Chinese Missile Systems : Discussions
- Thread starter Himanshu
- Start date
@Innominate, @randomradio, @jetray, @Amarante, @Picdelamirand-oil, @Bon Plan, @RASALGHUL
www.businessinsider.com
US intel shows China's army had missiles filled with water instead of fuel in a corruption scandal that led to Xi's military purge: Bloomberg
US intelligence also indicated that entire fields of missile silos in Western China used lids that posed problems for launch, Bloomberg reported.
www.businessinsider.com
@Innominate, @randomradio, @jetray, @Amarante, @Picdelamirand-oil, @Bon Plan, @RASALGHUL
US intel shows China's army had missiles filled with water instead of fuel in a corruption scandal that led to Xi's military purge: Bloomberg
US intelligence also indicated that entire fields of missile silos in Western China used lids that posed problems for launch, Bloomberg reported.
Yeah, I read this when it came out. I have a theory. CCP probably launched an investigation into corruption as part of pre-war preparations that the Russians failed to do before the Ukraine invasion. So this revelation must be a byproduct of the investigation.
It's unfortunate that the Ukraine war has led authoritarian regimes to clamp down on corruption before wars, instead of the West leveraging this advantage during a hot war.
@LX1111
Do you understand now the risk of PLA generals surrendering without a fight in a major war? If corruption is widespread enough that many weapons have been rendered useless, then giving up becomes an option.
The reusable air defence system that could protect China from hypersonic weapons
Chinese engineers say they’ve solved a big problem that could allow major advances in air defence.www.scmp.com
This is the one of the objectives of PAK DP. It's being designed to intercept hypersonic CMs, BMs and even satellites.
To be honest, I find it difficult to understand what adding water instead of fuel means in Chinese ballistic missile forces. Only the soon to be retired DF-5B is still using liquid fuel. And it uses highly toxic and corrosive UDMH ,it is only injected into the missile 20 minutes before launch. Moreover, the author of this article clearly lacks a certain understanding of corruption. In an industrial country like China. The most common way of corruption is to spend 100000 to buy a ton of fuel. Then write 1 million on the invoice. This way you can get 900000. Instead of spending 100000 to buy water. Because of this, you can only get 100000.
Last edited:
I suspect that the original text seen by Bloomberg is.在导弹相关的东西注水。并试图掩盖。Then these people who are completely ignorant of Chinese understand it as adding water to a missile instead of fuel. Then the cover of the missile launch well cannot be opened. His original intention should be. Fraudulent pricing of missile related projects. And being dishonest in the face of investigations . It is a common saying in Chinese, and journalists who have a limited understanding of Chinese do not understand its meaning at all.
Last edited:
The report doesn't mention anything about the type of missile used. Some types of cruise missiles are liquid too.
Even if DF-5A is retired, the DF-5B and C are new. And it's estimated that at least 60-130 warheads are assigned to the entire DF-5 family.
If the PLARF is corrupt to the point of sacrificing capabilities, then China cannot even fight wars let alone win. The purges are real though, that's the point.
The exact nature of the crime isn't the issue, the people involved are.
Replacing fuel with water is clickbait, but generals and the defense minister getting arrested and prosecuted is the main news.
Xi Jinping is purging China's military — and it could disrupt its race to catch up to the US
Xi Jinping recently axed nine senior military officers, including three from the PLA's Rocket Force, Reuters reported.
www.businessinsider.in
Based on the currently available intelligence. The vast majority of solid launch wells are filled with DF41. Currently, only DF-5B has been announced, and DF-5A was phased out as early as the 1980s. I doubt any rationality in assigning warheads to the DF-5 series. Moreover, the fuel itself should be injected 20 minutes before launch. If injected too early, it can cause serious leakage problems. The biggest issue with this Bloomberg article is. There is no room for corruption in the aspects he mentioned. These seem to be just Western propaganda gimmicks. I can only say that this journalist has rich imagination and almost zero understanding of reality
I think the factors of factional struggle within the military should be greater than simple corruption factors. Of course, it is always good to be able to dismiss corrupt officials. I remember a French newspaper reported that Dassault had paid a rebate of 14.6 million euros to an intermediary of the Indian government. The Indian government refused to investigate this matter.The exact nature of the crime isn't the issue, the people involved are.
Replacing fuel with water is clickbait, but generals and the defense minister getting arrested and prosecuted is the main news.
