As far as I know, if you have proper networking between different platforms then the Longbow radar can more than compensate for the lack of FCRs in other platforms. Longbow radar will track targets and send targeting information to the other choppers, which then can use this info to launch missiles at targets.
But what if you don't have proper networking ? What if you are operating a lone small helo to reduce signature ? without a FCR the operators will be at a distinct dis-advantage in these situation. I think the Army is looking to fill that gap, they don't necessarily need something as big and capable as a Longbow radar.
Just my two cents correct me if I am wrong.
Beautiful. 
But I've so many questions. Please bear with me.
Pic 1 :
Red circles : Air-speed/direction sensors ?
Green circle : Comms antenna ? Radio or sat ?
Blue arrow : What is that ? a radar ?
Violet circles : Engine/Main gearbox cooling duct ?
Pic 2 :
Red circle : Tail rotor cooling duct ?
Blue arrow : Look at that, surely thats a sensor of some kind. What kind of sensor sits on the side ? Synthetic aparture radar for ground scanning and situational awareness ?
Pic 3 :
Red circle : What is that ? Just ahead of the engine intake, so does it compress intake air or something ? I've always wondered about this.
Green arrow : Looks like some kind of bay/compartment. Fueling bay ?
Violet circle : Rearward looking MAWS ?
Pic 4 :
Blue arrow : I know that's a TADS, but why wasn't it painted in camo. Do they not paint this part in Apaches ? Also over the TADS(arrow directly pointing at it) there seems to be laser range finder. Is that accurate or is that a day camera or something ?
Help me out here guys @randomradio @Ashwin @Parthu @Falcon @BlackOpsIndia @vstol Jockey et al.
But I've so many questions. Please bear with me.
Pic 1 :
Red circles : Air-speed/direction sensors ?
Green circle : Comms antenna ? Radio or sat ?
Blue arrow : What is that ? a radar ?
Violet circles : Engine/Main gearbox cooling duct ?
Pic 2 :
Red circle : Tail rotor cooling duct ?
Blue arrow : Look at that, surely thats a sensor of some kind. What kind of sensor sits on the side ? Synthetic aparture radar for ground scanning and situational awareness ?
Pic 3 :
Red circle : What is that ? Just ahead of the engine intake, so does it compress intake air or something ? I've always wondered about this.
Green arrow : Looks like some kind of bay/compartment. Fueling bay ?
Violet circle : Rearward looking MAWS ?
Pic 4 :
Blue arrow : I know that's a TADS, but why wasn't it painted in camo. Do they not paint this part in Apaches ? Also over the TADS(arrow directly pointing at it) there seems to be laser range finder. Is that accurate or is that a day camera or something ?
Help me out here guys @randomradio @Ashwin @Parthu @Falcon @BlackOpsIndia @vstol Jockey et al.
Beautiful.
But I've so many questions. Please bear with me.
Pic 1 :
View attachment 6500
Red circles : Air-speed/direction sensors ?
Green circle : Comms antenna ? Radio or sat ?
Blue arrow : What is that ? a radar ?
Violet circles : Engine/Main gearbox cooling duct ?
Red : Yes - Helicopter Air Data System (HADS)
Green : Appears to be so. That would be the place a SATCOM antenna would go
Blue : Not sure - appears only the AH-64E model has that. Doubt it's a radar though, considering that's a bad place, its FoV would be mostly covered by the weapon pods - you can see in your own Pic 3 how this is the case. More than likely the volume of the internal components in that place got bigger, necessitating a 'bumped' surface panel to accommodate them
Violet : Yes
Red : Yes
Red : That's actually the gearbox
Green : On legacy models of Apache, that used to be a storage locker of sorts (survival equipment etc.), but those raised stubs on the panel are new on the AH-64E variant. But unlikely its purpose has changed.
Violet : Yes - rear aperture of the Elbit PAWS missile warning suite
Blue : That's the M/PNVS (Pilot Night Vision System) - it can operate independently of M/TADS (which is the gimbal on the bottom), although it is basically part of the same system.
Some customers do paint the nose in the same color scheme as rest of body (like Indonesia), but most of the time in majority of countries, the nose remains black regardless of body paint.
