Shivalik Class (Project 17 A/B) & Talwar Class Frigates
- Thread starter Ashwin
- Start date
I think DRDO will start quad packing VL-SRSAMs on UVLMs. If we can standardize a single type of launcher for our ships only then can we expect an increase in quantity.
Even then increase in VLS cells probably will happen in the next gen ships.
INS Delhi, INS Shivalik, INS Satpura, INS Sahyadri, INS Ranvijay
Stealth frigates from Russia to be delivered in September 2024, February 2025
Stealth frigates for Indian Navy delayed by COVID, war in Ukraine, and sanctions, set for delivery starting September.
First ship Tushil is ready for acceptance by the Indian Navy and is scheduled to be delivered by September. The commissioning crew reached Russia earlier this month,” a defence official in the know said. “The second ship Tamal is expected to be delivered by February 2025.”
In October 2016, India and Russia signed an Inter-Governmental Agreement for the four stealth frigates, two directly imported and two to be manufactured by Goa Shipyard Limited (GSL). A $1-billion deal was subsequently signed for the two frigates under direct purchase. In November 2018, the GSL signed a $500 mn deal with Rosoboronexport of Russia for material, design and specialist assistance to locally manufacture the two frigates, and in January 2019, the contract was signed between the Indian Defence Ministry and GSL. All the four ships are powered by engines from Zorya-Mashproekt of Ukraine.
As per schedule, GSL is scheduled to deliver the first ship in 2026 and the second one six months later. Defence officials expressed confidence that they would be delivered on schedule. “Construction at GSL is progressing and lunch (into water) of the first ship would take place in the next couple of months,” another defence source said.
Mazagon, Garden Reach Shipbuilders lead race for Defence Ministry's ₹70,000 crore warships order
Defence ministry's ₹70,000 crore approval for Project 17B warships boosts MDL's Kalvari class submarines, Project 15B destroyers, and GRSE's patrol vessels and exports. MDL and GRSE, constructing Nilgiri class under Project 17A, will split the order for quicker delivery. Stealth frigates feature...
Rs 70,000 cr means it's 8 hulls, approximately $1 billion per ship. Let's hope this time they can keep the 4-year timeline.
This could also mean that NGC will be deprioritized.
New Delhi: The defence ministry is set to clear a mega ₹70,000 crore order for new warships for the Indian Navy. The stealth frigates will be the most advanced ships to be built in India and are a follow-on of the Nilgiri class that are currently under construction.
Sources said that state-run yards - Mazagon Dockyards Limited (MDL) and Garden Reach Shipbuilders and Engineers (GRSE) - are the frontrunners for the order that is classified as Project 17B. The two yards are currently constructing frigates under Project 17A (Nilgiri class). MDL is making four of the frigates while GRSE is executing an order for three.
While details will emerge after the defence ministry clears the project, there is a possibility that it could be split between the two yards, as was the case for Project 17A. A split order helps shorten delivery timelines for the Navy.
Sources said that state-run yards - Mazagon Dockyards Limited (MDL) and Garden Reach Shipbuilders and Engineers (GRSE) - are the frontrunners for the order that is classified as Project 17B. The two yards are currently constructing frigates under Project 17A (Nilgiri class). MDL is making four of the frigates while GRSE is executing an order for three.
While details will emerge after the defence ministry clears the project, there is a possibility that it could be split between the two yards, as was the case for Project 17A. A split order helps shorten delivery timelines for the Navy.
GRSE in its Q2 FY24 concall said that it will be 7 ships, in the tune of around 70,000cr. Guess the number hasn't been decided yet. Mind that the contract for these won't be signed anytime soon, the AoN from DAC/CCS will only help in finalising the design and weapons configuration. The new projects are being sanctioned with more funds than necessary, to cater for delays and inflation.Mazagon, Garden Reach Shipbuilders lead race for Defence Ministry's ₹70,000 crore warships order
Defence ministry's ₹70,000 crore approval for Project 17B warships boosts MDL's Kalvari class submarines, Project 15B destroyers, and GRSE's patrol vessels and exports. MDL and GRSE, constructing Nilgiri class under Project 17A, will split the order for quicker delivery. Stealth frigates feature...m.economictimes.com
Rs 70,000 cr means it's 8 hulls, approximately $1 billion per ship. Let's hope this time they can keep the 4-year timeline.
This could also mean that NGC will be deprioritized.
And NGC is not getting deprioritized, the RFP was issued in May 2024. The IN has fast-tracked its procurement to sign the contract within the next 12 months.
