Ukraine - Russia Conflict

France and Germany do consider it a democracy. That's why Russia is sanctioned by the EU.

Not being a democracy is why it wasn't let into NATO in the first place.

That's because parts of their country were still occupied and there was still concerns about lingering corruption (not as bad as Putin's Russia though, not nearly). India would probably receive the same criticism judged to the same standards. But the fact is their elections were monitored by international observers. Russians disguised as rebels prevented the Donbass from using polling stations during the elections.

Even we have areas of India occupied by enemy states. But the US is desperate to make us an ally.

I don't think you know this, but treaty allies can decline providing help when it comes to disputed areas. Particularly NATO. Only sovereign territories are covered under NATO protection.

It really does matter. A valuable commodity is no good if you have no customers. US, Canada, Europe, Australia, China are about 2/3rds of global consumption. The rest is a deflection from the subject we were discussing, which was, Russia cannot afford to cut of China's gas and China could afford it even if they did. As long as Russia can't get the full price it's a win.

The Russians will always have customers.

Well, why is Europe paying a higher price too then?

Still less than India.

Other factors at play, Russia sold to India for 35% discount, so clearly other producers might increase production due to incentives, especially those annoyed with Russian-supported and Iranian backed insurgencies. Who will buy from Russia after 2024 when Europe has cut ties if Russia tried to stop Chinese supplies? Like I said, it would already have stopped European supplies if it could.

China and India will.
 
Not being a democracy is why it wasn't let into NATO in the first place.



Even we have areas of India occupied by enemy states. But the US is desperate to make us an ally.

I don't think you know this, but treaty allies can decline providing help when it comes to disputed areas. Particularly NATO. Only sovereign territories are covered under NATO protection.



The Russians will always have customers.



Still less than India.



China and India will.
No, it has to do with the length of time it's been in its current state and the willingness to defend it given ongoing regular and irregular Russian meddling since 2014.

NATO membership is something different altogether, you should know that.

Obviously.

Less customers mean far lower prices and less jobs in Russia in oil and gas. They also need outside help to extract the oil.

So, that's just down to market factors.

You didn't read the response properly and forgot the original argument, which was that Russia has no hold over China.
 
Looks like the head of your military intelligence couldn't even manage that, see post above.
This general was choosen by our president.... It was not the choice of the head of our armies... a bad interference in military affairs.

Yes, the US intelligence has made a great job on this affair (probably thanks to a human source very near Poutine). But they always had some fails.
 
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Pretty much says Putin's fault. Doesn't say anything about why Zelensky was so sure NATO would help. Doesn't also provide NATO's stand on the situation. Two aspects that actually triggered the war.
And what about Chechnya, Georgia, Poland in 1939, Hungary, Czechslovakia? All the ex-Warsaw Pact countries that have already left and joined NATO?

And now another idiot is claiming US intereference.

Even God can't be in this places at once, not even that 8-armed dude you guys have. This is just the cry of failed politicians making excuses for their failures by relying on pre-existent conspiracy theories.

Ukraine is just the latest in a trend that's been going since Ceaucescu.
 
"Fuel war" as part of a strategic plan to defeat the Ukrainian army

" If you look at the situation without rose-colored glasses, but also without black ones, it can be noted that by advancing in several directions, the command of the Russian Army has achieved a significant depletion of fuel reserves in Ukraine. After that, large oil depots were destroyed in turn, which deprived the Armed Forces of Ukraine of the ability to effectively transfer troops and supply them with everything necessary.

In the final, a decisive blow was dealt to the Kremenchug Oil Refinery, which made it impossible for the Ukrainian group to leave the encirclement in the Donbass, which it is highly likely to fall into in the near future.

If Zelensky nevertheless gives a belated order to withdraw troops from the Donbass, the Ukrainian units will be forced to retreat on foot, as the equipment will simply be left without fuel."

You mean like Russian troops did North of Kiev? Ukraine will get fuel from Europe.
 
This is what the roads of Berlin look like today. Drivers organized a rally of more than 5,000 cars in support of the Russian Federation. Flags of Russia, the USSR and the Airborne Forces flutter on cars:


"No end," comments a local resident.... in Russian. Likely organised by Russia. 5,000 is not a lot in a country of 80m. In Russia they would all be jailed. As it stands, their cars will probably just be torched by ordinary civilians later that night.
 
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No, it has to do with the length of time it's been in its current state and the willingness to defend it given ongoing regular and irregular Russian meddling since 2014.

Ukraine has been trying to join NATO since 2008.

NATO membership is something different altogether, you should know that.

Doesn't matter. If Texas decides to separate from the US, that's an American problem, not NATO's. Same rules for Ukraine.

Less customers mean far lower prices and less jobs in Russia in oil and gas. They also need outside help to extract the oil.

It also means cheaper fuel, so more buyers. The cheaper the cost, the better the potential for sale.

The Russians don't need outside help for oil extraction.

You didn't read the response properly and forgot the original argument, which was that Russia has no hold over China.

