India - Pakistan Standoff 2019

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Few things which which must ask Pakistanis is,
  • How many AMRAAMs or other AAMs did you fire?
  • How many of them found the mark?
  • Why did AAMs missed the target?
  • Where are the two pilots who's parachutes were seen deployed alongwith that of Wg. Cdr. Abhi?
  • I read somewhere that Pakistanis even went to the extent of saying that the tail chute of Mig-21 could have deployed which was mistook for the parachute of a pilot. I have yet to hear something so stupid in over 36 years of flying experience. A parachute remains deployed due to the air and the mass hung under it. If the tail chute had indeed deployed, it would not have remained inflated as there was nothing under it.
  • PAF Chief making a statement that they shot down a SU-30MKI is the biggest lie I have ever heard directly from the mouth of someone so senior in service. It makes it clear that Pakistanis are chronic liars and it is in their DNA.
  • Lastly, I will be extremely worried if my best weapons, fired in salvos, are deflected and rendered useless by my enemy. This will tell me that I am defenceless.
  • After what SU-30MKIs did to their AMRAAMs, they know that they stand no chance. AND Mig-29Ks & upgraded M2Ks have yet to join the game which have very potent ASPJs.
 
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nair said:
Well all these days they had their way... And MoD never bothered to respond to these psy ops or let us call info wars..... Twitter changed the game....
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Pakistanis have used their assets in SM and Indian media timely and for a particular job and that job is done when Abhinandan returned. We are now starting all that for don't know what objective. No one is being affected with our Psyops except some fan boys in our own country. Many can be found on DFI and here.
 
screambowl said:
Pakistanis have used their assets in SM and Indian media timely and for a particular job and that job is done when Abhinandan returned. We are now starting all that for don't know what objective. No one is being affected with our Psyops except some fan boys in our own country. Many can be found on Other Forum and here.
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What is it that you want, or think should be done from Indian side?
 
vstol Jockey said:
Few things which which must ask Pakistanis is,
  • How many AMRAAMs or other AAMs did you fire?
  • How many of them found the mark?
  • Why did AAMs missed the target?
  • Where are the two pilots who's parachutes were seen deployed alongwith that of Wg. Cdr. Abhi?
  • I read somewhere that Pakistanis even went to the extent of saying that the tail chute of Mig-21 could have deployed which was mistook for the parachute of a pilot. I have yet to hear something so stupid in over 36 years of flying experience. A parachute remains deployed due to the air and the mass hung under it. If the tail chute had indeed deployed, it would not have remained inflated as there was nothing under it.
  • PAF Chief making a statement that they shot down a SU-30MKI is the biggest lie I have ever heard directly from the mouth of someone so senior in service. It makes it clear that Pakistanis are chronic liars and it is in their DNA.
  • Lastly, I will be extremely worried if my best weapons, fired in salvos, are deflected and rendered useless by my enemy. This will tell me that I am defenceless.
  • After what SU-30MKIs did to their AMRAAMs, they know that they stand no chance. AND Mig-29Ks & upgraded M2Ks have yet to join the game which have very potent ASPJs.
Click to expand...
Good luck with that. If Indians or any one else asks these questions you are automatically an Indian stooge. If a Pakistani has the misfortune of asking, well the good people at ISI or some of their contractors give you a visit.

They paraded Jordanian planes as their own in 65. Niazi promised reporters he was going to march on Calcutta in 71. He later also promised to fight to the last man but that is a separate story. PAF chief had to come in after ACM Dhanoa came out to confirm IAF claims. How they feel internally could be good material for a book though.

On a separate note - In the current environment in which the IAF operates with airborne radars and real time information, how much relevant is the firing of missiles at extremely long range in mass volley from a single area of origin. Our airborne radar should pick it up quickly and our pilots will start evading immediately?
 
