General News, Questions And Discussions - Indian Navy

Lolwa said:
Those Israeli Sa'ar class corvettes fit the description..
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The closest thing that fit the description are newer Russian 2200+ ton Corvettes under construction.

There's no way Saar will fit Brahmos in it. Those ships are specifically designed for Israel compromising on range and supplies for more weapons. Not the same. Unfit for our requirements.
 
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Ankit Kumar said:
The closest thing that fit the description are newer Russian 2200+ ton Corvettes under construction.

There's no way Saar will fit Brahmos in it. Those ships are specifically designed for Israel compromising on range and supplies for more weapons. Not the same. Unfit for our requirements.
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The sa'ar is a western design so the offensive platforms are much less capable. I actually feel we need a FREMM type frigate instead of the corvettes and mass produce them with more than 20-24 ships. And something like the Chinese type 22 missile boats for costal and local defense. We need to manufacture a cheap asHm like the yj-83 for that. The brahmos is just too big and expensive..
Also air defense destroyers like the British type 26
 
It all depends on how many of these missiles can be carried. That said, we need boats that can carry 12-18 Brahmos or the Nirbhay missiles for the land attack version of it. These boats are not going to sail alone but with proper protection from other vessels. You don't call them missile boats without the firepower. We need cheaper boats in numbers to supplement the larger ships we have built or building.
 
raghu1974 said:
It all depends on how many of these missiles can be carried. That said, we need boats that can carry 12-18 Brahmos or the Nirbhay missiles for the land attack version of it. These boats are not going to sail alone but with proper protection from other vessels. You don't call them missile boats without the firepower. We need cheaper boats in numbers to supplement the larger ships we have built or building.
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We need cheaper and smaller missiles first. Brahmos is just too expensive it just doesn't make economic sense to arm missile boats with brahmos. We need a missile in the class of harpoon and Yj-83 which can be easily be manufactured and deployed. Let the brahmos be for the more expensive frigates and destroyers..
 
Lolwa said:
The sa'ar is a western design so the offensive platforms are much less capable. I actually feel we need a FREMM type frigate instead of the corvettes and mass produce them with more than 20-24 ships. And something like the Chinese type 22 missile boats for costal and local defense. We need to manufacture a cheap asHm like the yj-83 for that. The brahmos is just too big and expensive..
Also air defense destroyers like the British type 26
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The P17A is there for that role and size. Hopefully with 2 shipyards building them, more orders for such will be placed.

NGC project is planned for light frigate with Brahmos capability. NGMV is planned for Brahmos/Nirbhay capability.

Brahmos will also find its way to replace the coastal anti ship batteries of Styx missiles. We need to place additional such batteries in A&N and Karwar in addition to Mumbai and Gujarat coast.

Smaller missile boats are not the way IN is planning. The vision is to have greater situational awareness with more number of assets available. And then using Brahmos to take out Sea Based targets.

Smaller anti ship missiles are not going to make cut now a days. It took 24 hits on a decommissioned OHP frigate from Harpoon/Hellfire/helicopter dropped torpedoes and submarine fired heavy torpedoes to sink it.

Smaller anti ship missile might damage a ship, but cannot make it stop working, while sinking it is a far off goal.

Whereas with a salvo of 3-4 Brahmos, even if half of the salvo goes through, a frigate size Target will be crippled at the very least.

Therefore Type022 missile boats are not really our requirements.

However there is a project for getting a cheaper shorter range missile in the class of Exocet/Kh35 to arm NGCs or OPVs to take out smaller targets.
 
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Lolwa said:
Brahmos is just too expensive it just doesn't make economic sense
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For land attack in general roles.

For HVTs Land Attack brahmos is fine. But for general attack its not economical. We need something cheaper of which in case of a war , we can fire 200-300 land attack CMs first along with artillery barrage before opening IBGs lead fronts.
 
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Ankit Kumar said:
For land attack in general roles.

For HVTs Land Attack brahmos is fine. But for general attack its not economical. We need something cheaper of which in case of a war , we can fire 200-300 land attack CMs first along with artillery barrage before opening IBGs lead fronts.
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That's why I am saying we need something in the class of harpoon/yj-83 /otomat but cheaper. A 250-350 km sub-sonic Ashm with comparitively smaller dimensions for overwhelming opponents in a small skirmish. The reason why type 22 missile boats seems a good idea from my perspective is to basically take care of enemy navies without exposing our more expensive ships. It's basically for Pakistani/Bangladeshi/Indonesian navies that might try something funny. The Pakistanis don't even need to leave their own sea boundaries to attack our assets. A 500-750 ton boat with 8-16 Ashm's could be a great sea denial asset. Our shipbuilding base is not that strong. So cheaper ships with decent endurance could offset our numbers differential. Since most of our bigger ships will be focused on the Chinese.
The Russian corvettes actually do use the brahmos though and are actually good design in a compact system. But a smaller class of littoral ships should be introduced along with a harpoon/otomat class missile...
 
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With missiles like Bhramos, the velocity of the missile will make all the difference. India might go for smaller but loaded missile boats in the future. Smaller boats with long range Bhramos / Nirbhay should be good enough to deal with TSP ports of Karachi & Gwadar.
 
Lolwa said:
We need cheaper and smaller missiles first. Brahmos is just too expensive it just doesn't make economic sense to arm missile boats with brahmos. We need a missile in the class of harpoon and Yj-83 which can be easily be manufactured and deployed. Let the brahmos be for the more expensive frigates and destroyers..
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Harpoon was a good missile, what we need now is NSM or similar missiles. Light weight, stealth flight profile and intelligent.
 
Hydra said:
Harpoon was a good missile, what we need now is NSM or similar missiles. Light weight, stealth flight profile and intelligent.
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The Swedish attack boat skjold class already uses the NSM. But I find the missile to expensive to be used compared to a harpoon. Plus developing a missile on par with the harpoon would be much faster compared to something on the level of the NSM.
 
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Lolwa said:
The Swedish attack boat skjold class already uses the NSM. But I find the missile to expensive to be used compared to a harpoon. Plus developing a missile on par with the harpoon would be much faster compared to something on the level of the NSM.
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Yeas it costly, but we should not move forward with yesterday technology.
 
Lolwa said:
Ofcourse I'm just looking at it more realistically. But I think a longer ranged version of the NASM SR will do the job in the future..
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Sad partbis that DRDO doesnt have any program similar to NSM, based on public information available. IN & DRDO keep on investing time & money on Brahmos & its variants. I do agree that Brahmos is a good missile but its not an answer to everything, some time may require a smart sneaking sea skimming contour following missile.

The west has already moved in that direction, the Norwegian NSM & USA's AGM158 anti ship missile variants are examples, if we didn't invest in AI based missile oike NSM, it will give headache for us.
 
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