Hmmm........This bumped up surface panel is surprisingly deceptive. I could've sworn this was a radar. Does the other side have it ? Or is it just on one side.
Both sides.
It just doesn't make any sense for it to be a radar - as I said, about half it's FoV would be covered by the weapon pods if it was.
Furthermore, what's the need for a new radar on the side? If it wants a radar, it has the APG-78 Longbow on the rotor hub which can scan all directions, with a pretty good view of the ground around the Apache as well. And the Longbow is already a Millimetre Wave band radar capable of very high resolutions.
Could be a heat shield or some sort of extra armor plating to act as a buffer between the weapons pod and the internal fuel tank.
How many longbows are we getting? 4?
I am not sure what would be the use of such a thing.
12 with Longbows, 10 without. As far as I can tell.
Transferring attack helicopters to Army, a case of duplication of assets and effort?
17 May 2019 I ANGAD SINGH
Transferring all attack helicopters to the Army is asking for a complete re-write of the way both the Army and IAF function. If there are command and control issues, they should be hammered out at the relevant levels instead of overhauling broader operating concepts, with the attendant hazards of unintended consequences.
Indian Air Force
Much has been made of the IAF taking delivery of the first of twenty-two Boeing AH-64E (I) attack helicopters last week. Once again, a slew of editorials have come forth, suggesting that attack helicopters should be handed over to the Army. This is a narrow view that sees helicopters as only an extension of warfare on the ground, and also overestimates the Army’s ability to absorb and maximise utility of these expensive military assets.
Although helicopters like the Apache are excellent at killing tanks and generally wreaking mayhem on the battlefield, they can do a lot more when not supporting massive armoured thrusts or pitched land battles
Although helicopters like the Apache are excellent at killing tanks and generally wreaking mayhem on the battlefield, they can do a lot more when not supporting massive armoured thrusts or pitched land battles. The IAF’s own Concept of Operations (CONOPS) sees attack helos serving in a host of roles beyond the immediate battle area, including air interdiction at ranges well beyond the front lines of combat. While the utility of helicopters in the Destruction of Enemy Air Defences (DEAD) role can be debated, this is another IAF-specific task that has been assigned to its attack helicopters — which have the advantage of avoiding detection by flying extremely low. Then of course, there are the air-to-air and helicopter escort roles, both of which are handled by the IAF. Handing off attack helicopters entirely to the Army would be straitjacketing a very versatile platform to a narrow set of tasks.
The US Army, which is frequently cited as an example of how to do things on the attack helicopter front, operates under complete air superiority provided by the USAF. This does not apply to India, where air superiority is not assured, and attack helicopters will have to integrate with heterogeneous air packages, be able to receive information from various platforms to boost their situational awareness, and send their own sensor information onward to improve the air picture available at the command level. Even in the Gulf War, when Apaches were used for the opening strikes against air defence elements, they were led in by USAF MH-53s. In Israel, for instance, Apaches (indeed all helicopters) remain under control of the Air Force.
The Indian Army, which operates half the number of helicopters that the Air Force does, trains roughly twice the number of pilots. In the Army (as in the Navy), one is never a career aviator — frequent stints outside the aviation branch are the norm, not the exception. This means training more air crew to replace those that will inevitably be called away from flying duties, dips in readiness and specialisation as air crews are rotated in and out of squadrons. In the IAF, this specialised knowledge goes nowhere, and flying is all one does for twenty-odd years. As far as the ultimate in combat employment of helicopters is concerned — the Helicopter Combat Leader course at the Tactics and Air Combat Development Establishment (TACDE) — no Army pilots graduate this course. The HCL course is run the way the IAF fights and plans to fight — with complex packages of dissimilar aircraft types operating in unison. HCL graduates are trained to squeeze all they can from the helicopters they fly. Without any HCLs in service, and none likely given the demands on TACDE, the logical assumption is that the Army will be unable to exploit its attack helicopters to the extent the IAF does. Even if the training issues are resolved, manpower management will continue to be in issue — the Army will continue to under-utilise air crew and be forced to train disproportionate numbers of pilots.
