A Little Banter - Thread

[Shajida Khan]

You copied Russian cryo-stage design. The access to Russian rocket technology came first.

I have never heard Russians complaining that India copied their cryo-stage.

We started from scratch, we didn't even have access to Nazi rocket scientists like Russia and the US.

And UK failed miserably. When US was sending men to moon, you were failing at putting mere 100 KG toy satellite in LEO. Actually your first and only successful launches to LEO came in 1971.

You spent decades wasting money and now that it looks profitable again, we're rejoining. This is investment strategy. You invest in things that are profitable.

No, it is not investment strategy. You will take more than a decade to develop ability to even launch a half way decent load to LEO, lets not even talk about GEO. This has nothing to do with having great universities etc. It has everything to do with having massive supply chain to support space technology. In a nutshell it is an engineering problem and not a science one. Universities can help with science but to construct capabilities you need massive engineering effort. And, as you claim you are starting from scratch, it will be harder.

An investment strategy is to invest when things are cheap and to build capability when no one else is even thinking about it. Right now, you will have to compete with likes of Blue Origin for same man-power and scientific talent. You will be paying MORE. Not to mention, by the time your first launcher comes online, many more competitors will be in the market. This is exact opposite of a successful investment.

Infact, what is worse is that UK went for Brexit which essentially now throws British scientists out of Gallileo project points the unplanned nature of British affairs. If you were wise, you would have started your space vehicle and satellite development in earnest in 2010, when opinion polls have started showing shifting British sentiments about staying in EU. Here is YouGOV opinion polls starting from 2010. It was clear that sooner than later British will push for leaving EU.

http://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.ne...kh/YG-Archives-Pol-Trackers-Europe-220113.pdf

To add insult to the injury, British actually financed ESA's space development.
British space programme - Wikipedia

The UK Space Agency provides 9.9% of the European Space Agency budget.[9]

In 1985 the British National Space Centre (BNSC) was formed to coordinate UK space activities.[6]

This is exact opposite of a prudent investment. Paying development costs but not developing your own capabilities.

India has been in this market for way way longer and has saved substantially and has become self-reliant. MCTR prohibited Russia/USSR to supply us cryo-upper stage and at one point of time in 90s Indian space program was held hostage to lack of upper stage cryo-technology. India has overcome that. Right now, India is making money on its space capability and has its own complete space industry and launching capabilities.

You were left with 18th century standards because you were thick.

There was a space launch technology in 18th century? You learn new things each day....

Says the guy from a nation which has entire space program filled with failures and aborted projects.

British space programme - Wikipedia

Zircon was cancelled by Chancellor Nigel Lawson on grounds of its cost in 1987.

This was named Black Prince, but the project was cancelled in 1960 due to lack of funding.

Blue Streak rockets continued to be launched as the first stage of the European Europa carrier rocket until Europa's cancellation in 1972.

By 1972, UK government funding of both Blue Streak (missile) and Black Arrow had ceased, and no further government-backed British space rockets were developed.

The official national space programme was revived in 1982 when the British government funded the HOTOL project, an ambitious attempt at a re-usable space plane using air-breathing rocket engines designed by Alan Bond. Work was begun by British Aerospace. However, having classified the engine design as 'top secret' the government then ended funding for the project, terminating it.

The British probe Beagle 2, sent as part of the ESA's Mars Express to study the planet Mars, was lost when it failed to respond but has recently been found by NASA's Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter and it has been concluded while it did land successfully, one of the solar arrays failed to deploy blocking communication antenna.

Seems like you cancelled more than you developed. No wonder you have nothing to show!

To end, I will leave you with this news item from yesterday...

India’s PSLV rocket successfully puts into orbit two UK satellites

India’s PSLV rocket successfully puts into orbit two UK satellites

India on Sunday night successfully put into orbit two British earth observation satellites, NovaSAR and S1-4, in copy book style. Two satellites aboard the Indian rocket – Polar Satellite Launch Vehicle (PSLV) – belonged to Surrey Satellite Technologies Ltd (SSTL), UK. The satellites were put into sun synchronous orbit under commercial arrangement with Antrix Corp Ltd, the commercial arm of the Indian Space Research Organisation (ISRO), the Indian space agency. The total lift off weight of the two satellites was 889 kg.

This was a completely commercial launch for Antrix and ISRO.

 

[BMD]

I have never heard Russians complaining that India copied their cryo-stage.


