonments.
What restructuring would do? IAF ended up shooting it's own heli on 27th , this happens due to lack of experience and best of bestest restructuring without any experience will lead to harsh scenarios.
Surya Gangadharan (@SuryaGangadhar6) Tweeted:
Simply Nitin breaks it down, from the China Command to Air Defence & Peninsular Command https://t.co/3MbcFLrYGa @MEAIndia @nitingokhale @sneheshphilip @ParulChandraP @ajaynewsman @amitabhprevi ( )
Simply Nitin breaks it down, from the China Command to Air Defence & Peninsular Command https://t.co/3MbcFLrYGa @MEAIndia @nitingokhale @sneheshphilip @ParulChandraP @ajaynewsman @amitabhprevi ( )
CDS Bipin Rawat focuses on preparing roadmap for creation of an air defence command
By Shaurya Karanbir Gurung
Last Updated: Jan 02, 2020, 07.44 PM IST
Till now air defence command is distributed between all the three services. General Rawat's first priority is to set up an Air Defence Command to secure India from any aerial attack. Indian Air Force plays a major role in air defence but the Indian Army does have its own area air defence system and Indian Navy has a most advanced complex and dynamic air defence system.
General Bipin Rawat
NEW DELHI: In his first meeting after taking over as India’s first Chief of Defence Staff, General Bipin Rawat has directed the Headquarters Integrated Defence Staff to prepare a proposal for creating the first Air Defence Command and prioritised establishing of common logistics support pools for the defence services.
Rawat during the meeting held on Wednesday, also directed the different branch heads to give recommendations for inter-service synergy and jointness. He also emphasised on having a collegiate system of functioning and directed the three defence services- Army, Air force and Navy- and the Coast Guard to be consulted over this. He added that the decisions in this regard will be taken to ensure optimisation of resources. The CDS also added that ‘infructuous’ ceremonial activities, which are manpower intensive, must be cut.
“The CDS directed that a proposal to create Air Defence Command be prepared by June 30, 2020,” a defence ministry issued statement said.
Each service has their individual air defence setup. Experts believe that an Air Defence Command could be tasked with integrating the air defence and assets of the Army, Air Force and Navy and jointly provide air defence cover to the country. This could also lead to regular training with ground forces in simulated combat scenarios. Having such a command could fine tune the system of providing early warning of incoming enemy aircraft and missiles. It could also involve using space assets. It could be on the similar lines of the two tri-services command- the Strategic Forces Command and the Andaman and Nicobar Command.
“He also set out priorities for execution of synergy by June 30 and December, 31 2020. Some of the areas identified for jointness and synergy include creation of common logistics support pools in stations where two or more services have their presence,” according to the statement.
A logistic support pool could be a single depot and base workshop that provides supplies and repair works to the services. This will lead to saving manpower and funds, and avoid wastage.
On having a collegiate system of functioning, “General Rawat directed that all three services and the Coast Guard must be consulted and their views obtained in a time bound manner. Decisions will, however, be taken to ensure optimisation of resources. Efforts will be made to cut out infructuous ceremonial activities, which are manpower intensive,” it said.
The CDS has stressed that all must work towards accomplishing desired results and coming up with healthy views and ideas.
CDS Bipin Rawat focuses on preparing roadmap for creation of an air defence command
By Shaurya Karanbir Gurung
Last Updated: Jan 02, 2020, 07.44 PM IST
Till now air defence command is distributed between all the three services. General Rawat's first priority is to set up an Air Defence Command to secure India from any aerial attack. Indian Air Force plays a major role in air defence but the Indian Army does have its own area air defence system and Indian Navy has a most advanced complex and dynamic air defence system.
General Bipin Rawat
NEW DELHI: In his first meeting after taking over as India’s first Chief of Defence Staff, General Bipin Rawat has directed the Headquarters Integrated Defence Staff to prepare a proposal for creating the first Air Defence Command and prioritised establishing of common logistics support pools for the defence services.
Rawat during the meeting held on Wednesday, also directed the different branch heads to give recommendations for inter-service synergy and jointness. He also emphasised on having a collegiate system of functioning and directed the three defence services- Army, Air force and Navy- and the Coast Guard to be consulted over this. He added that the decisions in this regard will be taken to ensure optimisation of resources. The CDS also added that ‘infructuous’ ceremonial activities, which are manpower intensive, must be cut.
“The CDS directed that a proposal to create Air Defence Command be prepared by June 30, 2020,” a defence ministry issued statement said.
