LCA Tejas Mk1 & Mk1A - News and discussions

 
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Hydra said:
Click to expand...

This is 2014 data

LCA was nearly dead in 2014 when Mr Parrikar revived it by pushing Both
DRDO and IAF
 
Hydra said:
Click to expand...

The data may be old, but this is how DPSUs hold forces hostage and later claim that forces are not supporting indigenous products.

ATAGS is going through the same process, has full IA support, but the evaluation process is still not complete. Still people complain about how the IA is sabotaging the project, to the point where they want to criticise ongoing import projects like the Israeli ATHOS, when minimum proven capability is sorely needed.

QRSAM was supposed to begin induction in 2019-20. Now that date has moved to 2021-22. From a 4-year project, it has become 6. IA suggested they will import 3 regiments of QRSAM while DRDO develops their version. But with false promises, DRDO scuttled any attempt to import minimum capability and the IA is stuck with an air defence capability that even third rate nations can penetrate.

MPATGM seems to be following in the QRSAM's footsteps, I hope it doesn't. DRDO scuttled the minimum needed Spike contract in 2017 and the IA still doesn't have any modern ATGMs today. DRDO had promised to deliver the missile for user trials in 2020, so let's see if they have managed that.

Arjun is a never-ending project. It has assured employment of scientists through two generations and is entering the third generation.
 
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randomradio said:
Parrikar didn't revive anything. IAF were desperate for a Mig-21 replacement, had no choice save for LCA, made a few suggestions that were achieveable and HAL delivered it.
Click to expand...

Yes , LCA survived because of Parrikar

IAF Said , " We want MK 2 " because MK 1 is insufficient for our needs
That would have meant no planes after MK 1

Mk 1A is a solution forced upon IAF till MK 2 is completed --- that is entirely Creditable to Mr Parrikar
 
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randomradio said:
The data may be old, but this is how DPSUs hold forces hostage and later claim that forces are not supporting indigenous products.
Click to expand...

What the forces do not appreciate is that DOLLARS do not grow on trees

We cannot print Dollars , so indigenization is necessary

It is good that China is breathing down our necks

That will automatically support domestic equipment and products

Ultimately it comes down to the political leadership

For 10 years UPA encouraged imports
Because of KICKBACKS

So why will the Forces support indigenization
 
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lcafanboy said:
Image is right. They do have quad racks but it reduces manoeuvrability of the fighters and hence are not suitable for dog fights. Americans do not believe in dog fights and guns.
Their concept is simple use highly networked warfare with force multipliers like AWACS, Sensor fusion from various sources and use stand off weapons like longer range BVRs fire and scoot/leave. They don't believe in manoeuvrability, look at F35s.
Click to expand...
I would say f-35 are pretty maneuverable. The f-35 being a bad dogfighter is not true. It is for the most party superior to the fa/18 which makes it certainly one of the better dogfighters.
 
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STEPHEN COHEN said:
This is 2014 data

LCA was nearly dead in 2014 when Mr Parrikar revived it by pushing Both
DRDO and IAF
Click to expand...
People used to blame IAF in 2014 too. The essences of his tweet is allegations on fighting force for not supporting indigenous products are baseless. Its the development agency to be blamed instead.
Its true indian made products sucks when comes to quality and timelines.

randomradio said:
The data may be old, but this is how DPSUs hold forces hostage and later claim that forces are not supporting indigenous products.

ATAGS is going through the same process, has full IA support, but the evaluation process is still not complete. Still people complain about how the IA is sabotaging the project, to the point where they want to criticise ongoing import projects like the Israeli ATHOS, when minimum proven capability is sorely needed.

QRSAM was supposed to begin induction in 2019-20. Now that date has moved to 2021-22. From a 4-year project, it has become 6. IA suggested they will import 3 regiments of QRSAM while DRDO develops their version. But with false promises, DRDO scuttled any attempt to import minimum capability and the IA is stuck with an air defence capability that even third rate nations can penetrate.

MPATGM seems to be following in the QRSAM's footsteps, I hope it doesn't. DRDO scuttled the minimum needed Spike contract in 2017 and the IA still doesn't have any modern ATGMs today. DRDO had promised to deliver the missile for user trials in 2020, so let's see if they have managed that.