And UK failed miserably. When US was sending men to moon, you were failing at putting mere 100 KG toy satellite in LEO. Actually your first and only successful launches to LEO came in 1971.


No, it is not investment strategy. You will take more than a decade to develop ability to even launch a half way decent load to LEO, lets not even talk about GEO. This has nothing to do with having great universities etc. It has everything to do with having massive supply chain to support space technology. In a nutshell it is an engineering problem and not a science one. Universities can help with science but to construct capabilities you need massive engineering effort. And, as you claim you are starting from scratch, it will be harder.

An investment strategy is to invest when things are cheap and to build capability when no one else is even thinking about it. Right now, you will have to compete with likes of Blue Origin for same man-power and scientific talent. You will be paying MORE. Not to mention, by the time your first launcher comes online, many more competitors will be in the market. This is exact opposite of a successful investment.

Infact, what is worse is that UK went for Brexit which essentially now throws British scientists out of Gallileo project points the unplanned nature of British affairs. If you were wise, you would have started your space vehicle and satellite development in earnest in 2010, when opinion polls have started showing shifting British sentiments about staying in EU. Here is YouGOV opinion polls starting from 2010. It was clear that sooner than later British will push for leaving EU.

http://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.ne...kh/YG-Archives-Pol-Trackers-Europe-220113.pdf

To add insult to the injury, British actually financed ESA's space development.
British space programme - Wikipedia




This is exact opposite of a prudent investment. Paying development costs but not developing your own capabilities.

India has been in this market for way way longer and has saved substantially and has become self-reliant. MCTR prohibited Russia/USSR to supply us cryo-upper stage and at one point of time in 90s Indian space program was held hostage to lack of upper stage cryo-technology. India has overcome that. Right now, India is making money on its space capability and has its own complete space industry and launching capabilities.


There was a space launch technology in 18th century? You learn new things each day....

Says the guy from a nation which has entire space program filled with failures and aborted projects.

British space programme - Wikipedia














Seems like you cancelled more than you developed. No wonder you have nothing to show!

To end, I will leave you with this news item from yesterday...

India’s PSLV rocket successfully puts into orbit two UK satellites

India’s PSLV rocket successfully puts into orbit two UK satellites



This was a completely commercial launch for Antrix and ISRO.

No because they knew you copied it. Every deal with India is a ToT deal.

And what was India doing in 1971 exactly. Ah yes the Gujarat riots. Just one of many massacres in post-colonial India.

I think you'll find they do engineering at universities too. And since when has India been better than the UK at engineering anything? Cars - no. Planes - no. Jet engines - no. Bridges - no. Tunnels - no. Buildings - no.

Won't have to compete with anyone. We're out of the EU, yay protectionism. UK first.

Yes, we financed a lot in the EU, now all that money will be ours to finance our own space program.

Yes, unlike you we cancel space programs in favour of a prosperous society. So what?

18th Century comment - You claimed the UK left India with 18th Century technology, it actually left you with 19th Century technology at worst. Before it came you had 11th Century technology and were burning widows and marrying children. I would call the abolition of the aforementioned and 19th century technology good progress for 2 centuries. But you would have done it anyway? What? Like Afghanistan did?

 

[Shajida Khan]

No because they knew you copied it. Every deal with India is a ToT deal.

And whats your problem with that Mr. Prudent We-Didnt-Do-Space-Research-Because-It-Was-Expensive?
You want to be prudent not to waste money, make a comfortable society and yet to reinvent the wheel, waste money in developing basic 100 KG to LEO 'from the scratch', abondon that, asked other to help you with your 'effort', left that, put money in EU's space capabilities, left EU with possibly no deal. Somehow, your pretense of prudence and your reality of leaving things halfway after making expense does not reconcile.

And what was India doing in 1971 exactly. Ah yes the Gujarat riots. Just one of many massacres in post-colonial India.

Many things! To name a few :-
1. Fighting a war to make certain that India is not stuck in a pincer attack from east and west.
2. Implementing green revolution to defuse the population bomb.
3. Developing nuclear research and development infrastructure. This yielded in India getting nuclear weapons in '74.
All while making great progress in space program.

BTW, India's budget for ISRO, currently is 1.7 billion dollars and thats its highest budget. Indian government's revenue is 560 billion dollars. Thats (1.7/560)*100 = 0.3035% of Indian government's revenue. BTW 1.7 billion USD are 1 billion GBP, historically. For a comparison, India's Food security program has a budget of 21 billion dollars.