Each service has their individual air defence setup. Experts believe that an Air Defence Command could be tasked with integrating the air defence and assets of the Army, Air Force and Navy and jointly provide air defence cover to the country. This could also lead to regular training with ground forces in simulated combat scenarios. Having such a command could fine tune the system of providing early warning of incoming enemy aircraft and missiles. It could also involve using space assets. It could be on the similar lines of the two tri-services command- the Strategic Forces Command and the Andaman and Nicobar Command.
“He also set out priorities for execution of synergy by June 30 and December, 31 2020. Some of the areas identified for jointness and synergy include creation of common logistics support pools in stations where two or more services have their presence,” according to the statement.
A logistic support pool could be a single depot and base workshop that provides supplies and repair works to the services. This will lead to saving manpower and funds, and avoid wastage.
On having a collegiate system of functioning, “General Rawat directed that all three services and the Coast Guard must be consulted and their views obtained in a time bound manner. Decisions will, however, be taken to ensure optimisation of resources. Efforts will be made to cut out infructuous ceremonial activities, which are manpower intensive,” it said.
The CDS has stressed that all must work towards accomplishing desired results and coming up with healthy views and ideas.
CDS Bipin Rawat focuses on preparing roadmap for creation of an air defence command
India To Get Military Commands In 3 Years, Biggest Restructuring Ever
Each Theatre Command would have an integral Air Force element and depending on the nature of the requirement, additional aircraft could be deployed.
Written by Vishnu Som
Updated: February 04, 2020 08:32 pm IST
New Delhi: In three years from now, India will begin operationalising Military Commands which integrate the operations of the Army, Air Force and Navy, in the biggest restructuring in India's military history.
In a select briefing, his first since he took over as India's first Chief of Defence Staff, General Bipin Rawat said it was his goal to "develop the services as an armed force," integrating capabilities, logistics and manpower within the new Military Commands. The goal is to bring down expenses, rationalise manpower and ensure that the armed forces fight as a cohesive unit.
While the number of commands has not been finalised, the Chief of Defence Staff is looking at the creation of proposals which would result in the creation of a Western Theatre Command, and at least one Northern Theatre Command. An Eastern Theatre Command would likely cover the border areas along the China frontier. The exact number of these Theatre Commands has still not been decided.
In addition to Commands which cover the land frontier against Pakistan and China, India would also have a Peninsula Command , an Air Defence Command and Space Command and a multi-service Logistics Command and Training Command.
Each Theatre Command would have an integral Air Force element and depending on the nature of the requirement, additional aircraft could be deployed.
Significant cost cutting in each Command would be achieved through common stores management, shared bases, maintenance stocks and through the utilisation of similar weapons. "In co-located stations, there is tremendous scope for the management of resources," General Rawat said.
Preliminary discussions have been held between the Chief of Defence Staff and the three service chiefs with the CDS making it clear that it was his intention to begin the process of setting up the Commands within a finite period of time.
High-value military acquisitions, such as a proposed third aircraft carrier for Navy, "depends on how the economy progresses," said General Rawat as this costly acquisition would have "an impact on the other services." The Navy has fought for years for the government to sanction a third made-in-India carrier which would supplement INS Vikramaditya which is in service and INS Vikrant which enters trials soon before being inducted.
Similarly, for the Indian Air Force, the Chief of Defence Staff felt it is important to stagger the purchases of expensive fighter aircraft to ensure higher serviceability. India is looking closely at a deal to acquire 114 fighter aircraft for which a global tender is now under way. "Look at the maintenance cycle," said General Rawat explaining that several newly acquired aircraft would need to be simultaneously serviced if they were acquired within a short period of time. This would mean that many of these assets would be simultaneously out of commission for a period of time. Instead, a system of staggered acquisitions for the Air Force would mean that at least some key operational platforms such as fighters, helicopters and drones would be available while others were being serviced.
Another cost cutting measure would be the indigenous manufacture of ammunition to a very high standard. "If ammunition has a shelf life of ten years, must you stock ammunition for twenty years?" asked the General, pointing out that it was "important to develop surge capacity" in quickly manufacturing ammunition if there was a crisis.
One of the most far reaching proposals, directly linked to the need to cut down on the whopping Rs 1.33 lakh crore pension budget of the Indian Armed forces would be to enable non-officer ranks to be employed till the age of 58. "One third of the Army, I believe, can work till the age of 58," explained General Rawat. At the moment, soldiers in the armed forces are retired between the ages of 37 and 38 as opposed to officers who usually retire at 58. "The pension budget is huge. Is this sustainable?" said the Chief of Defence Staff.
Summing up his immediate priorities, the Chief of Defence Staff said he would try to "minimise wastages", "prevent overstocking" supplies and if possible begin a possibility of "nil stocking" of supplies such as generators and auto components which are immediately available from commercial vendors. "Surplus and deficiencies need to be better managed. Jointmanship and optimisation is the need of the hour," he said.
