India is not going to do anything to protect Israel.
Both wrong. XRSAM and QRSAM are not related to S-400 and NASAMS in any way.
Imported Missile Shield a risk
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India is not going to do anything to protect Israel.
Both wrong. XRSAM and QRSAM are not related to S-400 and NASAMS in any way.
So ridiculous. F404 was supposed to be the engine that powers LCA's TD. Kaveri's success or failure had nothing to do with the supply of F404. The supply of F404 is what's made LCA successful.
First of all, military equipments are meant for political usage, not traded on open market. So, if the west has gains from containing India, they will help Pakistan. USA has done this in the past. Now it may be difficult as India has become too strong on its own feet but even then the provision of intelligence information. Don't be too sure that India may not wage war with USA or UK.
Also, it is not in Indian interest to import weapons rather than do it indigenously. India already is making QRSAM and there is no reason to get NASAMS for protection.
S400 involves ToT license from Russia and Indian officials have said that negotiations for ToT are on the way. India wants to develop the missiles in India. If you are simply thinking that India will buy hyper expensive items in limited numbers for actually winning war, you are insane. Wars can only be won by quantity.
About, verification from imported items, I meant to say that the features and quality is compared to make it as good as possible. One can't simply know where is the peak limit or the different ideas and methods of working which can be obtained from imports.
Why do you think USA does not export to CHina? Because USA knows that China will plagiarise.
How do you know this? Why don't you think that India might have made a deal with Israel to help it by at least containing nearby neighbours from attacking Israel? There might have been a deal to help Israel, may be not on land but in the IOR in return for ToT favours of Israel.
XRSAM and S400 are similar and so are QRSAM and NASAMS.
India had RD33 as alternative option. F404 was not necessary
India is not in the job of protecting other countries. We only protect Bhutan because it's important to our own national security. And India does not interfere in the Middle East as a matter of policy, that's why we have good relations with both Israel and Iran.
So what if they are similar.
QRSAM has almost finished development, it will start user trials next year. NASAMS, we haven't even started contract discussions. So there is no question of NASAMS tech being used in QRSAM.
XRSAM and S-400 have zero relation. The S-400 has no ToT for its radar and C&C, it's just a purchase deal. We will only be manufacturing the missiles. And this missile ToT is maintenance and production ToT, which DRDO won't be getting because it's useless to them, they don't do maintenance or production. You can't do research with this ToT. XRSAM is expected to start testing long before we start taking deliveries of the S-400 anyway. And ToT absorption takes so long that S-400 will be obsolete by then.
Stop relating irrelevant stuff to each other just because there's "SAM" tagged next to it. All you are doing is insulting our own scientists.
RD-33 was a useless engine for the LCA. Go look up the dimensions of the engine and compare with the F404 and Kaveri. You can check Wiki links at least right?
Mainly because the differents shelters (C3I, radars, missiles sites...) were badly connected together. Cables not burried...
It was the first thing the coalition tried (with success) to destroy.
And a russian system is far too centralized : once the communications are stopped, the local systems are freezed.
you tried, badly, to rewrite the history..... result : a fake news.
India to spend $1 billion on advanced air defense system from US
India to spend $1 billion on advanced air defense system from US
By: Vivek Raghuvanshi 1 day ago
NASAMS was jointly developed by Norway’s Kongsberg and Raytheon based on the latter company’s Advanced Medium-Range Air-to-Air Missile. (Kongsberg)
NEW DELHI — India has quietly approved a plan to the National Advanced Surface-to-Air Missile System-II through a government-to government deal with United States.
The moves comes before September 6 “2+2 dialogue” between defense and foreign ministers of India and United States here to bolster bilateral defense and strategic partnership.
The apex defense procurement body, Defense Acquisition Council, headed by Defense Minister Nirmarla Sitaraman, has approved the buy of hte NASAMS-II, manufactured by Kongsberg and Raytheon, at more than $1 billion, a Ministry of Defense official confirmed.