Arjun is a never-ending project. It has assured employment of scientists through two generations and is entering the third generation.
Click to expand...
Exactly, but ine year delay in QRSAM is far far better scenario in other DRDO products.
And regarding shoulder launched ATAGMs, only god know what will happened to our armed forces.
The reason i dont support import ban on military item is it will give monopoly for indian made shits over better quality products and our force gonna suffer.

STEPHEN COHEN said:
What the forces do not appreciate is that DOLLARS do not grow on trees

We cannot print Dollars , so indigenization is necessary

It is good that China is breathing down our necks

That will automatically support domestic equipment and products

Ultimately it comes down to the political leadership

For 10 years UPA encouraged imports
Because of KICKBACKS

So why will the Forces support indigenization
Click to expand...
Military is not finance management entity for our country. Its a fighting force for our nation. Its our aka India's responsibility to provide military the top end equipment or the equipment they want. Political or bureaucracy failed to bring our economy on track and they are finding an easy way to revive economy by providing shit indian made materials to our own fighting force.
Yeah the Chinese invasion must be an eye opener for a political leadership in general, hope they will modernise military with proper gears.

Do you have any substantiating evidence to back your claim on kickbacks in UPA era?
 
Hydra said:
People used to blame IAF in 2014 too. The essences of his tweet is allegations on fighting force for not supporting indigenous products are baseless. Its the development agency to be blamed instead.
Its true indian made products sucks when comes to quality and timelines.
Click to expand...

Everything Flows fron the TOP

Did UPA ever talk about Indigenisation

They were busy in kickbacks from imports

Ofcourse IAF will prefer RAFALES over LCA , but a space has to be carved out for Indigenous Technology

Secondly and more importantly
The "shortcomings of Feb 27 " CAN NOT be blamed on DRDO

So who allowed IAF' s technological edge to be blunted

Our enemies are "Good " people

Because of them we will be forced to focus on indigenous products
 
STEPHEN COHEN said:
Everything Flows fron the TOP

Did UPA ever talk about Indigenisation

They were busy in kickbacks from imports

Ofcourse IAF will prefer RAFALES over LCA , but a space has to be carved out for Indigenous Technology

Secondly and more importantly
The "shortcomings of Feb 27 " CAN NOT be blamed on DRDO

So who allowed IAF' s technological edge to be blunted

Our enemies are "Good " people

Because of them we will be forced to focus on indigenous products
Click to expand...
You can tell everything was a failure under UPA. They didn't induct anything,but if you said they favoured import will differ with you.

They did wherever it is feasible. Yeah they were not a loud mouth like this present government.

I will blame government for feb26 incident, IAF for febe 27 and government again for post feb27 incident. In first place government should not have allowed for that strike when we were I'll prepared . We send 40 year old mirages for that mission,that itself is a testimony on how ancient is IAF's inventory. Feb27 yeah IAF should have mor cautious and wise enough to stay away from ROE.

It's the goi who blunted our military,I said goi . Don't bring congress or bjp ,both has given damn about our military.

IAF is the ultimate user for an aircraft,tell me what LCA mk1 will do against Chinese?Even MK1a will be useless against Chinese.
 
If we think that delays in indigenous weapon projects is unique to India, then we are wrong. We want to compete with countries like US, France and China who have both technology, money and decades old experience in the defense R&D / production. In India we don't have either in sufficient quantity / quality. That said, we are getting there but to do it at the same pace at other countries, is a distant dream for another decade or so. This current government has the stomach to absorb all the issues and still stay on course in supporting indigenous weapon systems. Let us hope this government continue to support Atmanirbarta and the subsequent governments support it, otherwise this will be a futile effort.
 
