Israel-Hamas Conflict: Updates & Discussions

Amarante said:
Sabotaging the Israel-Saudi Arabia normalisation process. This suits both Iran and the Ankara-Doha axis.

Remind the "Arab Street" around the world (including in the West) of the Palestinian cause.

Taking its own population hostage, obtaining more aid from the international community, aid that will benefit Hamas rather than the Gazan population.
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I can't see why the UN recognises Hamas at all. Okay the UN's record at achieving peace is sketchy at best but when an entity deliberately targets and murders >1,000 civilians, they're not even trying to achieve peace and should be barred from the UN. If Palestinians want a state, they need to get rid of Hamas first. They can have a state or they can have Hamas, they can't have both.
 
randomradio said:
It's a bit extreme this time.

www.ynetnews.com

It's time to rip off the Hamas band-aid

Opinion: In the wake of recent events, Israel cannot be satisfied with any other goal than the elimination of Hamas in Gaza as a military and governing body; Anything less would be an Israeli failure
www.ynetnews.com www.ynetnews.com

The Israelis are treating it as an existential threat. They want to eliminate Hamas to the point where they are even willing to use nukes. As per the former head of the Israeli National Security Council. The goal this time is to remove people from Gaza entirely.
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Israel does what we only talk about. We should have done exactly the same thing in Kashmir, West Bengal and Kerala. Would have solved all our problems once and for all.
 
Saaho said:
Israel does what we only talk about. We should have done exactly the same thing in Kashmir, West Bengal and Kerala. Would have solved all our problems once and for all.
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This is not an era of war : PM Modi
Innominate said:
What's going on? If you see all the naval firepower that is there you'd think they were facing off with the Soviets. This is not about gaza or maybe even hezbollah all those ships are there for something else.
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For Chinese and Russian backed Iran
 
BMD said:
Iran would have nothing left to strike with inside a few weeks. Their navy and air force would cease to exist inside a week. You've seen a very limited quantity and variety of US munitions making a mockery of Russian air defences, so Iran has no chance against a full out strike. And if they try block they straight, they will have the whole of of NATO on them and neighbouring Sunni countries, worse than Iraq did in 1991. Iraq had the 4th largest military at the time remember, well ahead of Iran.
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Iran's goal is to attack oil infrastructure and shipping before its taken out, ie, take the entire world hostage. So they are not relying on their air force and navy. Their goal is to survive long enough to act against their hostage.

So you can destroy all of their infrastructure and more, but the entire world will definitely feel it.
 
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Saaho said:
Israel does what we only talk about. We should have done exactly the same thing in Kashmir, West Bengal and Kerala. Would have solved all our problems once and for all.
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If we were not reliant on oil and foreign investment, we would have had the ability to be equally assertive.

But it's not too late for us. We only have to do two things, bring in UCC and get rich. UCC will force the peacefuls to abide by the constitution and give peaceful women an actual education, and getting rich will remove the threat of outside inerference. Look at how smoothly China did it after they got rich.

We also need significant changes in our education system so we can catch them young.
 
@Innominate

This is what the US is up against.
www.businessinsider.in

China has the capacity to build PLA combat ships at 200 times the rate that the US can, per leaked US Navy intelligence

The information was seen on a leaked US Navy briefing slide. The US Navy has since confirmed the slide's authenticity.
www.businessinsider.in www.businessinsider.in

www.navalnews.com

Pentagon assesses the PLA Navy’s modernization and growing aggression - Naval News

The Chinese Navy (PLA Navy) continues to grow in size and capabilities, according to the latest Pentagon report on China's military.
www.navalnews.com www.navalnews.com
Interestingly, it alleges that two Type 093B SSNs were launched at Huludao shipyard between May 2022 and January 2023.