Personally, I feel this Mig-21/F-16 story has been done to death. The IAF officials have publicly made statements and presented (reasonable proof that can possibly be shared in the public domain). The Paf is yet to offer any official statement/s. Anything that comes from Ghafoora is at best a cover-up statement (which incidentally he messed up from the word go with the 3/2/1 pilot story).
The IAF is a highly professional institution and has never been known to disclaim losses.
As for the domestic stooges who still insist on more evidence, no professional defence force worth its salt will reveal operational details.
Its time to move on from beating this dead horse, we all know that the IAF met it's objectives, the PAF had to settle with the loss of a tier 1 a/c to a dated a/c, not to mention release of WC abhi in record time.

For now, at least till such time as the elections tide over, we should be content with a situation where we can pound them at will along LC and IB, they won't accept anything happened, and we continue the fireworks. Their doctrine of *Bleed with a 1000 cuts* just got reversed upon themselves.
 
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screambowl said:
Pakistanis have used their assets in SM and Indian media timely and for a particular job and that job is done when Abhinandan returned. We are now starting all that for don't know what objective. No one is being affected with our Psyops except some fan boys in our own country. Many can be found on Other Forum and here.
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I disagree with you here. Till now, hardly any tweeter handle gave out any information about ongoing operations and Pak population was fed by ISPR. This new warfare on tweeter has started giving direct inputs to the people of Pakistan. Initially they will disregard it as propaganda, but slowly as they see dead bodies arriving in their neighbourhoods, they will belive these Indian tweeter handles and also start questioning their army. This is just the begining. Wait for the impact and its effects. Have you not seen how Indian Politicians used tweets from across the border to create distrust about our own forces in the minds of our population?
 
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@vstol Jockey I agree fully. Indian handles (psyops or otherwise) have only been hyperactive since about 2-3 weeks ago. Besides, unlike ISPR which churns out blatant fantasy or denial, these domestic handles seem to be adding at least one to multiple element/s of truth which plant the seeds of doubt in the jaahil awam's minds. And its just a matter of time when the price of an egg becomes PKR100 and the PKR itself hits 200 to the $. The awam will be on the streets revolting.
 
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madrao99 said:
@vstol Jockey I agree fully. Indian handles (psyops or otherwise) have only been hyperactive since about 2-3 weeks ago. Besides, unlike ISPR which churns out blatant fantasy or denial, these domestic handles seem to be adding at least one to multiple element/s of truth which plant the seeds of doubt in the jaahil awam's minds. And its just a matter of time when the price of an egg becomes PKR100 and the PKR itself hits 200 to the $. The awam will be on the streets revolting.
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I agree with you. The devaluation of PKR will result in higher import cost of oil which will drain their Forex and also boost up the price of everything in Pakistan from food to medicine to water. This will very quickly spiral out of control and as I have seen in most economies which went bust, There is a tipping point after which there is no control left and the currency becomes junk. Take the case of Venezuala. Their factors were different, but they have one of the biggest oil deposits in the world and yet they are now a completely ruined economy.
 
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vstol Jockey said:
I agree with you. The devaluation of PKR will result in higher import cost of oil which will drain their Forex and also boost up the price of everything in Pakistan from food to medicine to water. This will very quickly spiral out of control and as I have seen in most economies which went bust, There is a tipping point after which there is no control left and the currency becomes junk. Take the case of Venezuala. Their factors were different, but they have one of the biggest oil deposits in the world and yet they are now a completely ruined economy.
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Butt....pls don't forget they have *almosssst* found the largest oil and/or gas deposits off karachi. The gutters, streets, canals of bakistan would be overflowing with $$s now. Rumor is that the finance minister umar has been shifted to the Ministry of Petroleum to manage this huge discovery. keep in mind, that inshallah- anything is possible in bakistan. Find oil/gas deposits today, start selling to the world tomorrow, and get $/£/€ yesterday.
 