The new system will replace India’s aging Russian Pechora air defense systems that protect strategic assets and locations, said an Indian air force official.
If this program is approved by the U.S., the deal will be expedited through foreign military sales. India is expected to issue the letter of request by end of this year.
IAF official noted that NASAMS-II will have to be modified to India specific requirements and will integrated with the service’s integrated command & control system.
India to spend $1 billion on advanced air defense system from US
By: Vivek Raghuvanshi 1 day ago
NEW DELHI — India has quietly approved a plan to the National Advanced Surface-to-Air Missile System-II through a government-to government deal with United States.
The moves comes before September 6 “2+2 dialogue” between defense and foreign ministers of India and United States here to bolster bilateral defense and strategic partnership.
The apex defense procurement body, Defense Acquisition Council, headed by Defense Minister Nirmarla Sitaraman, has approved the buy of hte NASAMS-II, manufactured by Kongsberg and Raytheon, at more than $1 billion, a Ministry of Defense official confirmed.
The new system will replace India’s aging Russian Pechora air defense systems that protect strategic assets and locations, said an Indian air force official.
If this program is approved by the U.S., the deal will be expedited through foreign military sales. India is expected to issue the letter of request by end of this year.
IAF official noted that NASAMS-II will have to be modified to India specific requirements and will integrated with the service’s integrated command & control system.
Kaveri was not developed as the funding and government sanctions were delayed. Naturally, this is something very serious and bound to raise suspicions if it gets too much exposure by having a domino effect on other things like LCA project. Most important part of deception is to cause diversion. If India found that it has no air fleet and nothing is being developed , it will raise an alarm and lead to investigation. To keep things under wraps, it is important to keep things limited in impact.
Kaveri was delinked from Tejas in 2007 and after that from 2008-2015, the development was minimal to absent. Read this about what Mohana Rao had to say in 2009:
Aero India 2009 - Page 8 - Bharat Rakshak
It should also be quite obvious that spending only 2100 crore till 2014 for Kaveri is too low. Kaveri budget had been raised to 2800 crore in 2004 itself. By 2008, it had used up 2000 crore (source: IAF not keen on French offer for Kaveri engine ). So, the expenditure till 2014 being 2100 crore means that only 100 crore was granted for 6 years. Is this called scientists fault?
From when did IPR start applying in defence items? There is no patent for defence items.
I did not claim that Nishant was a success. That project involved just 80 crore and was not a major project. Moreover, it was a rail launched UAV which is not really helpful. I was only saying that India imported no drones from 2015 till now.
Parrikar is not god that he can suddenly create new things. One has to understand that infratsructure development takes time and development of planes take time too. So, prematurely retiring the existing planes is not meaningful.
Show the evidence. Most of the stuff wasn't US tech anyways.
ME was heavily armed with Soviet stuff during the cold war.
Actually, everyone were trying to woo the ME as they had oil reserves. But, eventually, most of the Arabs made alliance with USA rather than USSR. Only Iraq and Syria were with USSR. Rest all were with USA by 1975.
In case you still haven't noticed , he's your old bosom buddy - Kshitij Sharma.Funding was authorized wef 1983 as per the desired (as requested by the nodal agency) amount to evolve GTX-35 for LCA (you read that right, the GTX-35 was planned in 1978, given a go ahead by GoI in 1983, officiallly sanctioned publicly in 1985 and GTX-35VS is the nomenclature for Kaveri right now?). Please check your facts. Not going to post stuff posted for years by members here and elsewhere.
So, as per your own citation here, the funds were 'sunk' (since initial funding started in 1983, with massive infusion in 1989? And why was GTX-35, planned as an engine for Indian fighter program after Marut experience, still struggling before US even was willing to consider transferring GE-404?
