Ukraine - Russia Conflict

Russian Missiles targeted the Western Ukrainian City of Lviv/Lvov!

According to the Mayor Andrey Sadovoy, 5 missiles landed on the city:

 
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The work of artillery spotters in the Azovstal area, presumably the fire is carried out by Krasnopol shells:

 
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Artillery of the LPR strikes at the positions of the Armed Forces of Ukraine in the Pervomaisky area:

 
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Yes, but very small numbers at the time. Very likely even volunteers. No different from NATO troops being rounded up in Mariupol now.
Small numbers were caught, how many do you actually think there were? One source indicated 4,360 out of 6,000 separatists killed from 2014-2018 were Russian military.


The Kremlin has denied its forces are directly involved in combat, but the latest estimate by US Lt Gen Ben Hodges, commander of the US Army in Europe, says 12,000 Russian troops are operating inside the neighbouring country.

Open Russia, a group funded by Kremlin opponent Mikhail Khodorkovsky, has compiled evidence of 276 Russian soldiers killed there up to late January.
Dr Sutyagin says this is a considerable underestimate and the total is nearer to 800.

This intervention evolved in several phases:
  • initially deniable, in the summer of 2014, with perhaps a few hundred special forces organising locals and Russian volunteers
  • large-scale escalation, during August 2014, when several Russian regular army battalion tactical groups (numbering up to 1,000 each) were sent in to save the separatists from defeat by the Ukrainian military

  • a period of withdrawal and retrenchment, late in 2014, following September's Minsk ceasefire agreement, in which Russian troop numbers dropped
  • the reintroduction of several formed battalions and numerous specialist troops during renewed fighting, this January and February, allowing the capture of Debaltseve and a good deal of other territory from the Ukrainians
That was as of early 2015.

It's very different, NATO are there under official invite from the elected government, Russia is not. And NATO only needed to be invited because of the Russian presence. Russia kept this war going since 2014, it prevent peace in the Donbass deliberately to provide a pretext for attempting to take the whole of Ukraine and install a puppet, like their man in Belarus.
 
It's very different, NATO are there under official invite from the elected government, Russia is not. And NATO only needed to be invited because of the Russian presence. Russia kept this war going since 2014, it prevent peace in the Donbass deliberately to provide a pretext for attempting to take the whole of Ukraine and install a puppet, like their man in Belarus.
Besides, Belarus being too close to Putin, NATO feels threatened, so we are going to invade Belarus, and if someone interferes in our special operation we nuke him.
 
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Russian troops occupied Kremennaya in the morning after the battle:

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Small numbers were caught, how many do you actually think there were? One source indicated 4,360 out of 6,000 separatists killed from 2014-2018 were Russian military.









That was as of early 2015.

It's very different, NATO are there under official invite from the elected government, Russia is not. And NATO only needed to be invited because of the Russian presence. Russia kept this war going since 2014, it prevent peace in the Donbass deliberately to provide a pretext for attempting to take the whole of Ukraine and install a puppet, like their man in Belarus.

Yeah, you're talking about the entire duration. Your article already supports what I said:
initially deniable, in the summer of 2014, with perhaps a few hundred special forces organising locals and Russian volunteers
 
Besides, Belarus being too close to Putin, NATO feels threatened, so we are going to invade Belarus, and if someone interferes in our special operation we nuke him.

Would apply only if Belarus was NATO's red line. And then NATO repeatedly warned the Russians not to cross said red line for many, many years. And then attack only after said red line is crossed by Russia.

Time for NATO to start articulating their red lines:
 
They screwed up in three ways. The first two were political, the last one was military. So the first one was their unrealistic expectations for Ukraine's surrender, which meant limited logistics during the early part of the war, and perhaps still not fixed. The second one was forcing the military to show way too much restraint. It meant the soldiers on the ground weren't receiving enough indirect fires to support their push, forcing them to risk their own lives to take objectives without having the means to do it, which should explain why nothing much has happened, except in Mariupol.

The third was the incorrect organisation of the field units. Their force structure has been designed to destroy NATO units in a defensive operation, not take towns and cities in an offensive. The Russians are using tanks and IFVs to do things the infantry is supposed to be doing, which is not gonna work out. It's probably a system they have developed for Armata, but the 7-year delay has meant reogranisation had to be conducted using old, unsuitable tech.