Yes, unlike you we cancel space programs in favour of a prosperous society. So what?

No it is more like, instead of spending money on space research, which is a strategic technology, you were busy in wasting money. Read on....

Here are expenditures done by British government which were un-needed and could have funded British space program, many times over. After all British are all about 'Prudence'.


£120billion of your money down the drain EVERY year: The astonishing Whitehall waste that could send every British family on an annual luxury holiday | Daily Mail Online

• £15 billion on duplicated procurement across Whitehall departments and councils.
• The Home Office spent £427,000 on rubber bullets police are not even allowed to use.
• About £5billion was paid out in benefits to claimants with an income in excess of £100,000, while £1.2billion was paid out in an annual subsidy to foreign farmers through the EU’s Common Agricultural Policy.
• The TaxPayers’ Alliance suggests £2.9billion could be saved by scrapping the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills and Department for Culture, Media and Sport and hiving off their essential functions to other departments.

And that year 2011-12 only. Just one year was enough to fund your space program, something that has been cancelled so many times. Just one god damn year.

And then you talk about Prudence and good sense in spending. Your government is going to wasted money of the tune GBP 205 billion in Trident replacement.

Lifetime cost of replacing Trident is at least £205bn, latest estimate suggests

In one year, they procured 30 billion GBP worth of new subs for British nuclear missiles. If they had delayed it by one more year, they could have funded the space program for 10 years at least.

Not to mention, UK does not exactly have any major enemies like China or Russia which could attack it with nuclear weapons.

The Truth is: Space was never a priority for British Government till it became an absolute priority due to an unplanned and messy Brexit. British are not exactly the most planned folks they want you to believe. Heck, British were sleeping on the wheel as far as space front is concerned! The lack of funding is a mere pretext.

 

[Shajida Khan]

I think you'll find they do engineering at universities too. And since when has India been better than the UK at engineering anything? Cars - no. Planes - no. Jet engines - no. Bridges - no. Tunnels - no. Buildings - no.

Space : Yes.

And remember green lumber fallacy.

The Green Lumber Fallacy: The Difference between Talking and Doing

The Green Lumber Fallacy: The Difference between Talking and Doing

Won't have to compete with anyone. We're out of the EU, yay protectionism. UK first.

Well, all that money is in launching for others. Launching your own sats is fine and dandy, it saves money. But it does not get you more money. If you want to get more money you have to do it for others as well. India is doing that. I doubt UK will be ever able to do it. Simply, if you celebrate protectionism, you cann't become competitive enough to compete in open market. In higher end, likes of BlueOrigin will eat up all of the market. In mid and lower end, ISRO will eat up all the market. UK will not get anything, it will be essentially moving money from one pocket to another.

 

[Arvind]

Poke

I live in and support England - what happened in the test matches ?
You been so quiet for the last month?

Your fault - you could have make the best out of that time. lol

 

[BMD]

Space : Yes.

And remember green lumber fallacy.

The Green Lumber Fallacy: The Difference between Talking and Doing

The Green Lumber Fallacy: The Difference between Talking and Doing


Well, all that money is in launching for others. Launching your own sats is fine and dandy, it saves money. But it does not get you more money. If you want to get more money you have to do it for others as well. India is doing that. I doubt UK will be ever able to do it. Simply, if you celebrate protectionism, you cann't become competitive enough to compete in open market. In higher end, likes of BlueOrigin will eat up all of the market. In mid and lower end, ISRO will eat up all the market. UK will not get anything, it will be essentially moving money from one pocket to another.

We haven't tried at space anytime recently. Give us 20 years and then compare.

We will launch for the government and UK companies, which will make money for the private organisations doing the launches. Then when they have something competitive they will go looking for business overseas.

Protectionism will protect the development period, rather than letting the free market kick the ladder out from under it.

 

[Superkaif]

Your fault - you could have make the best out of that time. lol

Naaaaaa thats not me.
To be honest the 4-1 is a bit of a con. The sides were much more evenly matched and it doesnt tell the actual story of what happened. Poor team selection and some poor form at the top of the order resulted in too much pressure on the rest of the team.
Now the goraay think they are bloody world beaters bla bla bla.

 

[BMD]

And whats your problem with that Mr. Prudent We-Didnt-Do-Space-Research-Because-It-Was-Expensive?
You want to be prudent not to waste money, make a comfortable society and yet to reinvent the wheel, waste money in developing basic 100 KG to LEO 'from the scratch', abondon that, asked other to help you with your 'effort', left that, put money in EU's space capabilities, left EU with possibly no deal. Somehow, your pretense of prudence and your reality of leaving things halfway after making expense does not reconcile.