What is the expenditure cut off? Remember some 382.81 crores were granted in 1989 too ...source CAG 2010
https://www.cag.gov.in/sites/defaul..._Defence_Air_Force_and_Navy_16_2010_chap5.pdf
Really? Wonder why don't we ramp up numbers of Su-30s and T-72s and T-90s and BMPs then? Why do we pay royalty for every piece made in India? Please educate me on this aspect!
An analogy. Get it? Look up the word. Nishant was fully supported by the defence forces and an operational squadron was inducted. And they were a pathetic failure and kept falling out of the sky ... from an operational squadron ... due to technical faults ... leading to grounding of remaining piece (still left). And this, after DRDO had certified it as complete project. How is rail launch not helpful? You mean to say that at sea, rail launched UAVs from ships are not helpful?
I am speaking of MiG21 planes. India does not have replacement available indigenously and hence retiring them is not advisable till alternative comes by. Tejas is close to be ready with required fitment and technology for induction and once it is ready, MiG21 will be retired for good. Retiring it without alternative is premature
The GTRE engine development till 1996 was with an older turbojet of 1970s. The modern Kaveri started only in 1996. The initial funding was used to develop the required infrastructure and metallurgy etc. India had absolutely nothing in the beginning.
Did UPA exist in 1989? I am speaking of UPA sabotage. In 1989, the funds were sanctioned and was used up for basics and the turbojet engine of 1970s. I am speaking of fund sanction between 2008-2014 which was 100-200 crore and too minimal. Also, the specification of Kaveri was changed by IAF to make it higher thrust in mid-2000s which necessitated more funds, not less. Funding of 100-200 crore in 6 years is definitely fund cut.What is the expenditure cut off? Remember some 382.81 crores were granted in 1989 too ...
https://www.cag.gov.in/sites/defaul..._Defence_Air_Force_and_Navy_16_2010_chap5.pdf
Su30, T90 can't be mass produced because they were explicitly given as license production to be produced with full ToT. India however, uses the technology obtained from learning from Russian equipments in Indian ones. I am not speaking of making replicas but to only use the technology and ideas either by reverse engineering or study. When one is only reverse engineering off the shelf items, one can't gain 100% of the technology but only gain ideas of the technology which can be built upon.
To make replicas, one will need full ToT which will involve trust factor and hence breach of this trust must be avoided. There is no such trust or direct ToT with USA items. They are transactional in nature- favour for favour. There is no ToT and no contract or conditions apply on study of technology.
Nishant was indeed a failure. I don't disagree. Rail launched is not good enough as landing is a problem. It can't be used in sea launch as the surveillance time is just 4 hours. How will it land afterwards? The project cost was just 80 crore which meant that it was unlikely to be a serious project. It was a technology demonstrator looking at the low budget.
Why do you poke nose everywhere with your own conspiracy theory? OP is abusing me for being a conspiracy theorist while you are doing the same thing.
UPA main source of campaigning was NGOs funded by foreign funds. The spurt in NGOs during 2000-2010 was not a coincidence. You mao or LMAO makes no sense.
this is a bit simplistic. there are a lot of difficulties in reverse engineering high end equipment. to begin with, let me ask you this:
suppose you get an imported missile equipment,
how will you determine the composition of the alloys used in the casings?
even if you did know the composition, how would you know how to recreate the exact same composition?
there is a reason why Chinese knock offs wont work as long as the actual products. because the underlying knowledge is hard to come by and no one gives you that.
And NGO funding wins election, why did they loose in 2014? Did CIA scale back funding after 2010 to elect Modi then? I would refrain from commenting on (common) sense, given every post in ref is devoid of it.
I can find composition of all chemicals by taking samples and doing appropriate reaction with reagents. All elements except noble gases have unique reactions which will determine the composition of the chemical, including alloys.
India does not want high end blades manufacturing process but things like chemical of the fuel to be used in SFDR, the amount of time the nozzle has to open or close for certain thrust, the type of nozzle to be used, design of intake etc.
Similarly in NASAMS, India may learn how to stabilise the vehicle so as to be able to fire missile quickly, the high range radar with low power also can be learnt
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