General News, Questions And Discussions - Indian Navy

@BMD this almost sounds like a sales pitch and it seems the Navy is interested. You got anything more on this ?
Did GE make the IEP of the Defender ? I thought it was Rolls-Royce. Well the IN has stated many times in the past they want their next destroyer to have IEP, this would be the right time to scout for technologies, partners and suppliers. The P-18 class(or whatever its called) seems to be on the drawing board. Sometime back I came across a research paper by an Indian organisation studying the ripple pattern in the sea as a large vessel moves, they were trying to find a way to minimise the ripples. I am thinking it was for the next destroyer, we'll see I guess. They seem to be very focused on signature management/reduction.
Excellent radar system (probably the best naval radar until SPY-6), low RCS, 48-cell air defence VLS, expandable to 64 cell VLS (with 16 cruise missile length tubes, e.g. Tomahawk or Nirbhay), with 2xquad Harpoon launchers (could be changed to Brahmos).

GE did the induction motors. It's basically a Type 45.
Type 45 destroyer - Wikipedia
 
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The State Department has made a determination approving a possible Foreign Military Sale to India of up to thirteen (13) MK 45 5 inch/62 caliber (MOD 4) naval guns and related equipment for an estimated cost of $1.0210 billion. The Defense Security Cooperation Agency delivered the required certification notifying Congress of this possible sale on November 19, 2019.

The Government of India has requested to buy up to thirteen (13) MK 45 5 inch/62 caliber (MOD 4) naval guns and three thousand five hundred (3,500) D349 Projectile, 5”/54 MK 92 MOD 1 Ammunition. Also included are other ammunition, spare parts, personnel training and equipment training, publications and technical data, transportation, U.S. Government and contractor technical assistance and other related logistics support. The total estimated cost is $1.0210 billion.

This proposed sale will support the foreign policy and national security of the United States by improving the security of a strategic regional partner.

The proposed sale will improve India's capability to meet current and future threats from enemy weapon systems. The MK-45 Gun System will provide the capability to conduct antisurface warfare and anti-air defense missions while enhancing interoperability with U.S. and other allied forces. India will use the enhanced capability as a deterrent to regional threats and to strengthen its homeland defense.

The proposed sale of this equipment and support will not alter the basic military balance in the region.

The principal contractor will be BAE Systems Land and Armaments, Minneapolis, Minnesota with gun manufacturing in Louisville, Kentucky. There are no known offset agreements proposed in connection with this potential sale. Any offset agreement required by India will be defined in negotiations between the purchaser and the contractor(s).

Implementation of this proposed sale will not require the assignment of additional U.S. Government and/or contractor representatives to India. However, U.S. Government or contractor personnel in country visits will be required on a temporary basis in conjunction with program technical oversight and support requirements.

There will be no adverse impact on U.S. defense readiness as a result of this proposed sale.

This notice of a potential sale is required by law and does not mean the sale has been concluded.

All questions regarding this proposed Foreign Military Sale should be directed to the State Department's Bureau of Political Military Affairs, Office of Congressional and Public Affairs, [email protected].
India – MK 45 Gun System | The Official Home of the Defense Security Cooperation Agency
 
With navy budget declining from 18% to 13%, navy will field 175 warships, instead of planned 200

By Ajai Shukla, 4th Dec 19
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The chief of naval staff (CNS), Admiral Karambir Singh, has admitted that the navy’s declining budget has forced him to re-evaluate his long-term plan to field 200 warships by 2027. This target is institutionalised in the navy’s Maritime Capability Perspective Plan (MCPP) for the period 2012-2027.

To media queries about how many ships could realistically be expected to be in service by 2027, the navy’s vice chief, Vice Admiral G Ashok Kumar replied “about 175”. The CNS, however, termed that figure “optimistic”.

Singh was addressing the media on Tuesday on the eve of Navy Day.

The navy currently has about 130 warships, he said, and another 50 are under construction in shipyards in and outside the country.

“The navy’s share of the defence budget has declined from 18 per cent in 2012 to approximately 13 per cent in the current financial year (2019-20)”, stated Singh.

The navy was allocated Rs 56,388 crore in 2019-20, of which Rs 25,656 crore was for capital expenditure, or the payment for new ships. An estimated 90 per cent of this was already earmarked for paying instalments for warships and equipment purchased in earlier years.

“We have projected [our additional requirement] and our hope is that we’ll get some more money. Based on that, we will prioritize our requirements so that the maritime interests of the country are not compromised”, said the CNS.

