Weren't we ordering 2 AWACS for prototyping ? Even that hasn't been cleared yet. 20 AWACS
, not with this budget. Especially with ISTAR project, MMRCA 2.0, Mk-1A, Ka-226 et al orders coming up. Frankly 20 NETRAs would be more realistic.Airborne Early Warning Systems - A-50EI Phalcon, DRDO Netra AEW&C, DRDO AWACS
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, not with this budget. Especially with ISTAR project, MMRCA 2.0, Mk-1A, Ka-226 et al orders coming up. Frankly 20 NETRAs would be more realistic.
Instead of going for C-295 as a platform for mounting NETRA AEW&C, why are we simply not ordering 7 more Embraer ERJ-145 for our NETRA project. Is the company still blacklisted??Weren't we ordering 2 AWACS for prototyping ? Even that hasn't been cleared yet. 20 AWACS
Weren't we ordering 2 AWACS for prototyping ? Even that hasn't been cleared yet. 20 AWACS
It's just a poorly written article, don't read too much into it. The 2 AWACS-India are set to become 6 in total, so the article has considered all 6 as already ordered. Beyond that, we most definitely need 10-15 more at least, 6 for each major geographical location alongside China-Pak, plus reserves and attrition replacements. Not counting any requirement necessary for the South and A&N Islands. And this would be very long term, beyond 2035. It's not going to happen anytime soon. You can average it out to 1 per year if you want to.
Very few will admit to this, but we need jets and AWACS in the South not just to deal with the PLAN, but to deal with the USN as well. They snoop around far too much.
Netra isn't survivable. If anymore are ordered, it will be nothing more than stop gap before AWACS-India comes into the picture. But with Embraer's corruption scandal, at least the current configuration is out of the picture.
I do think there will be logistical advantages to having commonality. But I will still support the DRDO AWACS as the sensor suite will be Indian.
It does have some advantages over the Phalcon, but the advantage isn't as big so as to justify acquiring it. Phalcon has a superior radar and inferior data links and sensor fusion abilities. Boeing knows it, thus they are promoting the Wedgetail rather mutely.
It's coz we lack the finances & NETRA is homegrown that we can order it in bulk. Hence you'd see the 6 DRDO built AWACS materializing somewhere around in the latter half of the 2020s whereas as a fleet of some 20 NETRAs will materialize by end 2030.
I'm sure it'd not be a stop gap arrangement as quantity has a quality of it's own. You could see the +2 of Phalcons anyday too as I'm sure even if discussions are in cold storage today due to price issues, they haven't been scrapped. Hence, emulating @randomradio here, let me go out on limb ( unlike randomradio) & predict by 2030 , we'd have 5 Phalcons, 6 DRDO AWACS ( ordered if not in hand) , 20 upgraded NETRAs ( ordered if not in hand) + 3 NETRAS.
Today's also the first day in my entire existence, I started boozing in the evening. It was bit chilly here & randomradio was an inspiration.So its true what they say, optimism rubs off.
IAF wants larger AWACS due to its decision making capabilities, which NETRA doesn't allow. The idea behind AWACS-India is to provide full C5I capability, including acting as a headquarters and also employing weapons. Otoh, GCI already does a better job than NETRA. So having 1 or 10 NETRAs may not make a difference to a fighter pilot who's already collecting data from his own aircraft's systems as well as ground based radars. Meaning, NETRA may be important when managing aircraft like LCA Mk1 or M2000 that are carrying weak radars, but with AESA equipped fighters, it will suddenly find itself lacking, to the point where it will just get in the way of conducting operations.
If those NETRAs are as mediocre as you suggest, what was the idea behind going in for it? Didn't the IAF factor in that all future FAs would be equipped with AESA? Including the Super Sukhoi upgrades ? Why did ACM Bhadauria make the claim as reported here a few months ago that he's looking at inducting more NETRAs? Are you better informed than him? Are we to assume that the NETRAs being planned are going to be the same as we've inducted earlier with no upgrades leave aside radical improvements? And what's this about DRDO AWACS also employing weapons? As far as I know, I doubt if the AWACS of any nation serving or planned include such an ability. But that's only as far as I know.
NETRA isn't mediocre, it's just that technology has reached a point that a much larger AWACS is simply indispensible and is incomparable.
There is room for more NETRAs, but only in the previous blacklisted configuration. Any new attempt will only come later than AWACS-India, making such an exercise pointless. Nothing more there.
It's not about being better informed, a lot of procurement decisions, especially the ones that are publicly talked about have political connotations. The air chief asking for 5 more NETRAs publicly is, as I said, fine in the present configuration, it will take only 3-4 years to get all 5 in, but this is also IAF's attempt to get some funds in their kitty that would normally be earmarked for something else, perhaps not for the IAF. It's all about fighting for that last piece of pizza. Normally, he wouldn't need to publicly say the IAF is interested in more NETRAs anyway. But considering it is of a lower priority and the company is blacklisted, he has to make his views public in order to make it seem important.
As for weapons, no, it's not the AWACS that's employing weapons, but the AWACS taking operational control of offboard weapons, like aircraft, SAMs and land attack cruise missiles. C&C decisions for SAMs and such are normally taken centrally. So AWACS with a larger air picture will be able to take more informed and quicker decisions as long as they have the hardware and personnel onboard, which is possible only on wide body AWACS like the IL-76 and A330. It's primarily about directing all elements in the battlefield. Today we are building or have the technology that can control all aspects of a battle, something called C5I or Command, Control, Communications, Computers, Collaboration and Intelligence. It's new age warfare, a system of systems. And AWACS is going to be central to this theme.
5th gen technology is such that something like the NETRA has become less important. A back seat Rafale driver will probably have more information to share than the NETRA will in the near future. The same with the upgraded MKI. NETRA was initiated back in 2003, when such technology didn't exist, so the IAF's procurement plans and requirements for as many as 20 NETRAs are from that time. In simple terms, NETRA is good, good enough to help support LCA, M-2000 etc, but in a few years it's going to become outdated. And a two-seat FGFA will make NETRA completely obsolete. AMCA may create the same effect at a later date. And procurement is done looking at a 20 to 40-year picture. NETRA barely even manages 5, let alone 10.
Some wrong assumptions there.
A Netra+ cannot be designed and inducted faster than AWACS-India, since a new platform has to be chosen, modified, built, integrated and tested. It's going to take the same time.
We have plenty of AWACS in case of war, as many as 6 right now. Even the 12 P-8Is can perform the role. Aerostats are also a pretty good addition to SA.
IL-76s do not have maintenance issues, but do have spares issues. But the IAF has been doing a good job of making sure enough spares are available for the Phalcon and IL-78s.