Sukhoi Su-30MKI

Lolwa said:
Altitude advantage also improves lo aircraft deduction. There's a reason mig 31 continues to remain an extremely potent against lo stealth aircraft and the r-37 is modernisation of the r-33 used on the mig-31.
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Su-30MKI UPG. is going to be our ultimate LO/VLO counter, forming a wall which Chinese jets can't penetrate. It's just not going to be one sole MKI vs one sole J-20, rather with MKI UPG., we'll have "system of systems" approach where one MKI formation maintaing comlplete EMCON, using its BEL Dual-Band IRST & Passive ESM via RWR-NG, along with off-board sensors like AWACS feed, Sat-feed and our complete ground based surveillance feed(which itself would fuse data from our anti-stealth grid fusing PCLR, VHF, S & L band data), would gain full knowledge of inbound J-20s and its brethren. Post which MKI will use thrust of its uprated/indigenised AL-31FP or Item 177S(hopefully), to climb to 21km and lob Astra 2/R-37M/Astra 3 towards Chinese jets at Mach 1.5, forcing them to break their formation and abort their mission.

This will allow IA to pound PLA relentlessly. So, take MKI as our biggest 2-front war ace.
 
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Rajput Lion said:
True, but as the official RFP explicitly stated that the new navigational system "must" work with MKI's full flight envelope of 21kms and 1.5mach, it simply means that MKI, thanks to its raw thrust and superlative aerodynamics can sustain a level-flight at that altitude, which simply is astounding. 21kms is Mig-31 territory, IMO.

R-37M, if launched by MKI at 21kms, Mach 1.5, will reach its full range of 400kms and then some expanding our A2/AD bubble substantially looking at MKI's launch vectors and kinematics.
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All 4th gen ASFs can do this.

But to manage sustained presence at such an altitude, you need a pressure suit, which the Mig-31 pilots normally wear but other 4th gens don't. WIth G-suit, you cannot stay up there for more than a minute or two. The minute you cross 50000 feet, the ability to breathe starts diminishing greatly.
 
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randomradio said:
All 4th gen ASFs can do this.
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Zoom climb to 70k feet? Maybe or maybe not. But.......
randomradio said:
But to manage sustained presence at such an altitude, you need a pressure suit, which the Mig-31 pilots normally wear but other 4th gens don't. WIth G-suit, you cannot stay up there for more than a minute or two. The minute you cross 50000 feet, the ability to breathe starts diminishing greatly.
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But the point here is not zoom climb or pressure suit etc. The point here is what @vstol Jockey alluded to years ago that a jet's service ceiling is ONLY just a paper number. The maximum operating ceiling is much higher. The official MOD RFP has just given us a hint of what MKI's max operational ceiling(in a level sustained flight) might be.

Rest, I concur with your points👍
 
Rajput Lion said:
Zoom climb to 70k feet? Maybe or maybe not. But.......

But the point here is not zoom climb or pressure suit etc. The point here is what @vstol Jockey alluded to years ago that a jet's service ceiling is ONLY just a paper number. The maximum operating ceiling is much higher. The official MOD RFP has just given us a hint of what MKI's max operational ceiling(in a level sustained flight) might be.

Rest, I concur with your points👍
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Exceeding the service ceiling is well known publicly. It's not called "service ceiling."

F-16, J-10, Mig-29, Typhoon, Rafale, Flankers, and Eagle can fly at 70000 feet.

In fact, these jets need pilots wearing full pressure suits by default to get to such altitudes. You can't go up there without it.

Without OBOGS, standard ceiling is 50k feet. With OBOGS and a half-pressure suit it can go up to 60k feet, but flight limit is no more than 10-15 minutes. At this altitude, even with OBOGS the pilot wheezes when breathing. So yoou need a full pressure suit at this altitude, basically a space suit with the large helmet.
 
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randomradio said:
Exceeding the service ceiling is well known publicly. It's not called "service ceiling."

F-16, J-10, Mig-29, Typhoon, Rafale, Flankers, and Eagle can fly at 70000 feet.

In fact, these jets need pilots wearing full pressure suits by default to get to such altitudes. You can't go up there without it.

Without OBOGS, standard ceiling is 50k feet. With OBOGS and a half-pressure suit it can go up to 60k feet, but flight limit is no more than 10-15 minutes. At this altitude, even with OBOGS the pilot wheezes when breathing. So yoou need a full pressure suit at this altitude, basically a space suit with the large helmet.
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MKI UPG. should have OBOGS, so a time-limited zoom climb to launch BVRs at that altitude is a given, post which it'll crank and dive to lower altitudes to defend itself. Full Pressure suit is only required if flies at that height for longer durations which in the given context simply won't happen. Full Pressure Suit is to prevent any mishap if pilot has to eject. Thin air and low temperature would instantly boil the human blood and kill the pilots.
 
Rajput Lion said:
MKI UPG. should have OBOGS, so a time-limited zoom climb to launch BVRs at that altitude is a given, post which it'll crank and dive to lower altitudes to defend itself. Full Pressure suit is only required if flies at that height for longer durations which in the given context simply won't happen. Full Pressure Suit is to prevent any mishap if pilot has to eject. Thin air and low temperature would instantly boil the human blood and kill the pilots.
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Pilots are not allowed to zoom climb beyond 60000 feet without full pressure suits.
 
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randomradio said:
Pilots are not allowed to zoom climb beyond 60000 feet without full pressure suits.
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If pilots are not allowed to cross 60k feet, then official MOD RFP wouldn't have mentioned requirement of navigational system working with MKI's "full flight-envelope of 21kms and Mach 1.5 ." 'Nuff said.
 
Rajput Lion said:
If pilots are not allowed to cross 60k feet, then official MOD RFP wouldn't have mentioned requirement of navigational system working with MKI's "full flight-envelope of 21kms and Mach 1.5 ." 'Nuff said.
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As I said, that's for a very short time. Just enough to fire your missiles, but you have to quickly fall back to below 40,000 feet to breathe normally again.

Only with a full pressure suit can you breathe normally during level flight at higher altitudes.

Demilitarized altitude record is over 120,000 feet for the Su-27.
 
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HJzSdUMbsAADLOY


Source
 
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Shan said:
Does anyone have the source for this claim? If you have the link for the original report, please link it. Thanks.

https://twitter.com/x/status/2061648171059876147
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Most of the weapons we procure from Russia would slip under the radar especially until the Ukraine war is over.

Regarding this 300 unit being too low? This is how IAF does its thing. First batch will be just like that. Then if IAF finds the missile impressive, more units shall be procured later(just like S-400).
 
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