Many things! To name a few :-
1. Fighting a war to make certain that India is not stuck in a pincer attack from east and west.
2. Implementing green revolution to defuse the population bomb.
3. Developing nuclear research and development infrastructure. This yielded in India getting nuclear weapons in '74.
All while making great progress in space program.

BTW, India's budget for ISRO, currently is 1.7 billion dollars and thats its highest budget. Indian government's revenue is 560 billion dollars. Thats (1.7/560)*100 = 0.3035% of Indian government's revenue. BTW 1.7 billion USD are 1 billion GBP, historically. For a comparison, India's Food security program has a budget of 21 billion dollars.




No it is more like, instead of spending money on space research, which is a strategic technology, you were busy in wasting money. Read on....

Here are expenditures done by British government which were un-needed and could have funded British space program, many times over. After all British are all about 'Prudence'.


£120billion of your money down the drain EVERY year: The astonishing Whitehall waste that could send every British family on an annual luxury holiday | Daily Mail Online

• £15 billion on duplicated procurement across Whitehall departments and councils.
• The Home Office spent £427,000 on rubber bullets police are not even allowed to use.
• About £5billion was paid out in benefits to claimants with an income in excess of £100,000, while £1.2billion was paid out in an annual subsidy to foreign farmers through the EU’s Common Agricultural Policy.
• The TaxPayers’ Alliance suggests £2.9billion could be saved by scrapping the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills and Department for Culture, Media and Sport and hiving off their essential functions to other departments.

And that year 2011-12 only. Just one year was enough to fund your space program, something that has been cancelled so many times. Just one god damn year.

And then you talk about Prudence and good sense in spending. Your government is going to wasted money of the tune GBP 205 billion in Trident replacement.

Lifetime cost of replacing Trident is at least £205bn, latest estimate suggests

In one year, they procured 30 billion GBP worth of new subs for British nuclear missiles. If they had delayed it by one more year, they could have funded the space program for 10 years at least.

Not to mention, UK does not exactly have any major enemies like China or Russia which could attack it with nuclear weapons.

The Truth is: Space was never a priority for British Government till it became an absolute priority due to an unplanned and messy Brexit. British are not exactly the most planned folks they want you to believe. Heck, British were sleeping on the wheel as far as space front is concerned! The lack of funding is a mere pretext.

ToT is called China Syndrome.

India had no space program in 1971. Yeah, it took India 30 years to develop an A-Bomb. Based on that, Britain can do in 7 years or less, what takes India 30 years to do.

Your food security program still sucks though, even after 71 years.

Small fry. I also note one of those items was to the EU. We pay £11bn net to the EU and £17bn in foreign aid. But as you can see, we have massive scope to spend on space with efficiency improvements.

What? China and Russia are very much enemies that could attack the UK.

So now it's a priority and it will happen and as you can see we have massive amounts of funds to do it with.

 

[Arvind]

Naaaaaa thats not me.
To be honest the 4-1 is a bit of a con. The sides were much more evenly matched and it doesnt tell the actual story of what happened. Poor team selection and some poor form at the top of the order resulted in too much pressure on the rest of the team.
Now the goraay think they are bloody world beaters bla bla bla.

Yes almost equally matched but equally poor. No depth and mental strength for test cricket. Can't bat, bowl or field. T20 players disguised as test ones.

Infact there is little spark left in Indo pak clash even though its rare to see. I miss my childhood and intensity and passion of 90s.

@Superkaif To be honest, Indian team is mediocre, its just rest of the word is even not that, but Pak batting is $hit now a days. Their bowling is fine but no where to what it use to be.

RIP cricket.

But hey you said you are gora supporter now.

 

[Arvind]

@Superkaif with a 45 Kg frame, does @safriz look any better than Yaguvendra Chahal?

 

[Superkaif]

Yes almost equally matched but equally poor. No depth and mental strength for test cricket. Can't bat, bowl or field. T20 players disguised as test ones.

Infact there is little spark left in Indo pak clash even though its rare to see. I miss my childhood and intensity and passion of 90s.

@Superkaif To be honest, Indian team is mediocre, its just rest of the word is even not that, but Pak batting is $hit now a days. Their bowling is fine but no where to what it use to be.

