Ukraine - Russia Conflict

Western armies have more infantry, which is why the armies are big. The Russians are replacing their infantry with heavy weapons. Like the newest one is the BMPT Terminator, which is meant to replace a BMP-2 and its 7 troops. The BMPT needs a crew of 5, whereas a BMP-2 is packed with 10, so they cut down their manpower requirements by half with slightly higher initial costs.

The manpower required for logistics isn't a lot. A lot of the increase in efficiency has more to do with transportation than manpower.

An Abrams BCT has 90 tanks, 150 Bradleys and 45 M113s. A Bradley carries 6 troops and the M113 carries, say, 12. So the infantry support is about 1500. Otoh, 3 tank BTGs are needed for 90 tanks, and they are supported by a total of just 30 IFVs carrying 7 troops each, that's 210 troops. A ratio of well over 7:1. This is where the Russians separate themselves from Western armies.

It's the Russians that are aiming for more automation on the ground than anyone else, 'cause of their population problems. Future Russian units could become even smaller with the addition of new weapons like the BMPT.

In any case, precision weapons are mainly carried by artillery. Compared to an Abrams unit, the 3 BTGs would have just 2x the amount of artillery. So, at worst, the Russian unit will just need an extra guy for each gun or the crews will have to work a little bit harder. If you work fast enough, 3 guys can load a howitzer with some 40 shells in a matter of minutes. So you are exaggerating the problem.



As of today, the jury's still out. We will know only once they start mass production. They plan on building 100 Felons a year. So that speaks volumes about their confidence in it. They plan on starting off with 24 a year initially. No clue about the Armata yet, let's see what they decide in a year or two.
Funny, 8 months earlier you were explaining why Russian tanks did so badly. Because they didn't have enough infantry to protect them. So which is it?
 

1666084245977.png
 
No, they absolutely don't have the competence. They did not have it during the Soviet era, and they have it even less now. They never managed to keep up with the West's electronics, in terms of performances and reliability, and their uncompetitive domestic industry simply died off once they got access to Western electronics.

That's not how it works.

Competence is not the same as competitive. The Russians cannot compete with a Western electronics factory for the open market, but they can manufacture what they need on their own, even if it's more expensive.

So what costs $1000 to manufacture in France at million units a year for vehicles could cost $10000 in Russia. But they only need it for 20000 or 30000 vehicles over many years instead of for millions of cars in just a year. So they only need competence.

Powerful countries have the ability to manufacture everything they need in small quantities required for war. You are applying middle class logic to the rich. A multi-millionaire wouldn't mind paying $100000 for something he needs desperately, like a new life-saving medicine, when a middle class guy has to wait for it to come down to $1000 before he can afford it.
 
What? A Ukrainian terrorist infiltrated your airbase in the middle of a war and stole a fighter bomber? And I thought Top Gun Maverick was a little unrealistic.


That's not how it works.

Competence is not the same as competitive. The Russians cannot compete with a Western electronics factory for the open market, but they can manufacture what they need on their own, even if it's more expensive.

So what costs $1000 to manufacture in France at million units a year for vehicles could cost $10000 in Russia. But they only need it for 20000 or 30000 vehicles over many years instead of for millions of cars in just a year. So they only need competence.

Powerful countries have the ability to manufacture everything they need in small quantities required for war. You are applying middle class logic to the rich. A multi-millionaire wouldn't mind paying $100000 for something he needs desperately, like a new life-saving medicine, when a middle class guy has to wait for it to come down to $1000 before he can afford it.
So why are they buying drones from Iran?
 
Yes, but because of corruption the inventory is wrong: winter equipment is in the inventory but cannot be found, tanks in reserve are no longer usable because expensive equipment has been taken away, hardware has rotted in abandonment, bullet-proof vests are not up to military standards and are in a terrible state, and the mobilized troops have to buy their equipment if they do not want to be deprived in battle.

Could be true, could be false. The problem is we don't know.

Post Galwan, June, we got everything we needed for the winter in a matter of months, in very large quantities, from scratch. Otoh, if it is as you say and corruption has eaten away their supplies, even they can work from scratch and get everything they need very quickly. It's just infantry gear.

Different story for heavy equipment, like tanks. That will take time, if 7 months is not enough. But you can bet the lack of infantry gear is just propaganda. It can scare newly mobilised troops and force them to waste money, but that's about it. By next month, you can bet they will be wearing their winter gear and this propaganda will be forgotten.
 
That's not how it works.

Competence is not the same as competitive. The Russians cannot compete with a Western electronics factory for the open market, but they can manufacture what they need on their own, even if it's more expensive.
To manufacture stuff, you need factories, and skilled workers. Russia has neither.

Russia has neither because what it had from the Soviet era was not competitive and therefore closed down.

So if they want to manufacture what they need on their own, they have to restart the whole industry, from scratch. This is not something you can do in a week or even in a month. Especially in a terminally corrupt society like Russia where companies are very good at promising, very good at billing, and very bad at delivering.

This is also why I don't believe in the Armata and Felon.
 
  • Like
Reactions: BMD
Your two attack corps will be equipped with 900 tanks and 900 IFVs, but on the front line you also have to replace the material losses, it is not enough to replace the men. Oryx has updated its list of losses to 1393 lost tanks and more than 2500 infantry vehicles, so in total more than 2293 tanks and 3400 IFV are needed.

Any offensive will be over within a week or two, the losses posted on Oryx are over 7 months of Russian uselessness due to their lack of offensive punch.

Putin needed the excuse necessary for mobilisation and he got it. Now the question is how seriously they will continue to take the war. It's all about speed after that.

A lot of the material losses will be made up by Ukr abandoning their equipment too. Those 2 strike corps will earn them a lot of prisoners via encirclement. Which is also why the West is now prepared to send Ukr air defence in a hurry. You can bet they know what's coming in the summer. 300000 troops is too much for Ukr to handle.