The Dis information campaign or the Psy Ops or Social Media war has Two Aims

1 To tell their own Pakistani population that they are in control and things on battlefield are Equal - Equal

2 To Tell the Indian people that your Armed forces are unable to Hurt Pakistan and hence you should Talk to Pakistan

So the Way out is to either Escalate this whole thing in a big way so as to cause
Un deniable losses to Pakistan

Or keep this low intensity conflict going
And exploit Pakistan domestic weaknesses and faultlines
 
madrao99 said:
Butt....pls don't forget they have *almosssst* found the largest oil and/or gas deposits off karachi. The gutters, streets, canals of bakistan would be overflowing with $$s now. Rumor is that the finance minister umar has been shifted to the Ministry of Petroleum to manage this huge discovery. keep in mind, that inshallah- anything is possible in bakistan. Find oil/gas deposits today, start selling to the world tomorrow, and get $/£/€ yesterday.
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The drilling has yet to start and the estimates are that it will be bigger than Sui oil field. No where close to being one of the biggest in the world.
 
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DivineHeretic said:
What is it that you want, or think should be done from Indian side?
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Clean Indian media that should be the first step. Pakistan has invested in it a lot and also many other foreign intelligence as well.

vstol Jockey said:
I disagree with you here. Till now, hardly any tweeter handle gave out any information about ongoing operations and Pak population was fed by ISPR. This new warfare on tweeter has started giving direct inputs to the people of Pakistan. Initially they will disregard it as propaganda, but slowly as they see dead bodies arriving in their neighbourhoods, they will belive these Indian tweeter handles and also start questioning their army. This is just the begining
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Do you think Pakistani army will take the questions? When there was a cartoon on Mohammad, they banned youtube in Pakistan. ISI knows how to bring their people under confidence in the name of 'RELIGION'. We are not dealing with a secular, law abiding and conventional military. We deal with a military based on religious teachings. One message from ISPR will bring every one together to form Islamic Militia against Hindus. They already have Taliban Khan leading the jhoond of Jahils. You are a veteran and you are taught to sacrifice for country, Pakistanis are taught to sacrifice for God! They would not mind even if they see such news.
 
In a developed country, it would take at least 3 years before these deposits are mined, processed, tempered, tested and then starts local production (for which scale level infrastructure is needed). Dimran's announcement is nothing else but optics to divert the jaahil awam's attention from the impending (and already underway economic meltdown) to a delusional utopia.
 
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screambowl said:
Clean Indian media that should be the first step. Pakistan has invested in it a lot and also many other foreign intelligence as well.



Do you think *censored* army will take the questions? When there was a cartoon on Mohammad, they banned youtube in Pakistan. ISI knows how to bring their people under confidence in the name of 'RELIGION'. We are not dealing with a secular, law abiding and conventional military. We deal with a military based on religious teachings. One message from ISPR will bring every one together to form Islamic Militia against Hindus. They already have Taliban Khan leading the jhoond of Jahils. You are a veteran and you are taught to sacrifice for country, Pakistanis are taught to sacrifice for God! They would not mind even if they see such news.
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Let me tell you the history of these Jihadis. They are first ones to scoot the moment things turn against them. Gone are the days when India was divided in small kingdoms which could be usurped up one by one. Also gone are the days when theoe Kings followed the rules of Mahabharata in whch if the king is killed the army surrenders. Also gone are the days when Hindu kings used to lead the army from front. Tell me one battle which the Rajput Confedracy lost to any invader in India? They lost battles when this confedracy collapsed after the death of maharana Sangha. Same is true about Mohd Ghori and Prithviraj Chouhan.
 
vstol Jockey said:
Let me tell you the history of these Jihadis. They are first ones to scoot the moment things turn against them. Gone are the days when India was divided in small kingdoms which could be usurped up one by one. Also gone are the days when theoe Kings followed the rules of Mahabharata in whch if the king is killed the army surrenders. Also gone are the days when Hindu kings used to lead the army from front. Tell me one battle which the Rajput Confedracy lost to any invader in India? They lost battles when this confedracy collapsed after the death of maharana Sangha. Same is true about Mohd Ghori and Prithviraj Chouhan.
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We are still divided Sir, this is the reason why Pakistani disinformation campaign and psywar with Indian POW as subject worked. When every Maharaja of every state, let's say Mamta Bannerjee is the Queen of Bengal , questioned the Samrat of Bharat, in centre Modi. This helped the ISI.
 
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