RIP cricket.

But hey you said you are gora supporter now.

I agree the spark has gone. Now the goraay are releasing another version - 100 ball cricket. Whens it going to stop?
How i long for the days of Dilip Vensarker and Zaheer Abbas - its changed now beyond recognition.

 

[Superkaif]

@Superkaif with a 45 Kg frame, does @safriz look any better than Yaguvendra Chahal?

Safriz sahib is about 1 metre and 90 cm - and weighs about 50kg - apparently has been working in the gym very hard working on his frame

 

[Amal]

Give us 20 years and then compare.

As I said earlier, good luck !!!

We will launch for the government and UK companies, which will make money for the private organisations doing the launches. Then when they have something competitive they will go looking for business overseas.

Much of your satellites are funded, built & operated by private firms who aren't bound to follow any protectionist policies.

And as @Shajida Khan said earlier, all of this would only matter when Britain actually develops a launcher capable of launching decent payloads to LEO.

ToT is called China Syndrome.

What is Britain Syndrome ? 'Bragging' about a non existent space launcher program ?

India had no space program in 1971.

We had dimwit, we were designing our first space launcher while experimenting with solid fuelled sounding rockets & prototype liquid engines. We learned rocketry the hard way.

Yeah, it took India 30 years to develop an A-Bomb.

Full scale work on India's nuclear weapons program started in 1967. First device was detonated in 1974. It took 7 years.

And the picture wouldn't be complete until we analyze where both countries stand today in the field of civilian nuclear technology. One of them is building fast breeders & thorium reactors. while the other is paying insane amounts to Chinese for a reactor.

Britain can do in 7 years or less, what takes India 30 years to do

No offense meant, but are you this stupid...?

as you can see we have massive amounts of funds to do it with.

''Massive'' as £60 annual space budget or £4 million launchpads ?

 

[BMD]

As I said earlier, good luck !!!

View attachment 3184



Much of your satellites are funded, built & operated by private firms who aren't bound to follow any protectionist policies.

And as @Shajida Khan said earlier, all of this would only matter when Britain actually develops a launcher capable of launching decent payloads to LEO.



What is Britain Syndrome ? 'Bragging' about a non existent space launcher program ?



We had dimwit, we were designing our first space launcher while experimenting with solid fuelled sounding rockets & prototype liquid engines. We learned rocketry the hard way.



Full scale work on India's nuclear weapons program started in 1967. First device was detonated in 1974. It took 7 years.

And the picture wouldn't be complete until we analyze where both countries stand today in the field of civilian nuclear technology. One of them is building fast breeders & thorium reactors. while the other is paying insane amounts to Chinese for a reactor.



No offense meant, but are you this stupid...?



''Massive'' as £60 annual space budget or £4 million launchpads ?

We don't need luck or ToT thanks.

Policies can be introduced to 'encourage' them to use UK launch facilities. But elimination of transportation costs will be a plus anyway and long term deals can be struck locally.

We've only just started again, give it time. At least we don't ToT everything.

You learned it the hard, realised you couldn't do it, then copied the Russians, who copied the Germans.

Yeah 7 years. It was 12 years after you lost territory to China.
India and weapons of mass destruction - Wikipedia

One is developing instrinsically safe modular reactors, which are the future.

No, if we were stupid, it would take us longer.

The forum terrorist has already pointed out that the UK wastes £120bn/year, without even including foreign aid (£17bn) or EU funding (£11bn net) or £15bn in WTO tariffs on EU exports. That should do for a space program.

 

[Amal]

We don't need luck or ToT thanks.

Given the state of your space program, you would sure need both.

Policies can be introduced to 'encourage' them to use UK launch facilities. But elimination of transportation costs will be a plus anyway and long term deals can be struck locally.

'Can' 'will' 'would'. No policy will enable launching of satellites on a non existent hypothetical rocket.

You learned it the hard, realised you couldn't do it, then copied the Russians, who copied the Germans.

Yeah that's why we had a cryogenic upper stage before the Russians, have the most powerful cryogenic upper stage presently in operation & have Solid rocket boosters larger than anything Russians have.

Despite all your butt-hurt Padraig, the fact remains that we are decades ahead & we will remain so...

One is developing instrinsically safe modular reactors, which are the future

As usual, the British are good in bragging about non existent stuff. ''Intrinsically safe'' & ''future''. Apparently not even a single one have been approved for construction.

Try reading about Gen IV designs.

