ADA AMCA - Advanced Medium Combat Aircraft

[randomradio]

F 35 can scare China more than Rafale. F35 can prove to be very effective against Chinese AC and ships in ocean. It can perform certain missions which Gripen can not perform. However, Gripen too have some great capability. We need atleast 2 to 3 squadron of both plane in addition to what we have as stop gap.

The F-35 only acts as deterrence against China, it's not good enough to defeat China, especially if we buy only 36. If the goal is to replace MRFA with F-35, unlikely to happen, then 120+ could make a difference. But 36 F-35s is a huge problem for PAF to deal with.

Anyway, take it with a pinch of salt. Even if Trump offers the F-35, whether the IAF is interested or not, the F-35 still has to achieve clearance and set the path forward for up to 30 years before it's ordered. So the IAF could still buy 36 F4s instead or wait for MRFA. We did the same to the Russians before considering any F-35s.

The IAF will still prioritize the MRFA + AMCA path.

There's no interest in Gripen. It's a possibility only if LCA Mk2 fails, but by then the IAF could just order more Mk1A/B and MRFA instead.

 

[Picdelamirand-oil]

If somehow Orange Bossman gets India to buy F-35's I'm gonna be pissed off while at the same time laughing my a** off at some of the people in here who talked sht about the F-35. That is some yin yang sht I'm gonna go through.

For that to happen, Elon Musk would have to stop attacking the F-35! Finally, is it India's vocation to save all the lame ducks in the world aeronautics industry? After saving the Russian industry by financing the SU-30 MKI, should they also save F-35 from Musk ?

Don't Knock The F-35: Why The US Air Force Secretary Says Elon Musk Needs To Learn More​

 

[Rajput Lion]

@Parthu, @randomradio, @marich01, @_Anonymous_ , @vstol Jockey, @Picdelamirand-oil

As I said earlier that CSIR-NAL was working on "Active Cancellation Tech" and now the cat is out of the bag. Guys, ACT definitely works in Rafale and soon all our 4.5/5th gen jets shall have ACT:

Rafale has proven to be a wonder bird for us. More are definitely required even if decide to procure F-35 Block 4 as MRFA winner or just GtG.

 

[_Anonymous_]

@Parthu, @randomradio, @marich01, @_Anonymous_ , @vstol Jockey, @Picdelamirand-oil

As I said earlier that CSIR-NAL was working on "Active Cancellation Tech" and now the cat is out of the bag. Guys, ACT definitely works in Rafale and soon all our 4.5/5th gen jets shall have ACT:

Rafale has proven to be a wonder bird for us. More are definitely required even if decide to procure F-35 Block 4 as MRFA winner or just GtG.

Yes I was about to link it here & ask how do they expect to retrofit all those sensors on legacy FAs like the MKIs ?

I'm not sure these will go into the Jaguars for as it is those planes are underpowered & we're looking at a decade worth of service life at the most for them.

Ditto for the MiG-29s & the Mirage 2000s . Which brings us to the Mk-1a . How will we integrate sensors onto it with them due to go in for mass mfg anytime now ?

Sadly that's another nail in the coffin for the MRFA tender & for RST's tattered reputation.

 

[Rajput Lion]

Yes I was about to link it here & ask how do they expect to retrofit all those sensors on legacy FAs like the MKIs ?

I'm not sure these will go into the Jaguars for as it is those planes are underpowered & we're looking at a decade worth of service life at the most for them.

Ditto for the MiG-29s & the Mirage 2000s . Which brings us to the Mk-1a . How will we integrate sensors onto it with them due to go in for mass mfg anytime now ?

Sadly that's another nail in the coffin for the MRFA tender & for RST's tattered reputation.

MK2, TEDBF, AMCA and MKI UPG at best. It shall require new AESA antennas which as per the video is about to enter fabrication stage.

Out of all the above, AMCA's ACT implementation because of its airframe design with least spikes/radar hot-zones, would be the most effective. Combine that with its passive stealth and it shall be a ghost of the sky.

 

[Picdelamirand-oil]

To develop it, you'll need around 10 billion dollars per aircraft.

 

[_Anonymous_]

To develop it, you'll need around 10 billion dollars per aircraft.

Given the vast difference between the PPP of France & India we can do it for a fraction of the cost. I'd venture something in the vicinity of 3 billion USD give or take half a billion.

That's not the main issue , the principal issue is whether we'd be able to develop a satisfactory system & more importantly the time we'd take to develop & integrate it to our fleet of FAs.

 

[Gautam]

BHEL has completed the development of AMCA's heat exchangers:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1881590981835010223

 

[Rajput Lion]

To develop it, you'll need around 10 billion dollars per aircraft.

We have the money, tech and even an awesome reference(Rafale). So it's only a matter of time. Only difference is AMCA will have both Passive + Active stealth against Rafale's Active Stealth. So it's going to be way more survival deep inside enemy territory in offensive missions.

 

[randomradio]

@Parthu, @randomradio, @marich01, @_Anonymous_ , @vstol Jockey, @Picdelamirand-oil

As I said earlier that CSIR-NAL was working on "Active Cancellation Tech" and now the cat is out of the bag. Guys, ACT definitely works in Rafale and soon all our 4.5/5th gen jets shall have ACT:

Rafale has proven to be a wonder bird for us. More are definitely required even if decide to procure F-35 Block 4 as MRFA winner or just GtG.

Yeah, it's not just India or France though, everybody's working on it.