The long term issues will not make it worth it, especially if Russia and China start supporting Iran with money and tech. Israel is better off staying neutral.
 
According to some unconfirmed sources doing rounds is that when russia laid siege to kiev , ukraine came forward to hold talks based on condition russia lift the siege for any talks to be held. Russians agreed as their dis-organized siege was not doing great on the ground due to ineffective co-ordination with miles long queue. They more or less thought they had the joker on the table and pulled back troops to organize themselves. Meanwhile joker jumped of the table as his western backers dint want any negotiations.

The troop pull-out was timed well with the Crimean land bridge. So it may not be the whole truth. The Russians were asking for a bit too much as well, like the removal of Zelensky and breaking Ukraine up. Zelensky wasn't a career politician either, so the usual rules of diplomacy wouldn't have worked. And we know for a fact the West isn't interested in peace in Ukr.

The Russian siege was weak as well, not enough numbers. A large part was bogged down in Sumy and Chernihiv. If they had enough numbers, they would have stayed much longer and we would have seen the Ukr troops in the cauldrons surrendering after a point. To make matters worse, the Russians didn't use their air force.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: RASALGHUL
This is also why I don't believe in the Armata and Felon.
T -14 and SU-57 are going to be produced by experience companies like uralvagonzavord and UAC ( Sukhoi+Mikhoyan gurevich).
Both of these Companies have excellent record of ( T - series tank , flanker series, MIG series ) Designing and producing Top quality defense products.
 
Funny, 8 months earlier you were explaining why Russian tanks did so badly. Because they didn't have enough infantry to protect them. So which is it?

The BTGs went into Ukr without full strength because they needed conscripts to get to full strength.

A lot more info has come out since then. A lot of offensives were not backed by reserves, so the Russians had to constantly back off after taking a position due to lack of relief. I mean, soldiers are not machines, they can't stay on the frontline indefinitely without food and sleep.

Plus the Russians were not fighting using the same tactics that they would have used had they been fighting at full strength, with reserve forces, and with more leeway. There were too many constraints, which the Ukrs used effectively with their larger numbers. So this also affected Russian morale on the ground.

Furthermore, the Russians have more or less been fighting a defensive war after the land bridge was established, while using militias and PMC for offensives, like conquering Luhansk. This has helped them preserve their forces quite well relative to the Ukrs who have been throwing bodies at the Russians.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: jetray
The long term issues will not make it worth it, especially if Russia and China start supporting Iran with money and tech. Israel is better off staying neutral.
I don't know about it.
Iran will become much more powerful and it will remain a die-hard enemy of Israel.
GCC-Israel tie is just to contain IRAN. There Is no friendship in between them.
If I was Israel, I will definitely do whatever it is to sabotage Iranian growth as long as possible.
 
So why are they buying drones from Iran?

The Russians don't have very good drone programs that are at a lower tech level, like kamikaze drones like the Harop. They had programs in the works for propeller drones, but like India, they are behind some of the more established countries.

And they didn't chase after these drones because they are not very useful against peer adversaries. They put money into more important stuff like the Okhotnik.
 
To manufacture stuff, you need factories, and skilled workers. Russia has neither.

Russia has neither because what it had from the Soviet era was not competitive and therefore closed down.

So if they want to manufacture what they need on their own, they have to restart the whole industry, from scratch. This is not something you can do in a week or even in a month. Especially in a terminally corrupt society like Russia where companies are very good at promising, very good at billing, and very bad at delivering.

This is also why I don't believe in the Armata and Felon.

There's unlikely to be any problems when it comes to heavy engineering. Their MKI family deliveries have been over 600 in the last 2 decades, with India having manufactured only 60 of those. And they have exported 1000+ T-90s outside India in just the last decade.

They only lack a self-sufficient civilian industry. You can't conflate the two.
 
🤣 your selective amensia on west's role in fostering these jihadi's is pretty amusing. west & their jihadi chums fight each other and they want some useful idiots to help them fix it? thats your so called ally pakistan.
The talibans are the children of Afghan refugees who settled in Pakistan and were indoctrinated in Pakistan's jihad madrasas of the JUI. They are therefore ultimately the responsibility of the USSR, since without their coup and subsequent invasion of Afghanistan, the Talibans would never have existed in the first place. The USA are responsible for funding Pakistan to train them, though, I'll grant you that.
 
T -14 and SU-57 are going to be produced by experience companies like uralvagonzavord and UAC ( Sukhoi+Mikhoyan gurevich).
Both of these Companies have excellent record of ( T - series tank , flanker series, MIG series ) Designing and producing Top quality defense products.
There's a reason they're sending T-62 into battle instead of the Armata. We're in 2022, they were supposed to have hundreds of them by now; that was the plan back in 2015 when the invincible supertank was introduced to the world by breaking down during the Moscow parade... Surprise, surprise, they always had a convenient excuse to push back the production by one year or two, every year... and now they can't produce anything anymore because, surprise surprise, they can't make their own components and without Western tech, the Armata or even the T90 cannot be built.
 
There's a reason they're sending T-62 into battle instead of the Armata. We're in 2022, they were supposed to have hundreds of them by now; that was the plan back in 2015 when the invincible supertank was introduced to the world by breaking down during the Moscow parade... Surprise, surprise, they always had a convenient excuse to push back the production by one year or two, every year... and now they can't produce anything anymore because, surprise surprise, they can't make their own components and without Western tech, the Armata or even the T90 cannot be built.

According to the General Staff of the Armed Forces of Ukraine...

According to Xi Jinping, Dassault has stopped production of the Rafale?
 
  • Agree
Reactions: RASALGHUL