India to build 8 Next Generation Corvettes for its Navy – Defense Archives
The Defence Acquisition Council accorded Acceptance of Necessity (AoN) for the procurement of Next Generation Corvettes (NGC) at an estimated cost of approximat
defensearchives.de
If 70,000 crore is only for 7 ships, then it's a sign that Indian DPSU shipyards continue to remain extremely inefficient. The UK is building the Type 26 for less than $1 billion, and they are keeping to the promised timeline. Anyway, the RFP would only be issued in 2026.GRSE in its Q2 FY24 concall said that it will be 7 ships, in the tune of around 70,000cr. Guess the number hasn't been decided yet. Mind that the contract for these won't be signed anytime soon, the AoN from DAC/CCS will only help in finalising the design and weapons configuration. The new projects are being sanctioned with more funds than necessary, to cater for delays and inflation.
And NGC is not getting deprioritized, the RFP was issued in May 2024. The IN has fast-tracked its procurement to sign the contract within the next 12 months.
India to build 8 Next Generation Corvettes for its Navy – Defense Archives
The Defence Acquisition Council accorded Acceptance of Necessity (AoN) for the procurement of Next Generation Corvettes (NGC) at an estimated cost of approximat
RFP for NGC is yet to be issued according to GRSE (May 31). Any reliable source on fast tracking?.
My assumption is based on lack of budget. Next 3-4 years there are some big contracts lined up. rafale, MQ9B, P17B, P75I, follow on scorpian, follow on vikrant. This list itself is something like $28 billion !. More costly procurement will only happen if there is additional allocation.
it's more about the cost of equipment rather than the cost of man-hours.
4.2B pound is over 5.44B USD, don't know how that's <1B USD per ship. And it's already overshooting by 300M USD. Promised timeline? Laid in 2017 & operational in 28 (current projection). The timeline has shifted 3 times already.
The concall took place on 27th May, the transcript was released on 31st.
RFP is out for NGC, 6:40 onwards, plan is to sign the contract next year.
Over 30B USD, yes, not a problem.
You are right, just crossing $1 billion. P17B will be still costlier at $1.2 billion compared to a better equipped "European" ship. Thats saying something. I really hope its for 8 hulls !.
Good news if thats the case.
It is a problem. Today total CAPX allocation is $6 billion (Actual availability would be $4.5b), there are limits they can dream with this budget. They already stopped talking about follow on P8I.
My bad, that 300M overshoot is for the first ship alone, totalling over 1.3B USD. Rest assured it will keep increasing before it enters service. And idk how it's "better equipped" with that tiny rotary radar. More missiles? Thats 24 Mk41 and 48 CAMM, numbers are just for an SRSAM. P17B is coming with VL-SRSAM and an ATAS from the get go, 32 LR-SAM combined with 8 UVLM and 16 VL-SRSAM, that is a well equipped ship. 10k cr? Yeah, it's construction will start 10 years after the first type 26 was laid, inflation catches up with everybody.
Last year's modernisation budget was 52k cr, assuming a growth rate of 7%, the budget will be enough for all these projects that will go into the 30s, more than enough time to pay for them all.
It's better equipped with the MT30, 127mm main gun, and 24 Mk41 VLS cells compared to the 8 UVLM of the P17B. However, we do have better sensors with the MF-STAR. I really hope they remove the RBU-6000 and replace it with more VLS cells.
Is there any hope of getting an indigenous replacement for the MF-STAR for these ships?
With the USVs threat, I think RBU6000 is a good and cheap system.
LD provision is built into the contracts, so assuming 0.5% per week to maximum allowable LD between 5-15% of the total cost in a financial year, I think the numbers are ok. These days the shipyards now deliver early so unless major event happens, it would be on par. Then lawyers can argue over what part of the LD and cost overruns are attributable to stakeholders.
Yes, MT30 is better than LM2500, but we have 2 for their 1. What's better is that they have 2 big electric motors on type 26 for CODLOG.
Either you equip all 24 Mk41 with LACM/AShM or have few long range SAMs (are they even getting SM-2/6?). For AAW they only have 48 SRSAM. P17B' configuration isn't known yet, so no comments on 8 UVLM part.
The 6m array is unlikely to be fitted on the frigate, hopefully they are using modules to make that so it can be scaled down. Or else we'll have to stack '3-4 Arudhra' to make 1 face. The probability of these ships getting an indigenous MFR is high, supposed to be laid after 2027.