200 times the build rate and 2 SSNs launched in a span of 6 months, the two go hand-in-hand.
 
randomradio said:
Turkey.
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Namaskar 🙏
I think that Erdogan's aggressive rhetoric is only being used for internal purposes, in view of the forthcoming parliamentary [edit: municipal] elections:

(…) What is happening in the Gaza Strip is a massacre and a war crime", the Turkish President literally declared, "and this massacre is the work of the West. The West is sending Israel forward because it doesn't want to get its hands dirty. The Jewish state is just a pawn used by the West that will one day be sacrificed.

(…) As with his previous rhetorical attacks on the West, Erdogan's main concern this time is domestic politics. Municipal elections are due to be held in Turkey in five months' time, in which the President wants to take back the major cities of Istanbul and Ankara from the opposition. This weekend's rally was a kind of show of strength for the AKP ahead of the election campaign. Erdogan claimed that around 1.5 million people turned out for the event. That's probably an exaggeration, but the images of the sea of Turkish flags at the rally and Erdogan's accusations against the West are good campaign material for the president and his party.(…)
www.tagesspiegel.de

Aus Kritik an Israel wird Wut auf den Westen: USA und Europa laut Erdogan schuld an „Kriegsverbrechen“ in Gaza

Der türkische Präsident rückte die Operation gegen die Hamas in die Nähe der Kreuzzüge und macht den Westen verantwortlich. Dahinter steht auch innenpolitisches Kalkül.
www.tagesspiegel.de www.tagesspiegel.de
 
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Amarante said:
Namaskar 🙏
I think that Erdogan's aggressive rhetoric is only being used for internal purposes, in view of the forthcoming parliamentary [edit: municipal] elections:

(…) What is happening in the Gaza Strip is a massacre and a war crime", the Turkish President literally declared, "and this massacre is the work of the West. The West is sending Israel forward because it doesn't want to get its hands dirty. The Jewish state is just a pawn used by the West that will one day be sacrificed.

(…) As with his previous rhetorical attacks on the West, Erdogan's main concern this time is domestic politics. Municipal elections are due to be held in Turkey in five months' time, in which the President wants to take back the major cities of Istanbul and Ankara from the opposition. This weekend's rally was a kind of show of strength for the AKP ahead of the election campaign. Erdogan claimed that around 1.5 million people turned out for the event. That's probably an exaggeration, but the images of the sea of Turkish flags at the rally and Erdogan's accusations against the West are good campaign material for the president and his party.(…)
www.tagesspiegel.de

Aus Kritik an Israel wird Wut auf den Westen: USA und Europa laut Erdogan schuld an „Kriegsverbrechen“ in Gaza

Der türkische Präsident rückte die Operation gegen die Hamas in die Nähe der Kreuzzüge und macht den Westen verantwortlich. Dahinter steht auch innenpolitisches Kalkül.
www.tagesspiegel.de www.tagesspiegel.de
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It appears the EU is helping Turkey trying to do damage control.

But what's the actual situation on the ground?

If Erdogan was just posturing for his domestic audience, the Israelis wouldn't have exited the country or announced a reassessment of relations.

Otoh, Egypt is listening to Israel regarding the treatment of Gaza. And France doesn't seem to be the type to enter the war alongside the US in this case. against Iran or Hama. But Egypt and France are allied against Turkey.

Interesting times.
 
randomradio said:
Iran's goal is to attack oil infrastructure and shipping before its taken out, ie, take the entire world hostage. So they are not relying on their air force and navy. Their goal is to survive long enough to act against their hostage.
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It won't though, that's my point. The US and Canada has enough oil to sustain a war for many times longer than anything Iran has to strike with will last.
randomradio said:
So you can destroy all of their infrastructure and more, but the entire world will definitely feel it.
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Not for very long. Trying to take the entire world hostage is a really shit idea for obvious reasons, you make a lot of enemies all at once, with obvious consequences.
 
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randomradio said:
It appears the EU is helping Turkey trying to do damage control.

But what's the actual situation on the ground?

If Erdogan was just posturing for his domestic audience, the Israelis wouldn't have exited the country or announced a reassessment of relations.