The IAF’s entire attack helicopter fleet, which includes the HAL Rudra gunship derived from the Dhruv light helicopter, Soviet-origin Mi-35s, and now Apaches, are already under operational control of the Army’s Strike Corps
The IAF’s entire attack helicopter fleet, which includes the HAL Rudra gunship derived from the Dhruv light helicopter, Soviet-origin Mi-35s, and now Apaches, are already under operational control of the Army’s Strike Corps. When HAL’s Light Combat Helicopter (LCH) is inducted, these too will be operated by the IAF but controlled by the Army. Yet the Army is also inducting HAL Rudras as fast as they can be churned out, has ordered its own LCHs, and has recently been cleared to procure a laughable six AH-64s of its own. Given India’s hollowed out defence budgets that have hobbled any attempt at modernisation, this is precisely the sort of duplication of assets and effort that should be avoided at all costs.
Transferring attack helicopters to Army, a case of duplication of assets and effort? | ORF
17 May 2019 I ANGAD SINGH
Transferring all attack helicopters to the Army is asking for a complete re-write of the way both the Army and IAF function. If there are command and control issues, they should be hammered out at the relevant levels instead of overhauling broader operating concepts, with the attendant hazards of unintended consequences.
Indian Air Force
Much has been made of the IAF taking delivery of the first of twenty-two Boeing AH-64E (I) attack helicopters last week. Once again, a slew of editorials have come forth, suggesting that attack helicopters should be handed over to the Army. This is a narrow view that sees helicopters as only an extension of warfare on the ground, and also overestimates the Army’s ability to absorb and maximise utility of these expensive military assets.
Although helicopters like the Apache are excellent at killing tanks and generally wreaking mayhem on the battlefield, they can do a lot more when not supporting massive armoured thrusts or pitched land battles
Although helicopters like the Apache are excellent at killing tanks and generally wreaking mayhem on the battlefield, they can do a lot more when not supporting massive armoured thrusts or pitched land battles. The IAF’s own Concept of Operations (CONOPS) sees attack helos serving in a host of roles beyond the immediate battle area, including air interdiction at ranges well beyond the front lines of combat. While the utility of helicopters in the Destruction of Enemy Air Defences (DEAD) role can be debated, this is another IAF-specific task that has been assigned to its attack helicopters — which have the advantage of avoiding detection by flying extremely low. Then of course, there are the air-to-air and helicopter escort roles, both of which are handled by the IAF. Handing off attack helicopters entirely to the Army would be straitjacketing a very versatile platform to a narrow set of tasks.
The US Army, which is frequently cited as an example of how to do things on the attack helicopter front, operates under complete air superiority provided by the USAF. This does not apply to India, where air superiority is not assured, and attack helicopters will have to integrate with heterogeneous air packages, be able to receive information from various platforms to boost their situational awareness, and send their own sensor information onward to improve the air picture available at the command level. Even in the Gulf War, when Apaches were used for the opening strikes against air defence elements, they were led in by USAF MH-53s. In Israel, for instance, Apaches (indeed all helicopters) remain under control of the Air Force.
The Indian Army, which operates half the number of helicopters that the Air Force does, trains roughly twice the number of pilots. In the Army (as in the Navy), one is never a career aviator — frequent stints outside the aviation branch are the norm, not the exception. This means training more air crew to replace those that will inevitably be called away from flying duties, dips in readiness and specialisation as air crews are rotated in and out of squadrons. In the IAF, this specialised knowledge goes nowhere, and flying is all one does for twenty-odd years. As far as the ultimate in combat employment of helicopters is concerned — the Helicopter Combat Leader course at the Tactics and Air Combat Development Establishment (TACDE) — no Army pilots graduate this course. The HCL course is run the way the IAF fights and plans to fight — with complex packages of dissimilar aircraft types operating in unison. HCL graduates are trained to squeeze all they can from the helicopters they fly. Without any HCLs in service, and none likely given the demands on TACDE, the logical assumption is that the Army will be unable to exploit its attack helicopters to the extent the IAF does. Even if the training issues are resolved, manpower management will continue to be in issue — the Army will continue to under-utilise air crew and be forced to train disproportionate numbers of pilots.
