Defence Budget Allocation & Defence Procurement Procedure : News & Discussions

Ankit Kumar said:
It's time we merge BSF , ITBP and SSB into a single entity. Only then they will be able to make any decent capital purchase like a helicopter wing.
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Also high time RR is delinked from the IA & converted into a para military force on the lines of the AR.

We need to work out the individual roles & the management cadre of these para militaries too .

Is the CRPF a counter insurgency force ? If so treat it as such , arm & equip it as such & develop a separate cadre instead of staffing them with IPS personnel on deputation & supplementing them with individual recruitment creating a separate management cadre thereby generating an environment spurring unhealthy competition between the 2 .
 
Ankit Kumar said:
Home Ministry important allocations

3.8 billion USD for CRPF

3 billion USD for BSF

1.6 billion USD for CISF

1 billion USD for SSB

994 million USD for ITBP

887 million USD for Assam Rifles

172 million USD for NSG

The Intelligence Bureau 422 million USD

The Special Protection Group (SPG)51 million USD

Rs 2,744.52 crore has been given for border infrastructure and management( 365 million USD )

Rs 565.72 crore has been allocated for the border area development programme ( 75 million USD)

Rs 3,659.84 crore has been allocated for improving police infrastructure. (492 million USD)
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There are other allocations too for Home Ministry but I have tried to focus only on CAPFs and related. The figures in USD are approximation.
 
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_Anonymous_ said:
Also high time RR is delinked from the IA & converted into a para military force on the lines of the AR.

We need to work out the individual roles & the management cadre of these para militaries too .

Is the CRPF a counter insurgency force ? If so treat it as such , arm & equip it as such & develop a separate cadre instead of staffing them with IPS personnel on deputation & supplementing them with individual recruitment creating a separate management cadre thereby generating an environment spurring unhealthy competition between the 2 .
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What I envision (call it my fantasy) is that there should be a National Guard.

It should consist of
1. A Border Protection Force (BSF, ITBP, SSB, parts of Assam Rifles)
2. An internal Security Force (CRPF , CISF and remaining Assam Rifles along with NSG)
3. An aviation asset. Maybe Air National Guard. It will provide mobility and other services to the first two branches.
4. Coastal Police Force (Many states have coastal Police for policing work. We should create a national entity. And clearly define it's work and how it's to complement the Coast Guards. )

And then instead of taking people from IPS cadre, it should have its own unique selection process.

Alas it's my fantasy.
 
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Ankit Kumar said:
What I envision (call it my fantasy) is that there should be a National Guard.

It should consist of
1. A Border Protection Force (BSF, ITBP, SSB, parts of Assam Rifles)
2. An internal Security Force (CRPF , CISF and remaining Assam Rifles along with NSG)
3. An aviation asset. Maybe Air National Guard. It will provide mobility and other services to the first two branches.
4. Coastal Police Force (Many states have coastal Police for policing work. We should create a national entity. And clearly define it's work and how it's to complement the Coast Guards. )

And then instead of taking people from IPS cadre, it should have its own unique selection process.

Alas it's my fantasy.
Click to expand...

A national guard is necessary only when the military has to focus on expeditionary capabilities. When the enemy is right next door, there's no point, it's just duplication.
 
Ankit Kumar said:
What I envision (call it my fantasy) is that there should be a National Guard.

It should consist of
1. A Border Protection Force (BSF, ITBP, SSB, parts of Assam Rifles)
2. An internal Security Force (CRPF , CISF and remaining Assam Rifles along with NSG)
3. An aviation asset. Maybe Air National Guard. It will provide mobility and other services to the first two branches.
4. Coastal Police Force (Many states have coastal Police for policing work. We should create a national entity. And clearly define it's work and how it's to complement the Coast Guards. )

And then instead of taking people from IPS cadre, it should have its own unique selection process.

Alas it's my fantasy.
Click to expand...

All Paramilitary forces have Not Just different Roles but also Different Territorial Jurisdictions

One Size Does not Fit All

There is Something Called
Domain Expertise ,which is the hallmark of Each Paramilitary organisation
 
randomradio said:
A national guard is necessary only when the military has to focus on expeditionary capabilities. When the enemy is right next door, there's no point, it's just duplication.
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Also in USA the Coast Guard , Border Patrol and Customs are all different

They also have FBI , HomeLand Security etc etc

They also have many intelligence agencies

US National Guard is meant to Prevent "Civil War " and insurrection , Given the millions of Guns available in the country 😂
 
randomradio said:
A national guard is necessary only when the military has to focus on expeditionary capabilities. When the enemy is right next door, there's no point, it's just duplication.
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Change the name as you like. Let the names be XYZ. It's the structure I was referring to under HM.
STEPHEN COHEN said:
All Paramilitary forces have Not Just different Roles but also Different Territorial Jurisdictions

One Size Does not Fit All

There is Something Called
Domain Expertise ,which is the hallmark of Each Paramilitary organisation
Click to expand...
BSF is in Gujarat, Rajasthan, Punjab , Kashmir, West Bengal.