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STEPHEN COHEN said:
Sir , I found this picture of F 15 on Twitter

Is it even true , 4 missiles in one Pylon

Click to expand...
22 AAM.... is it a clue of the small pk of AMRAAM they need to carry so many?
lcafanboy said:
Americans do not believe in dog fights and guns.
Click to expand...
This is why F22 carry an internal 200mm gun and 2 short range IR missile.
This is why the F35 death star carry 2 short range missile.
:unsure::LOL::ROFLMAO:
 
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Lolwa said:
I would say f-35 are pretty maneuverable. The f-35 being a bad dogfighter is not true. It is for the most party superior to the fa/18 which makes it certainly one of the better dogfighters.
Click to expand...
It is so agile that a clean F35 was smashed by a dual seater F16 loaded with 2 external tanks. Nice agility indeed. (y)
 
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Wow lot of updates in Twitter by Hellfire.

Wrt Tejas , above mentioned data shows approximately 1 flight test done every 10 days per aircraft.

Because of failure to complete tejas program on time 20,000 cr had to be spent on upgrade s of other types of aircraft.

On the whole to me it looks, if IAF is getting blamed, it should demand more control of project.

If so much is spent on other upgrade s, they should be ready to spend on tejas to accelerate it's completion.

( I understand that money provided is itself not utilized properly)

Still can't accept such a huge amount is getting away which infact should have made tejas a big success
 
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Sathya said:
Wow lot of updates in Twitter by Hellfire.

Wrt Tejas , above mentioned data shows approximately 1 flight test done every 10 days per aircraft.

Because of failure to complete tejas program on time 20,000 cr had to be spent on upgrade s of other types of aircraft.

On the whole to me it looks, if IAF is getting blamed, it should demand more control of project.

If so much is spent on other upgrade s, they should be ready to spend on tejas to accelerate it's completion.

( I understand that money provided is itself not utilized properly)

Still can't accept such a huge amount is getting away which infact should have made tejas a big success
Click to expand...

There is no point in crying over the past

Success in Indigenization is a very long and painful journey

And all stakeholders ie GOI , DRDO and the services have to work as dedicated members of the same team

In India , the political direction is most important

We need the PM' s Direct involvement
Even in small things like Toilets and Bank accounts

This new push for " Aatm nirbhar Bharat " will go a Long way in realizing goals of Self Reliance
 
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Bon Plan said:
It is so agile that a clean F35 was smashed by a dual seater F16 loaded with 2 external tanks. Nice agility indeed. (y)
Click to expand...
You are talking about f 16. That thing gives most fighters a bad time and is one of the best energy dogfighter if not the best. F 18 and f16 are two entirely different aircrafts....
 
Hydra said:
Exactly, but ine year delay in QRSAM is far far better scenario in other DRDO products.
And regarding shoulder launched ATAGMs, only god know what will happened to our armed forces.
The reason i dont support import ban on military item is it will give monopoly for indian made shits over better quality products and our force gonna suffer.
Click to expand...

I have named the 3 best DRDO managed projects for the IA, and how even their best projects have held the IA for ransom. Their worst managed projects, like Arjun, you cannot even imagine.
 
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Lolwa said:
I would say f-35 are pretty maneuverable. The f-35 being a bad dogfighter is not true. It is for the most party superior to the fa/18 which makes it certainly one of the better dogfighters.
Click to expand...

The F-35A has excellent dog fighting skills, it just sucks when it comes to acceleration and climb, which is bad news for air forces that want to use the F-35A for air superiority.

In the IAF, it's the best when it comes to role replacement of the Jaguar and Mig-27.
 
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STEPHEN COHEN said:
What the forces do not appreciate is that DOLLARS do not grow on trees

We cannot print Dollars , so indigenization is necessary

It is good that China is breathing down our necks

That will automatically support domestic equipment and products

Ultimately it comes down to the political leadership

For 10 years UPA encouraged imports
Because of KICKBACKS

So why will the Forces support indigenization
Click to expand...

Not at all. DRDO sucked for most of their history and only started delivering since the last 5 years. It's just a coincidence that Modi came to power during that time.

Also, the LCA Mk1A is HAL's brainchild, they only used Parrikar to convince the IAF to go for it. The IAF found that it's a good enough replacement for the Mig-21 as long as it came with an AESA radar, which is why they accepted it. This could have been done under Anthony as well, if he was in power instead of Parrikar. Basically, the LCA Mk1A meet the minimum requirements needed for large scale induction, that's about it. You are free to credit Parrikar for Mk1A, but it wasn't his achievement.
 
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