“Acceptance of Necessity” (the first step in procurement of military equipment) has also been accorded for 41 ships, 31 Helicopters, 24 Multi Role Helicopters and six additional P 8I maritime aircraft”, said Singh.

Singh explained that the expected shortage of warships would have to be compensated for by introducing high technology and building more capable warships. “Our aim will be to make sure that we get the maximum bang for the buck and by prioritisation, [improving] networking, and thinking deeper about how to improve the effects [of our weapons systems] rather than just bean counting”, he said.

Elaborating on this, Singh went on: “But more important is what you pack into your ships. If they’re modern and lethal then you have that much more in terms of effects.”

Asked how the navy compared with China’s navy, Singh replied: “They are doing what they have to do and moving at the pace they are capable of. We will move at the pace that we are capable of.”

On whether the budget crunch threatened to kill the project to build a third aircraft carrier, INS Vishal, which is planned to be built in Cochin Shipyard Ltd (CSL), Admiral Singh stated: “As naval chief, I’m convinced that the country requires three aircraft carriers.”

“There have been press reports against the aircraft carrier, but we are preparing our case and finalising our requirements, after which we will go up to the government for Acceptance of Necessity (AoN). Once the AoN is given, we will get into design consultancy on the exact contours of this aircraft carrier,” said the CNS.

Asked when the long-delayed indigenous aircraft carrier, INS Vikrant, would be completed by CSL, Singh revealed: “All ship building issues are over… We are almost certain that we will take delivery (of the carrier) by February-March 2021. After that… aviation trials will take about a year, since we will have to go to sea. We should have a fully operational carrier by 2022, equipped with the MiG-29K fighter.”

Broadsword: With navy budget declining from 18% to 13%, navy will field 175 warships, instead of planned 200
 
@vstol Jockey@randomradio@gautam@milspecs@blackindiaops @phalcon and others

does it make sense to use mig 29k in ins vikrant considering all the teething issues with it ,will it be able to perform consistently in protracted war considering the fact everytime it lands some of its avionics takes toll.
will it be able to blockade pakistan if tomorrow china supplies its carrier killer missile( granted there might be issues with accuracy but it will still pose the threat to the carrier) .
considering these fact it will be more prudent to have a long legged fighters so that it will itself stay away from the danger .
there is so much of differnce in the range of mig 29 k and superhornet so if indian navy attempting TEDBF should it not target the specification of f18/rafale??

any comment
 
@vstol Jockey@randomradio@gautam@milspecs@blackindiaops @phalcon and others

does it make sense to use mig 29k in ins vikrant considering all the teething issues with it ,will it be able to perform consistently in protracted war considering the fact everytime it lands some of its avionics takes toll.
will it be able to blockade pakistan if tomorrow china supplies its carrier killer missile( granted there might be issues with accuracy but it will still pose the threat to the carrier) .
considering these fact it will be more prudent to have a long legged fighters so that it will itself stay away from the danger .
there is so much of differnce in the range of mig 29 k and superhornet so if indian navy attempting TEDBF should it not target the specification of f18/rafale??

any comment
Mig-29K is a good aircraft and most of its problem have been solved. It is a potent platform and fully capable of delivering a strong punch.
 
@vstol Jockey@randomradio@gautam@milspecs@blackindiaops @phalcon and others

does it make sense to use mig 29k in ins vikrant considering all the teething issues with it ,will it be able to perform consistently in protracted war considering the fact everytime it lands some of its avionics takes toll.
will it be able to blockade pakistan if tomorrow china supplies its carrier killer missile( granted there might be issues with accuracy but it will still pose the threat to the carrier) .
considering these fact it will be more prudent to have a long legged fighters so that it will itself stay away from the danger .
there is so much of differnce in the range of mig 29 k and superhornet so if indian navy attempting TEDBF should it not target the specification of f18/rafale??

any comment
You'd be happy to note that in spite of the sub optimal performance of the MiG 29K , the IN is considering an additional shore based squadron as stand by , in view of the fact that the INS Vikrant ( IAC-1) is due for sea trials in 2021-22 & due to the fact that it's elevators , STOBAR particularly the arrested recovery systems were designed keeping the MiG-29K in mind.

So that's a good 60+ sub optimal platforms we will be using well into the 2030's & 40's if God forbid, the TE BDF doesn't make it to service by the mid 30's . In the true tried tested traditions of our MoD of supporting sub par frontline systems like the Jaguars, MiG-27s, etc.
 