Not clear yet. Russia needs to actively use its air force and artillery to beat Ukraine into submission for it to be considered to have escalated into a war. Apparently, the main offensive is yet to begin. It's expected to begin by the end of the week, so that will tell us more.
How can you not fix something after 53 days unless you don't have the ability?

They caused plenty of civilian casualties so don't tell me about restraint. NATO did door-to-door clearance in Iraq and occasionally innocents got caught in the crossfire and everyone screamed about it, Russia has been dropping entire pre-natal hospitals, schools and civilian shelters, as well as conducting mass executions in Bucha and Irpin plus plenty of rape, so don't speak of restraint. After what they've done, Ukrainian authorities have shown great restraint by not dipping captured Russian soldiers in hot tar and applying chicken feathers to them.

It makes no difference, tanks cover infantry, infantry covers tanks, whatever the tank. Aircraft cover them all. You are supposed to conduct SEAD/DEAD first and establish air superiority before going in on the ground, Russia skipped this bit/were incapable of it and just went in on the ground, which never ends well.

You must be joking, it's day 53, >20,000 Russian dead, thousands of vehicle lost and hundreds of aircraft and pockets of resistance seem to be opening up in what little ground they have taken. This is already far worse than the Soviet-Afghan War and all in 1/60th of the timeframe. Russia has committed hundreds of thousands of troops to it and is using the damn draft. When was the last time a NATO country used the draft? About 55 years ago. Russia has screwed the pooch massively.

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Besides, Belarus being too close to Putin, NATO feels threatened, so we are going to invade Belarus, and if someone interferes in our special operation we nuke him.
Interference seems inevitable, so let's just nuke them.
Yeah, you're talking about the entire duration. Your article already supports what I said:
initially deniable, in the summer of 2014, with perhaps a few hundred special forces organising locals and Russian volunteers
Try reading to the end. And Russian volunteers is also people from Russia, who can say if they're regulars or drafted.
 
Would apply only if Belarus was NATO's red line. And then NATO repeatedly warned the Russians not to cross said red line for many, many years. And then attack only after said red line is crossed by Russia.

Time for NATO to start articulating their red lines:
An EU country is an obvious red line, NATO or not. That's basically Finland and Sweden, they're joining NATO now anyway, but whether they're in NATO or not, it's still a red line. That should be obvious to Putin.
 
How can you not fix something after 53 days unless you don't have the ability?

They can do more than that.

They caused plenty of civilian casualties so don't tell me about restraint. NATO did door-to-door clearance in Iraq and occasionally innocents got caught in the crossfire and everyone screamed about it, Russia has been dropping entire pre-natal hospitals, schools and civilian shelters, as well as conducting mass executions in Bucha and Irpin plus plenty of rape, so don't speak of restraint. After what they've done, Ukrainian authorities have shown great restraint by not dipping captured Russian soldiers in hot tar and applying chicken feathers to them.

That's what happens when the defenders take civilian hostages, the hostages die.

You must be joking, it's day 53, >20,000 Russian dead, thousands of vehicle lost and hundreds of aircraft and pockets of resistance seem to be opening up in what little ground they have taken. This is already far worse than the Soviet-Afghan War and all in 1/60th of the timeframe. Russia has committed hundreds of thousands of troops to it and is using the damn draft. When was the last time a NATO country used the draft? About 55 years ago. Russia has screwed the pooch massively.

Those fake Ukrainian figures. Ever wonder why I call you sheep?
 
An EU country is an obvious red line, NATO or not. That's basically Finland and Sweden, they're joining NATO now anyway, but whether they're in NATO or not, it's still a red line. That should be obvious to Putin.

Then NATO should publicly announce that all EU countries are protected, not just NATO countries.

At least that way, if the Russians decide to bomb Finland due to activating NATO membership, they will know NATO will protect them. At this time, though, Finland is fair game.
 