The IAF’s entire attack helicopter fleet, which includes the HAL Rudra gunship derived from the Dhruv light helicopter, Soviet-origin Mi-35s, and now Apaches, are already under operational control of the Army’s Strike Corps
The IAF’s entire attack helicopter fleet, which includes the HAL Rudra gunship derived from the Dhruv light helicopter, Soviet-origin Mi-35s, and now Apaches, are already under operational control of the Army’s Strike Corps. When HAL’s Light Combat Helicopter (LCH) is inducted, these too will be operated by the IAF but controlled by the Army. Yet the Army is also inducting HAL Rudras as fast as they can be churned out, has ordered its own LCHs, and has recently been cleared to procure a laughable six AH-64s of its own. Given India’s hollowed out defence budgets that have hobbled any attempt at modernisation, this is precisely the sort of duplication of assets and effort that should be avoided at all costs.
Transferring attack helicopters to Army, a case of duplication of assets and effort? | ORF
Just some pics.
Love that engine cowling. Love how slim it is. They should totally try making a Apache type heavier combat helo. I'm just fanboy-ing.
Love that engine cowling. Love how slim it is. They should totally try making a Apache type heavier combat helo. I'm just fanboy-ing.
1500th screw, 2000th nut, 2500th bolt and so on.Indian aerospace firm delivers 1000th electrical panel for Boeing's Apache
Indian Air Force to get Apache attack helicopters next week
India has purchased 22 Apache helicopters from the United States.
Written By : Krishnamohan Mishra, Zee Media Newsroom, Updated: Jul 20, 2019, 05:40 AM IST
AH-64E (I) Apache Guardian helicopter Air Marshal AS Butola accepts the first AH-64E (I) Apache Guardian helicopter at Boeing production facility in US in May , PTI
The first consignment of the Apache attack helicopters for the Indian Air Force (IAF) will reach Hindon Airbus in Ghaziabad by the end of this month, sources said.
It is likely that there will be three to four helicopters in this consignment. But the deployment of Apache's first squadron in Pathankot will take another month. India has purchased 22 Apache helicopters from the United States.
According to sources, Apache helicopters will arrive at Hindon Airbase in Ghaziabad on an AN 224 transport aircraft on July 27.
They will be prepared at the Hindon Airbase and in the last week of August will be sent to Pathankot for a formal induction into the IAF. The first squadron of the Apaches will be stationed at Pathankot and the first Commanding Officer will be Group Captain M Shaylu.
The IAF has the 125 Helicopter Squadron (125 H SQUADRON), already deployed at Pathankot, which currently flies the Mi-35 helicopters and will now host the country's first Apache squadron. The second squadron will be stationed at Jorhat Airbase of Assam. It is likely that by 2020, the IAF will get all Apache helicopters on order.
The Apache AH-64E helicopter is equipped with a 30-mm machine gun, which can fire up to 1,200 rounds at a time. Apart from this, Apache is also equipped with the anti-tank Hellfire missile, which is believed to be capable of destroying a tank. As an additional weapon, a Hydra Unguided Rocket, capable of perfect execution of any target on land, is also installed. The helicopter can fly at a speed of 150 nautical miles per hour, which helps it to reach the enemy at a tremendous speed in the air.
The IAF currently uses decades-old Russian made Mi-35 and Mi-25 attack helicopters with one squadron stationed at Pathankot and another at Suratgarh in Rajasthan. The IAF also has Rudra attack helicopters developed out of the indigenous Advanced Light Helicopter 'Dhruv'. Hindustan Aeronautics Limited is also producing the Light Combat Helicopters for the Air Force in the country.
CURRENT ASSETS
The IAF currently uses the decades-old Russian made Mi-35 and Mi-25 attack helicopters with one squadron stationed at Pathankot and another at Suratgarh in Rajasthan
Indian Air Force to get Apache attack helicopters next week
India has purchased 22 Apache helicopters from the United States.
Written By : Krishnamohan Mishra, Zee Media Newsroom, Updated: Jul 20, 2019, 05:40 AM IST
The first consignment of the Apache attack helicopters for the Indian Air Force (IAF) will reach Hindon Airbus in Ghaziabad by the end of this month, sources said.
It is likely that there will be three to four helicopters in this consignment. But the deployment of Apache's first squadron in Pathankot will take another month. India has purchased 22 Apache helicopters from the United States.
According to sources, Apache helicopters will arrive at Hindon Airbase in Ghaziabad on an AN 224 transport aircraft on July 27.