There is nothing unique or very radical difference between those areas and border of UP/Bihar with Nepal.

Unification of BSF and SSB. We can definitely start there.
 
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Ankit Kumar said:
Change the name as you like. Let the names be XYZ. It's the structure I was referring to under HM.

BSF is in Gujarat, Rajasthan, Punjab , Kashmir, West Bengal.

There is nothing unique or very radical difference between those areas and border of UP/Bihar with Nepal.

Unification of BSF and SSB. We can definitely start there.
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Borders are like theater commands. You can't convert them all into a single force. BSF and SSB have very different functions since the borders they handle need different equipment and different training. One's fenced and comes under attack quite frequently. The other doesn't even have a real border, at least from the other side.

The govt's following one border, one force system because it works. What really needs to be done is either hand over operational control of ITBP to the army or simply hand over the entire Chinese border to the ITBP. At the very least, ITBP in Ladakh should be handed over to the army.

Converting them into a single force is unnecessary from the PoV of buying air assets either. Everything's under the MHA, so they can buy whatever they want at any point in time as long as they have the money for it. They are not buying enough air assets because the military has first priority. It's a budget issue, not a bureaucratic one.
 
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Ankit Kumar said:
It's time we merge BSF , ITBP and SSB into a single entity. Only then they will be able to make any decent capital purchase like a helicopter wing.
Click to expand...
CRPF+ BSF + CiSF+SSB+ ITBT + Assam rifles +NSG combined have more defence budget than entire Pakistan defence Budget.

When you compare the capabilities and equipments, it's nowhere near.
 
Ashwin said:
Navy CAPX

FY 21-22 BE ₹33253 cr
FY 21-22 RE ₹46021 cr
FY 22-23 BE ₹47590 cr

So the increase happened this FY itself. And it's around 30% not 43% as claimed.
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The numbers will change when they get revised again.
Volcano said:
CRPF+ BSF + CiSF+SSB+ ITBT + Assam rifles +NSG combined have more defence budget than entire Pakistan defence Budget.

When you compare the capabilities and equipments, it's nowhere near.
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Pakistan's defence budget doesn't include capital expenses.
 
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Ankit Kumar said:
There's the usual defence budget for them, then theirs capital expenses, then theirs seperate for pension/fauji foundation, etc.

Approx 35-40% of their yearly budget goes to Establishment and associated activities.
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Yep. But hush, let's not advertise the truth. We need Pakistanis to believe that their revenue budget is their overall budget. The more they spend on their military, the better it is for us. ;)
 
Ankit Kumar said:
There's the usual defence budget for them, then theirs capital expenses, then theirs seperate for pension/fauji foundation, etc.

Approx 35-40% of their yearly budget goes to Establishment and associated activities.
Click to expand...
That's what makes their armed forces powerful enough for us. And as we deploy more advanced stuff, China will give them equivalent stuff since its already with them. Then the major problem for Pakistan becomes a strong military and a weak economy with few worthwhile geopolitical friends. This is what makes even a short war unsustainable since it crushes the economy. So India needs a strong military and a strong economy. Our main challenge will be to break the will of their military and common folk vis-a-vis India and i don't know how this is to be done.
 
Ashwin said:
I'm really bored of this overoptimistic story of how defence budget will be so huge in the 'future' and how we will be able to afford these overpriced numbers.

Let's take a look at the last 5 years of CAPEX change under this Govt.
Budget 2013-14 BE : Rs 86685 crores
Budget 2018-19 RE : Rs 93800 crores


View attachment 9777View attachment 9778

Growth of 7.5% in 5 Years !

Overall budget increased to keep up with inflation. But OROP and pay commission took it all. ie, Modernization budget was constantly going down in real terms.

They are struggling to pay for ongoing orders. So, Pardon me for being skeptical about the promised land.
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Ashwin said:
The sad reality is the increase of pensions by ~15,000 cr at this state. OROP really hurt the balance. I don't think we will ever recover without troops cutting.
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As I was saying!
 
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Ankit Kumar said:
Home Ministry important allocations

3.8 billion USD for CRPF

3 billion USD for BSF

1.6 billion USD for CISF

1 billion USD for SSB

994 million USD for ITBP

887 million USD for Assam Rifles

172 million USD for NSG

The Intelligence Bureau 422 million USD

The Special Protection Group (SPG)51 million USD

Rs 2,744.52 crore has been given for border infrastructure and management( 365 million USD )

Rs 565.72 crore has been allocated for the border area development programme ( 75 million USD)

Rs 3,659.84 crore has been allocated for improving police infrastructure. (492 million USD)
Click to expand...
https://twitter.com/x/status/1620760615701860352

Breakdown for 2023
Ashwin said:
Defence Budget CAPX 2023 FY - https://www.indiabudget.gov.in/doc/eb/sbe21.pdf
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Indian Coast Guard?
 
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Capitalout.jpeg
 
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