 

[randomradio]

MK2, TEDBF, AMCA and MKI UPG at best. It shall require new AESA antennas which as per the video is about to enter fabrication stage.

Out of all the above, AMCA's ACT implementation because of its airframe design with least spikes/radar hot-zones, would be the most effective. Combine that with its passive stealth and it shall be a ghost of the sky.

It's not possible for LCA Mk1/A and MKI, it's only possible for LCA Mk2, TEDBF, and AMCA.

Plus developing this is very expensive, so only AMCA is likely to get it. LCA Mk2 and TEDBF could follow suit maybe 10 years later and only in certain configurations.

Anyway, developing this tech will take 10+ years. It's not 6 months away.

 

[randomradio]

To develop it, you'll need around 10 billion dollars per aircraft.

AMCA can be equipped with it using just one configuration, all internal payload, no external. Same with Ghatak and FUFA.

LCA Mk2 and TEDBF only need to be configured for air combat with 2 missile types and fuel tanks. Any stealth mission will require the use of Ghatak/FUFA for the A2G mission.

But given the massive scale of the program, as long as AMCA + drones have this tech, it's enough, as the same drones can be used by older jets too. So it's not gonna be as expensive as you imagine.

 

[randomradio]

For that to happen, Elon Musk would have to stop attacking the F-35! Finally, is it India's vocation to save all the lame ducks in the world aeronautics industry? After saving the Russian industry by financing the SU-30 MKI, should they also save F-35 from Musk ?

Don't Knock The F-35: Why The US Air Force Secretary Says Elon Musk Needs To Learn More​

For India, NGAD or bust.

 

[marich01]

AMCA bp

 

[Bhartiya Naagrik Sainik]

After potential stealthy SAM hunter, AMCA has potential to engage naval & other surface targets also from stand-off distance.
If we compare some present weapons like AGM-158A JASSM, JSM/NSM, Storm-Shadow/SCALP-EG, Taurus KEPD-350, SOM-J, etc then they're still bigger than IWB, but they can be scaled down.

Below is example of JASSM & JSM with their original dimension compared to 4.2m long IWB:



But their adjusted size variants are being integrated in F-35. Similar weapons can be developed for AMCA too.

 

[HariPrasad]

True that. If we are able to achieve 0.1 Sq meter RCS, UTTAM/ELTA 2052 can detect F-16, JF-17, SU 30 MKK, SU 35 and J10 atleast 30 to 40 KM further distance than Chinese radar can detect MWF. This will give it a first shoot capability and actual hitting will depend on no escape zone of BVR. If we integrate meteor, Chances of hitting will be higher. If we shoot Astra MK2 (Which has almost same range as Meteor), Chances of neutralizing enemy Plane shall be lower compared to Meteor (Probably as believe that Meteor is a batter missile with longer No escape zone) .


The great advantage which Tejas MK1/MWF will have is that it will be equipped with some great short range missiles such as ASRAAM and Meteor. They can be fired at enemy plane without even MWF pointing towards enemy plane. They can be fired even if MWF nose is not pointed towards enemy plane. They can be guided at enemy plane by just looking at it with the help of helmet guidance. As these are very high G missiles, they can change directions quickly and go towards enemy missiles. Chinese short-range missiles are inferior in IRR seeker and in maneuverability. They are low G missile and easy to Jam with EW or Chef and flare. only advantage they will enjoy shall be TVC. It will give them advantage in close combat and gun fight.

Read here "The great advantage which Tejas MK1/MWF will have is that it will be equipped with some great short range missiles such as ASRAAM and Python V".

 

[marich01]

Update....
Rolls-Royce’s proposal for India’s AMCA programme

"We are keen to participate in co-development opportunities that will create both technology and capability in India, and help accelerate India’s vision of self-reliance in defence. Our proposed combat aircraft engine co-development model will offer India an opportunity to create and own intellectual property (IP) for critical combat engine technology, allowing future upgrades and exports. Such a partnership will ensure the transfer of both know-how and know-why that will support and facilitate future development programmes"

https://twitter.com/x/status/1887022911321506194

 

[Gautam]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1887736020998795628

https://twitter.com/x/status/1887829934707712175

 

[Bhartiya Naagrik Sainik]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1887736020998795628

View attachment 40161

https://twitter.com/x/status/1887829934707712175

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ADA-001, ADA's 1st baby
It is very basic, they could have shown EOTS, IRST, DAS. But something is better than nothing.
Nose appears to be too long, or may be it is camera angle effect.
The engines are exposed a lot. The rudder's trailing edge could have been diamond or cranked-arrow/lambda shaped; The stab/elevator could be moved aft.
The flaps & aelerons actuator bumps need to be more flat & blended.
Inbuilt ladder not required, will increase RCS.
Perhaps a CCM can fit in SWB.

 

[marich01]

ADA-001, ADA's 1st baby
It is very basic, they could have shown EOTS, IRST, DAS. But something is better than nothing.
Nose appears to be too long, or may be it is camera angle effect.
The engines are exposed a lot. The rudder's trailing edge could have been diamond or cranked-arrow/lambda shaped; The stab/elevator could be moved aft.
The flaps & aelerons actuator bumps need to be more flat & blended.
Inbuilt ladder not required, will increase RCS.
Perhaps a CCM can fit in SWB.

View attachment 40237

Yeah its intended to be basic, since the position of some of the sensor suite etc is probably not fixed yet. ADA is about to start some detail design level work and have tendered out for this too. A more mature model will likely come in .. next Aero India






etc