Otoh, Egypt is listening to Israel regarding the treatment of Gaza. And France doesn't seem to be the type to enter the war alongside the US in this case. against Iran or Hama. But Egypt and France are allied against Turkey.

Interesting times.
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Erdogan has lost the plot. When a group drags 1400 civilians out on the street and shoots them, they're definitely a terror organisation, there is absolutely no debating that, and whether or not they're Israeli civilians is inconsequential to that definition.

Hamas definitely isn't a liberation organisation, because they are the single biggest impediment to Palestinian statehood. Palestine will never get statehood with Hamas at its helm, because no one will allow a group like that to claim that terrorist acts like this were successful in achieving anything.

Israel is playing into their enemies' hands though. A war was what Hamas's foreign backers wanted, with the hope that it would spread. If they didn't want a war, they wouldn't have started one.
 
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randomradio said:
(…)

If Erdogan was just posturing for his domestic audience, the Israelis wouldn't have exited the country or announced a reassessment of relations.
(…)
Interesting times.
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The "waltz" of ambassadors remains diplomacy: theatre. Nothing serious.

We'll see if Erdogan turns off the tap on oil destined for Israel, almost half of which transits through Turkey from Kazakhstan and Azerbaijan. Let's see if the "Sultan" has the balls to translate his assertive words into action.
I don't think he will.

Yes indeed, interesting times.
 
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Looks like the Israelis really plan to demolish Gaza completely.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1718927734552826050

I guess the Palestinians will have to rebuild in the Sinai.
BMD said:
It won't though, that's my point. The US and Canada has enough oil to sustain a war for many times longer than anything Iran has to strike with will last.

Not for very long. Trying to take the entire world hostage is a really shit idea for obvious reasons, you make a lot of enemies all at once, with obvious consequences.
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They are not gonna care. They are used to the whole world hating on them. But Russia and China will still support them.
 
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BMD said:
Erdogan has lost the plot. When a group drags 1400 civilians out on the street and shoots them, they're definitely a terror organisation, there is absolutely no debating that, and whether or not they're Israeli civilians is inconsequential to that definition.

Hamas definitely isn't a liberation organisation, because they are the single biggest impediment to Palestinian statehood. Palestine will never get statehood with Hamas at its helm, because no one will allow a group like that to claim that terrorist acts like this were successful in achieving anything.

Israel is playing into their enemies' hands though. A war was what Hamas's foreign backers wanted, with the hope that it would spread. If they didn't want a war, they wouldn't have started one.
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Yep, Hamas are indeed terrorists. The amount of international support they have is ridiculous. Luckly only the unimportant countries are supporting them.

Israel will be fine as long as Turkey and Iran don't take action. It doesn't look like Iran's interested, it's almost day 3 of the "SMO."
 
Amarante said:
The "waltz" of ambassadors remains diplomacy: theatre. Nothing serious.

We'll see if Erdogan turns off the tap on oil destined for Israel, almost half of which transits through Turkey from Kazakhstan and Azerbaijan. Let's see if the "Sultan" has the balls to translate his assertive words into action.
I don't think he will.

Yes indeed, interesting times.
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They don't have the military strength to fight Israel though, that's for sure. And there's enough deterrence from both the US and France to prevent them from trying anything else.

Oil won't be used as a bargaining chip, it's too small in quantity, which Israel can easily get from other sources.

At worst, we will probably see him working against Israeli interests in Syria.
 
BMD said:
As regards the sentiments expressed by the masses - hardly surprising given the last 75 years. Compare it to the many biases expressed by Indians on this forum for instance.
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We are not biased, we merely know what fights to pick. Unless it involves the IOR, Pak or Western China, we are not interested. Our "biases" are merely dependent on what we get from others regardless of their own relationship with third parties, which is how the world should function. And, of course, f&*k terrorism and proxy wars, we don't do sh!t like that.

We are on a pedestal that you can only look up at and you are just grumpy about that.
 
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