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sir i was mainly concerned about the range difference of superhornet and mig

any particular reason ??
and how will it perform if it faces su 33 of china@vstol Jockey
You'd be happy to note that in spite of the sub optimal performance of the MiG 29K , the IN is considering an additional shore based squadron as stand by , in view of the fact that the INS Vikrant ( IAC-1) is due for sea trials in 2021-22 & due to the fact that it's elevators , STOBAR particularly the arrested recovery systems were designed keeping the MiG-29K in mind.

So that's a good 60+ sub optimal platforms we will be using well into the 2030's & 40's if God forbid, the TE BDF doesn't make it to service by the mid 30's . In the true tried tested traditions of our MoD of supporting sub par frontline systems like the Jaguars, MiG-27s, etc.
i have also come across with many saying basically russian pulled a trick and which has forced india to use only russian plane considering the lift space and all
whats your opinion
 
sir i was mainly concerned about the range difference of superhornet and mig

any particular reason ??
and how will it perform if it faces su 33 of china@vstol Jockey
Su-33 has far more problems and it can't take off with any kind of meaningful load from the PLAN carriers. Mig-29Ks are more than a match for them due to better avionics and sensors.
 
Mig-29K is a good aircraft and most of its problem have been solved. It is a potent platform and fully capable of delivering a strong punch.
Isn't it true that while some problems were resolved , the air frames have been exhibiting greater fatigue than was expected - one of the reasons the IN decided to back the ADA/ DRDO proposal of the TE DBF, which is primarily a replacement for the MiG 29K . It clearly implies that the IN would seek to consign them to shore based patrol duties and as stand by for the Aircraft Carriers in operation. That is what is purportedly the thinking of the IN as per multiplt credible sources in various defense fora & Twitter.
 
Su-33 has far more problems and it can't take off with any kind of meaningful load from the PLAN carriers. Mig-29Ks are more than a match for them due to better avionics and sensors.
so this reduces the gist of my question will it be able to blockade karachi if they have DF21 without putting itself (carrier) in danger
 
Isn't it true that while some problems were resolved , the air frames have been exhibiting greater fatigue than was expected - one of the reasons the IN decided to back the ADA/ DRDO proposal of the TE DBF, which is primarily a replacement for the MiG 29K . It clearly implies that the IN would seek to consign them to shore based patrol duties and as stand by for the Aircraft Carriers in operation. That is what is purportedly the thinking of the IN as per multiplt credible sources in various defense fora & Twitter.
yes they are even thinking to replace mig 29 by TEDBF by 2031
by that time mig will be fairly young and this tell the original story

may be they were tricked by russia and now considering the fact that both hornet and rafale faces issues on stobar and by this route they will try to replace mig by TEDBF
 
Isn't it true that while some problems were resolved , the air frames have been exhibiting greater fatigue than was expected - one of the reasons the IN decided to back the ADA/ DRDO proposal of the TE DBF, which is primarily a replacement for the MiG 29K . It clearly implies that the IN would seek to consign them to shore based patrol duties and as stand by for the Aircraft Carriers in operation. That is what is purportedly the thinking of the IN as per multiplt credible sources in various defense fora & Twitter.
Every aircraft has a different yardstick for fatigue calculation. The fatigue is based on number of hours and number of landings. When a fighter lands on deck, this fatigue is increased by a multiple to show increased fatigue. Mig-29K was a shore based aircraft and just like many other aircraft of similar type, this too suffers from reduction in life for every deck landing. However after consuming its deck based hours, it can continue to operate from shore just like F-18s and other such aircraft.
 
Every aircraft has a different yardstick for fatigue calculation. The fatigue is based on number of hours and number of landings. When a fighter lands on deck, this fatigue is increased by a multiple to show increased fatigue. Mig-29K was a shore based aircraft and just like many other aircraft of similar type, this too suffers from reduction in life for every deck landing. However after consuming its deck based hours, it can continue to operate from shore just like F-18s and other such aircraft.
so it means in forseeable future indian navy is going to take shore based defense role from air force??


considering all these looks like a they are making a correct call by going for clean slate design of twin engine non stealth plane .once it will satisfies the navy criteria who knows the naval tender will be cancelled altogether
and it might be even possible that iaf will even consider it to replace older MKI as it will be far cheaper to replace them with TEDBF rather than AMCA