India To Get Military Commands In 3 Years, Biggest Restructuring Ever
Each Theatre Command would have an integral Air Force element and depending on the nature of the requirement, additional aircraft could be deployed.
Written by Vishnu Som
Updated: February 04, 2020 08:32 pm IST
New Delhi: In three years from now, India will begin operationalising Military Commands which integrate the operations of the Army, Air Force and Navy, in the biggest restructuring in India's military history.
In a select briefing, his first since he took over as India's first Chief of Defence Staff, General Bipin Rawat said it was his goal to "develop the services as an armed force," integrating capabilities, logistics and manpower within the new Military Commands. The goal is to bring down expenses, rationalise manpower and ensure that the armed forces fight as a cohesive unit.
While the number of commands has not been finalised, the Chief of Defence Staff is looking at the creation of proposals which would result in the creation of a Western Theatre Command, and at least one Northern Theatre Command. An Eastern Theatre Command would likely cover the border areas along the China frontier. The exact number of these Theatre Commands has still not been decided.
In addition to Commands which cover the land frontier against Pakistan and China, India would also have a Peninsula Command , an Air Defence Command and Space Command and a multi-service Logistics Command and Training Command.
Each Theatre Command would have an integral Air Force element and depending on the nature of the requirement, additional aircraft could be deployed.
Significant cost cutting in each Command would be achieved through common stores management, shared bases, maintenance stocks and through the utilisation of similar weapons. "In co-located stations, there is tremendous scope for the management of resources," General Rawat said.
Preliminary discussions have been held between the Chief of Defence Staff and the three service chiefs with the CDS making it clear that it was his intention to begin the process of setting up the Commands within a finite period of time.
High-value military acquisitions, such as a proposed third aircraft carrier for Navy, "depends on how the economy progresses," said General Rawat as this costly acquisition would have "an impact on the other services." The Navy has fought for years for the government to sanction a third made-in-India carrier which would supplement INS Vikramaditya which is in service and INS Vikrant which enters trials soon before being inducted.
Similarly, for the Indian Air Force, the Chief of Defence Staff felt it is important to stagger the purchases of expensive fighter aircraft to ensure higher serviceability. India is looking closely at a deal to acquire 114 fighter aircraft for which a global tender is now under way. "Look at the maintenance cycle," said General Rawat explaining that several newly acquired aircraft would need to be simultaneously serviced if they were acquired within a short period of time. This would mean that many of these assets would be simultaneously out of commission for a period of time. Instead, a system of staggered acquisitions for the Air Force would mean that at least some key operational platforms such as fighters, helicopters and drones would be available while others were being serviced.
Another cost cutting measure would be the indigenous manufacture of ammunition to a very high standard. "If ammunition has a shelf life of ten years, must you stock ammunition for twenty years?" asked the General, pointing out that it was "important to develop surge capacity" in quickly manufacturing ammunition if there was a crisis.
One of the most far reaching proposals, directly linked to the need to cut down on the whopping Rs 1.33 lakh crore pension budget of the Indian Armed forces would be to enable non-officer ranks to be employed till the age of 58. "One third of the Army, I believe, can work till the age of 58," explained General Rawat. At the moment, soldiers in the armed forces are retired between the ages of 37 and 38 as opposed to officers who usually retire at 58. "The pension budget is huge. Is this sustainable?" said the Chief of Defence Staff.
Summing up his immediate priorities, the Chief of Defence Staff said he would try to "minimise wastages", "prevent overstocking" supplies and if possible begin a possibility of "nil stocking" of supplies such as generators and auto components which are immediately available from commercial vendors. "Surplus and deficiencies need to be better managed. Jointmanship and optimisation is the need of the hour," he said.
India To Get Military Commands In 3 Years, Biggest Restructuring Ever
Well @randomradio , despite your protestations that the armed forces particularly the IAF wasn't prepared or rather underprepared for jointness or theatre commands, it seems in 3-5 years it's going to be a reality. It seems the top brass of our armed forces were more optimistic about this than you were.
I didn't make the argument, the IAF did. I was the one who said what they are saying is true. Apart from that, I'm a very staunch supporter of creating a Joint Command. I'd in fact say more needs to be done.
True. You didn't make the argument but you certainly justified their stance. On a different note, it Seems to me, Modi is squeezing the armed forces by choking off funds till they agree to right sizing & jointmanship. That our economy is in a bad shape is incidental.
Their stance is perfectly justified. But MoD is going ahead regardless.
Modi doesn't have to do anything of the sort. We really don't have the funds to spare when development is the main agenda.