Xi Jinping is purging China's military — and it could disrupt its race to catch up to the US
Xi Jinping recently axed nine senior military officers, including three from the PLA's Rocket Force, Reuters reported.
It's a problem if there are factional struggles in the PLARF. All other service wings are fine, but CMC should have a lot of power over the PLARF already. If nuclear forces are compromised, it means the most important organization of a nuclear power is being run by third-rate people. This should be unthinkable.
It was quite funny. When the news came out, Congress attacked the BJP for it. Later it turned out the "corruption" happened under the Congress regime during the 126-jet deal.
The allegations had nothing to do with the separate 36-jet deal.
Anyway, this is not corruption, it's just foreign companies using brokers to fund meetings. It was "illegal" in India, but it's legal everywhere else, so it was eventually made legal. But until it became legal, they used to launder the brokerage funds. Now the OEMs have to register their brokers with the govt with invoices and such. It's like going through a real estate agent if you want to buy a house.
This has nothing to do with the political situation in India. Not even related to domestic courts in India. The entire investigation was driven by France. Including French courts and prosecution agencies.It was quite funny. When the news came out, Congress attacked the BJP for it. Later it turned out the "corruption" happened under the Congress regime during the 126-jet deal.
The allegations had nothing to do with the separate 36-jet deal.
Anyway, this is not corruption, it's just foreign companies using brokers to fund meetings. It was "illegal" in India, but it's legal everywhere else, so it was eventually made legal. But until it became legal, they used to launder the brokerage funds. Now the OEMs have to register their brokers with the govt with invoices and such. It's like going through a real estate agent if you want to buy a house
At present, only. Several senior military officers and leaders of some military departments have been dismissed from their positions. No one is clear about the specific reason. Most of the deductions you make are unfounded guesses.
This has nothing to do with the political situation in India. Not even related to domestic courts in India. The entire investigation was driven by France. Including French courts and prosecution agencies.
I know. It's irrelevant to India though.
I didn't make any guesses. All I'm saying is PLARF should have people with more integrity. Meaning, there shouldn't be any corruption issues or dismissals from nuclear forces.
Basically people who work in PLARF must be flawless. Same for the nuclear forces from other countries.
But if you find scandals even in what's supposed to be your best organization, then that speaks volumes about the quality of people in all other Chinese organizations.
@Innominate, @randomradio, @jetray, @Amarante, @Picdelamirand-oil, @Bon Plan, @RASALGHUL
US intel shows China's army had missiles filled with water instead of fuel in a corruption scandal that led to Xi's military purge: Bloomberg
US intelligence also indicated that entire fields of missile silos in Western China used lids that posed problems for launch, Bloomberg reported.
US intel shows .....
why should any one believe this? has this been reported by any other neutral source? There might be corruption in chinese military but creating cock & bull stories out of it will fool none.
The same intelligence saying than a chinese SSN was lost this summer ?@Innominate, @randomradio, @jetray, @Amarante, @Picdelamirand-oil, @Bon Plan, @RASALGHUL
US intel shows China's army had missiles filled with water instead of fuel in a corruption scandal that led to Xi's military purge: Bloomberg
US intelligence also indicated that entire fields of missile silos in Western China used lids that posed problems for launch, Bloomberg reported.
There was a subsequent purge of the military, so make your own mind up.
Sandbox goes in depth about this.
I believe it doesn't change anything. Xi is now replacing these people with his own yes-men which is just as bad specially during war. I think the PLA corruption is worse than Russia's and would have been exposed like Russia was/is if they attacked Taiwan only difference is Taiwan actually has a modern military and teeth to strike the mainland many times. Conservatively this is going to take Xi a decade to root out corruption to the point where it won't fare as bad as Russia's military has in Ukraine but only if Xi does it right by putting non yes-men and people of merit which means putting people that aren't political "friendly" which we know that won't happened. Meanwhile Taiwan will only get better in its defenses and offensive capabilities.
This is how bad it is for China's military in any invasion of Taiwan... Imagine if Ukraine had Taiwan's military capabilities? Meaning its air force, navy and cruise missile capabilities. Russia's current frontline map would totally look different. I don't see China's conventional capability any different from Russia's pre-war. Pre-war Russian military looked very pretty and capable on camera and parades just like China's military does difference is China not only would be taking on a competent Taiwan military but US, Nippon and Australia's navy and air force.
Never underestimate your enemy. US must pound China with full fury when the push comes to shove. And by the looks of it, that time may be rapidly approaching...