They will be prepared at the Hindon Airbase and in the last week of August will be sent to Pathankot for a formal induction into the IAF. The first squadron of the Apaches will be stationed at Pathankot and the first Commanding Officer will be Group Captain M Shaylu.
The IAF has the 125 Helicopter Squadron (125 H SQUADRON), already deployed at Pathankot, which currently flies the Mi-35 helicopters and will now host the country's first Apache squadron. The second squadron will be stationed at Jorhat Airbase of Assam. It is likely that by 2020, the IAF will get all Apache helicopters on order.
The Apache AH-64E helicopter is equipped with a 30-mm machine gun, which can fire up to 1,200 rounds at a time. Apart from this, Apache is also equipped with the anti-tank Hellfire missile, which is believed to be capable of destroying a tank. As an additional weapon, a Hydra Unguided Rocket, capable of perfect execution of any target on land, is also installed. The helicopter can fly at a speed of 150 nautical miles per hour, which helps it to reach the enemy at a tremendous speed in the air.
The IAF currently uses decades-old Russian made Mi-35 and Mi-25 attack helicopters with one squadron stationed at Pathankot and another at Suratgarh in Rajasthan. The IAF also has Rudra attack helicopters developed out of the indigenous Advanced Light Helicopter 'Dhruv'. Hindustan Aeronautics Limited is also producing the Light Combat Helicopters for the Air Force in the country.
CURRENT ASSETS
The IAF currently uses the decades-old Russian made Mi-35 and Mi-25 attack helicopters with one squadron stationed at Pathankot and another at Suratgarh in Rajasthan
Indian Air Force to get Apache attack helicopters next week
Indian Air Force to get Apache attack helicopters next week
India has purchased 22 Apache helicopters from the United States.
Written By : Krishnamohan Mishra, Zee Media Newsroom, Updated: Jul 20, 2019, 05:40 AM IST
AH-64E (I) Apache Guardian helicopter Air Marshal AS Butola accepts the first AH-64E (I) Apache Guardian helicopter at Boeing production facility in US in May , PTI
The first consignment of the Apache attack helicopters for the Indian Air Force (IAF) will reach Hindon Airbus in Ghaziabad by the end of this month, sources said.
It is likely that there will be three to four helicopters in this consignment. But the deployment of Apache's first squadron in Pathankot will take another month. India has purchased 22 Apache helicopters from the United States.
According to sources, Apache helicopters will arrive at Hindon Airbase in Ghaziabad on an AN 224 transport aircraft on July 27.
They will be prepared at the Hindon Airbase and in the last week of August will be sent to Pathankot for a formal induction into the IAF. The first squadron of the Apaches will be stationed at Pathankot and the first Commanding Officer will be Group Captain M Shaylu.
The IAF has the 125 Helicopter Squadron (125 H SQUADRON), already deployed at Pathankot, which currently flies the Mi-35 helicopters and will now host the country's first Apache squadron. The second squadron will be stationed at Jorhat Airbase of Assam. It is likely that by 2020, the IAF will get all Apache helicopters on order.
The Apache AH-64E helicopter is equipped with a 30-mm machine gun, which can fire up to 1,200 rounds at a time. Apart from this, Apache is also equipped with the anti-tank Hellfire missile, which is believed to be capable of destroying a tank. As an additional weapon, a Hydra Unguided Rocket, capable of perfect execution of any target on land, is also installed. The helicopter can fly at a speed of 150 nautical miles per hour, which helps it to reach the enemy at a tremendous speed in the air.
The IAF currently uses decades-old Russian made Mi-35 and Mi-25 attack helicopters with one squadron stationed at Pathankot and another at Suratgarh in Rajasthan. The IAF also has Rudra attack helicopters developed out of the indigenous Advanced Light Helicopter 'Dhruv'. Hindustan Aeronautics Limited is also producing the Light Combat Helicopters for the Air Force in the country.
CURRENT ASSETS
The IAF currently uses the decades-old Russian made Mi-35 and Mi-25 attack helicopters with one squadron stationed at Pathankot and another at Suratgarh in Rajasthan
Indian Air Force to get Apache attack helicopters next week
Why aren't we buying guided rockets still.
.