Yeah 7 years. It was 12 years after you lost territory to China.

Again another stupid argument. Developing a nuke needs a fully funded government approved program (just like decent space launchers, unless you are USA)

No, if we were stupid, it would take us longer.

It took you 50 years from your first launch to reach the stage where you are developing microsatellite launchers again. And that's stupid.

The forum terrorist has already pointed out that the UK wastes £120bn/year

Why, did she terrorize you by owning you ?

Being the British government they'll find some way to waste it. Overpriced vanity projects look like a good idea. They are already doing it.

 

[Amal]

We've only just started again, give it

Do you want the rest of the world to suspend their space program until the British catches up ?

 

[BMD]

Given the state of your space program, you would sure need both.




'Can' 'will' 'would'. No policy will enable launching of satellites on a non existent hypothetical rocket.



Yeah that's why we had a cryogenic upper stage before the Russians, have the most powerful cryogenic upper stage presently in operation & have Solid rocket boosters larger than anything Russians have.

Despite all your butt-hurt Padraig, the fact remains that we are decades ahead & we will remain so...



As usual, the British are good in bragging about non existent stuff. ''Intrinsically safe'' & ''future''. Apparently not even a single one have been approved for construction.

Try reading about Gen IV designs.



Again another stupid argument. Developing a nuke needs a fully funded government approved program (just like decent space launchers, unless you are USA)



It took you 50 years from your first launch to reach the stage where you are developing microsatellite launchers again. And that's stupid.



Why, did she terrorize you by owning you ?

Being the British government they'll find some way to waste it. Overpriced vanity projects look like a good idea. They are already doing it.

Nope, just time. We have surpassed India in everything we've turned our hand to.

Nope, you copied the cryo stage from the Russian GSLV Mk1.

Decades for you, a decade for us Hardeep.

Like the non-existent indigenous Indian fighter jets?

Try reading about modular reactors.

Yes, and it was happening well before 1967 for you.

It took you 30 years form when you first thought about nuclear weapons to building them. At least we made our first launch early on with very minimal computing power.

No, she just defends terrorists a lot and is called 'Khan'.

Nope.

 

[BMD]

Do you want the rest of the world to suspend their space program until the British catches up ?

Won't be necessary. With modern computing power and knowledge base, progress will be fast. We'll have a HLV and a stealth fighter before India has an indigenous stealth fighter.

 

[Amal]

Nope, just time.

It's already showing.

Nope, you copied the cryo stage from the Russian GSLV Mk1.

That's what you claim. There is no proof of any ToT or reverse engineering. Not to mention that any ToT is forbidden by MTCR.

Again we had a cryogenic upper stage before the Russians & have the most powerful cryogenic upper stage presently in operation with a larger CE20 engine.

And considering that the only liquid engines you have developed is a peroxide/kerosene engine which needed 4 thrust chambers to produce 65 kN vacuum thrust....

Try reading about modular reactors

Already developed & approved for production. AHWR 300- Th-LEU Mox fuelled. Gen III reactor. Quite different from making tall claims & delivering little.

And then we have our own fourth generation one in works, CFBR.

Decades for you, a decade for us Hardeep

Yes, a country that have no experience in space launchers other than a lone microsatellite launch would do better than a country will three decades of experience in the same.

Okay, I will accept that. Within almost ten years of launching satellites we had developed the PSLV.

So you should be able to come up with one in 3.333 years.

I want to see a British launcher as capable as PSLV by 2021. 3800 kg to LEO. No excuses.

Hope you'll be around then.

Like the non-existent indigenous Indian fighter jets?

Apparently one of those non existent types went to service & was retired three decades back, other is being inducted & produced at rate of 18-24 per year.

Yes, and it was happening well before 1967 for you.

It took you 30 years form when you first thought about nuclear weapons to building them. At least we made our first launch early on with very minimal computing power.

No it didn't.

It took you 50 years to get from a microsatellite launch to the stage where you are planning to develop microsatellite launchers. At least we have nukes already.

No, she just defends terrorists a lot and is called 'Khan'.

I am yet to see that. And if her surname makes her a terrorist, your surname might make you a colonialist murderer.

 

[Amal]

Won't be necessary. With modern computing power and knowledge base, progress will be fast.

''will'' ''can'' ''would''. Meanwhile there is no confirmed timelines for British (paper) launchers.

And a nation that have already developed medium launchers & developing HLVs wouldn't have either 'computing power' and 'knowledge base.' ??