An EU country is an obvious red line, NATO or not. That's basically Finland and Sweden, they're joining NATO now anyway, but whether they're in NATO or not, it's still a red line. That should be obvious to Putin.
This is flexing for brownie points. Its like the guy on the ground is getting beat up while you are threatening the attacker - if you touch anyone on the tenth floor - you ll get it when you know the guy doesnt want to come up/ has no motivation to come up

Russia will not be attacking Finland.
 
The cost of this war is peanuts as far as wars go. Ukraine claims 700+ tanks destroyed after 1.5 months of fighting, that's peanuts.



Yeah, you should steal Russian money. It will definitely boost the West's credibility.



That's very low.



The answer will come in time, and it will be based on who is buying oil from them after Europe's done.



Those are vassals, not friends. It's like saying Poland was Russia's friend in the Warsaw Pact.

The US's only real democratic friend is India. Why? 'Cause only India has the ability to say no to the US, like a real friend should, when the US is trying to do stupid sh!t.
790 now. That isn't peanuts. How much does a tank cost? What about APCs and other vehicles, which are in the thousands. Fighter jets - 167. Many $bn being lost daily.

Servicing unpaid debts, same way any bank does it, asset seizure and liquidation. Dollar bonds can't be paid in rubles, the same issue cropped up with Greece many years back, when it wanted to leave the EU. It was told in no uncertain terms that debts in Euros must be paid in Euros, which meant it wouldn't have been able to inflate its way out of debt on its own currency anyway. If Russia had continued taking oil/gas payments in $s, it would have enough to service its debts, but forced payments in rubles as part of its ploy to artificially manipulate its currency. But the fact is, no online retailer is taking rubles at the official exchange rate because they simply aren't worth that in reality, it's more like 160 rubles to a $ online (or was like 20 days ago, probably more now), so Russia trying to pay $X with 80X rubles simply won't fly because no currency exchange or bank will change 83 rubles into $1, except Russian state banks. So basically Putin chose to sell Russia's oil and gas at half price to the EU to artificially stabilise the ruble for the purpose of conning the few saps in Asia it was still trading with. :ROFLMAO:

You don't get my point, the debt figure is irrelevant if you can't pay your day-to-day costs. Russia is not the UK. Check out interest rates in Russia.
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Now the UK.
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When Russia borrows money it has to pay it back at the shown interest rates, same for the UK. The interest rate in the UK is ~1/25th of the interest rate in Russia, so 20% debt costs Russia the same as 500% debt costs the UK in servicing payments. 20% (approximate for 18% in 2020) of $1.7tr is $340bn, at 20% interest rate, that's $68bn/annum in interest payments. $68bn just to stop the debt from growing, never mind pay it down. For the UK 0.8% of ~$3tr is $24bn. Russia's debt is already almost 3 times as costly as UK debt even without the extra bills he's racking up daily and the actual inevitable shrinkage of Russian GDP.

A friend isn't someone who buys oil from you. I said 30 democracies who are friends and support Russia in Ukraine.

@Picdelamirand-oil, @Bon Plan, @Amarante, apparently all EU countries including France are vassal states, see quote above. @randomradio - I am utterly amazed that you think France's current relationship with the US is the same as Poland's relationship with Russia during the Cold War. Sometimes you really just need to stop talking and give your ar5e a chance.

And yet you can't say no to Russia, when it is doing stupid shit?:ROFLMAO:
This is flexing for brownie points. Its like the guy on the ground is getting beat up while you are threatening the attacker - if you touch anyone on the tenth floor - you ll get it when you know the guy doesnt want to come up/ has no motivation to come up

Russia will not be attacking Finland.
Well it did move some forces up there.

If he tries the same thing there I hope the forces in question know they'll be getting their heads kicked in from above instantly without any negotiation on the matter whatsoever.
 
Well it did move some forces up there.

If he tries the same thing there I hope the forces in question know they'll be getting their heads kicked in from above instantly without any negotiation on the matter whatsoever.

We both know how deployments dont always mean actual plans. A war with NATO is not something Russia wants / needs. Not with a weak economy.

The flip side is - NATO knows if they try to push a fight, Russia will go for the jugular on day 1 - thats their only hope. Nukes on Day 1 make for a very messy war.

So for their own reasons, neither side will escalate things. Ukraine is as much the west's doing (maybe more) as its Russia's