Cheap oil and gas along with other resources are plenty enough of a hold over China. As someone living in the First World, you have zero clue about this subject, about how important oil prices are to countries like China and India. You can say it's even more important than what the NHS is to the British. Way more important. In India, it's the reason why Modi came to power in 2014. China's not gonna f*ck around with people's livelihood over some temporary boost in hierarchy.
And what about Chechnya, Georgia, Poland in 1939, Hungary, Czechslovakia? All the ex-Warsaw Pact countries that have already left and joined NATO?

Chechnya and Geogria were invaded by Russia, both Slavs. The rest are not Slavs.

While Russia didn't like the eastward expansion of NATO, Ukraine was Russia's red line.
 
Ukraine has been trying to join NATO since 2008.



Doesn't matter. If Texas decides to separate from the US, that's an American problem, not NATO's. Same rules for Ukraine.



It also means cheaper fuel, so more buyers. The cheaper the cost, the better the potential for sale.

The Russians don't need outside help for oil extraction.



Cheap oil and gas along with other resources are plenty enough of a hold over China. As someone living in the First World, you have zero clue about this subject, about how important oil prices are to countries like China and India. You can say it's even more important than what the NHS is to the British. Way more important. In India, it's the reason why Modi came to power in 2014. China's not gonna f*ck around with people's livelihood over some temporary boost in hierarchy.


Chechnya and Geogria were invaded by Russia, both Slavs. The rest are not Slavs.

While Russia didn't like the eastward expansion of NATO, Ukraine was Russia's red line.
So, that is their choice, it likely followed Russia's excursion into Georgia around about the same time if you remember.

And anything in Ukraine is a problem for Ukraine alone not Russia.

It'll mean cheaper fuel and the number of buyers will be capped because the main consumers won't be buying from them anymore.

They were getting plenty of help with it. Now that help is gone, so production reduces, that's one of the reasons prices are up.

Except, as with Europe, Russia can't cut them. If Russia could afford to cut the supplies it would have done so already. It certainly cut afford to cut supplies to Europe and China. Russia, like Saudi Arabia and Venezuela is an oil and gas economy. Their entire country literally runs off oil and gas sales. It's like an ice cream van refusing to sell ice cream.

WTF does that have to do with anything?

It doesn't get to draw red lines outside its borders. You also keep migrating between different reasons. One minute it's Nazis, then it's NATO, SRBMs and hypothetical tank invasions. All it really is is Russia needing to maintain its control over European oil and gas supplies, because they're a useless economy/country without it. Having large oil and gas reserves makes countries lazy and useless. Look around the world and you'll see that this is true.
Oil is one thing, but I'm amused at how Europe is reliant on Russian coal given the number of coal mines that have been closed in the UK and Europe.
 
From what I understand Finland and Sweden joining NATO is pretty much a done deal at this point.
 
It doesn't get to draw red lines outside its borders. You also keep migrating between different reasons. One minute it's Nazis, then it's NATO, SRBMs and hypothetical tank invasions. All it really is is Russia needing to maintain its control over European oil and gas supplies, because they're a useless economy/country without it. Having large oil and gas reserves makes countries lazy and useless. Look around the world and you'll see that this is true.

Dude, use quotes.

Russia went into the war knowing that they will lose access to the European oil and gas market. Kills your argument.
 
Dude, use quotes.

Russia went into the war knowing that they will lose access to the European oil and gas market. Kills your argument.
I'm not sure they did actually. They invaded Georgia, not much happened, and it was a walk in the park. They invaded Crimea and Donbass, ditto again. There was nothing in the history of their recent 'adventures' that suggested this was going to be met with such resistance. The attack on Kiev was made from two directions with large forces and they got very close, that alone proves that it was not a diversion. You can also tell by reactions from meerkat Sergey that the sanctions response was unexpected too.

And BTW Germany and France rejected Ukraine's application in 2008 due to the an ongoing corruption scandal with a pre-revolution government.
 
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Part of the reason behind this rebound is that Russian authorities are doing plenty to boost the ruble—”a lot of manipulation,” as Anthony Blinken, the US secretary of state, said on Sunday (Apr. 3). ”People are being prevented from unloading rubles… That’s artificially propping up the value.” But these capital controls are unsustainable for an indefinite period of time, Blinken added. “I think you’re going to see that change.”
 
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It’s Time For Ukraine To Reconquer CrimeaFrom Russia! And This Is How! A (Theoretical) Battleplan​


Wake me up sweetie when it happens though I know for sure every Brit & Yank from the top to the bottom wishes it to be true . In the case of the Yanks it's understandable , as Irish Joe is the president . But the Brits too have undergone what I term the Irishification of the UK - a long tem irreversible process of dumbing down of the media , the polity , the intellect & everything you can think of which first manifested itself with Brexit .

Meanwhile , as the saying goes the Yanks will fight Russia to the last Ukrainian & the comedian is there to enable exactly that .
 
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It’s Time For Ukraine To Reconquer CrimeaFrom Russia! And This Is How! A (Theoretical) Battleplan​


Russia actually came from Kievan Rus in the first place. Russia didn't create Ukraine, it was the union of immigrants from Scandinavia with Finns and Slavs that formed Kievan Rus, a Mongol invasion drove them out after which they formed cultural centres in other places like Moscow and Belarus, with both Russia and Belarus taking their names from Kievan Rus. So really people from Ukraine formed Russia and Belarus.
 
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