I think a temporary slow down is worth the cost of acquiring better capabilities and learning more advanced design principles from global leaders in this field.
Shivalik-class & Nilgiri-class (Project 17 A/B) Frigates : Discussions
- Thread starter Ashwin
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Turns out the Aussies are buying a few Mogami class hulls and an offer has also been made to Indonesia. So the Japs might be serious this time around.
But the Unicorn is only one part (comms+ ew) of the fully integrated main mast on the Mogami. This includes the ship's main radar and EOTS sensors. It'd be great if the Japs could share design data on it.
The rest we've got covered pretty much.
But the Unicorn is only one part (comms+ ew) of the fully integrated main mast on the Mogami. This includes the ship's main radar and EOTS sensors. It'd be great if the Japs could share design data on it.
The rest we've got covered pretty much.
Mogami's combat suite is very limited compared to nilgiri, even the upgraded mogami won't match nilgiri.
Its hull survivability & redundancy also differ in many areas compared to Indian navy's requirements.
Mogami is a work of art but within the limits of what it was designed for.
Nilgiri is also a very capable design, especially with much higher combat capabilities.
I understand. I'm talking about taking what are are doing better than us like design which enables better crew efficiency and automation, metallurgy, manufacturing methods, stealth reduction methods, some say better multi mission flexibility while we retain our superior fire power and air defence capability and other combat systems in it.
Not to mention that the Mogami class of frigates built so far do not feature any VLS cells.
Eventually they will be retrofited with 16 Mk41 VLS cells, with each cell capable of packing 4 ESSM for a total of 64 ESSM for AD duties.
But in our scenario, we neither operate the ESSM nor the Mk41, so the frigate design will have to be extensively reworked to accomodate MRSAM or VL-SRSAM.
Also, the primary radar onboard the Mogami and its upgraded cousin is the OPY-2 X-band radar, which although provide greater resolution for targeting tracking & engagement sufferly greatly in wet weather conditions & clutter.
Repurposing the Mogami to fit into the Navy's doctrine would be a hassle and not worth the cost.
I agree with the comment shared. Unnecessary hype often gets created by using obscure/vague statements and ultimately fades away. Most of these are short term PR campaigns to garner attention and see results (interest) in the product. News about the mast being offered has been floating around for a while now as shared by @Speedster1.
The MoU was signed in 2024.
Frankly, I find it a bit odd that the IN is working on integrated mast only for comms+esm at a time when multi-function masts are becoming standard around the world. Ships like the French FDI class combine radar, ew/esm, eots, comms, etc in one single mast. The only exception I can think of is nav radar and perhaps CIWS.
I get that we've historically preferred redundancy in the event of battle damage. However, small ships can certainly use the extra space for weapons, supplies, etc. Unless there are emi/emc, topside weight or stability issues we don't know about.
I get that we've historically preferred redundancy in the event of battle damage. However, small ships can certainly use the extra space for weapons, supplies, etc. Unless there are emi/emc, topside weight or stability issues we don't know about.
which is why we do it for the next frigate class and for the p18B not for this class. We need the p17Bs badly, cant afford too many delays
as long as we are ready to acquire the capability for current generation or next generation platforms, I'm good with it.
Many of our older weapons systems are Russian platforms improved with western tech, we could do the same to improve our newer Indigenous platforms by acquiring technology transfers for parts or systems where others are ahead.
Switching into a completely different class like Mogami means not just ship but also all the associated equipment and ecosystem(a lot of which are American BTW). And even if we get past that by the time we learn these tech, a new class would have emerged and it would be rinse and repeat. It would actually be better if we are behind by a gen for some time but focus on building our own capabilities based on existing platforms
There is next to zero chance of India buying the Mogami design. Rest assured.
read my last comment, I'm not talking about buying their platforms but codevelopment for Indian needs or tot for tech they are ahead like Unicorn mast etc
....... isnt this exactly what were a re doing alr? the only thing we need from them is the unicorn mast and maybe railgun(lets see how the tech matures)
I gave just one example, their design seems more efficient, just look at the crew required for the Mogami class which is 90 vs Nilgiri class which is 226 (although there are other factors like weapons system integrated and what not, we still got to agree they have managed to reduce the crew size), there is also automation and drone warfare, better stealth reduction techniques, their command information centre also seems like a more efficient design, probably better materials or ship building methods along with integrated composite masts etc while Nilgiri has better fire power but incorporating technologies from mogami will help make our platforms stay future proof longer, fewer crew, smarter system, native unmanned integration etc
Although I do wanna add that our Navy ships look way better than American ones.
MDL today delivered the Fourth Frigate of the P17A Class, Mahendragiri to the Indian Navy
mahendragiri started in had its keel laid in 28/6/22 and launched by 1/9/23 with delivery now on 30/4/26. less than 4 years from keel to commission is incredible. genuinely hope we can have a 4.5 year pace for the p17B class and maybe even the P18 class(stretch with the 13k tonne hull)
we will probably see a dual commission once again with dunagiri and mahendragiri
So does that mean we have launched 6 of the Nilgiri class frigates as of now and will finishing launching all 7 by the end of the year?
Also, am I the only one who thinks our ships look cooler than the Japanese or US ones?
Also, am I the only one who thinks our ships look cooler than the Japanese or US ones?
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