Indian Political Discussion

[Dagger]

True these frauds happend in UPA regime. But why does NDA not taking any action. They let those fraidsters leave the country. Now both of us know that centre knew that these people would leave. If anyone denies this then it is plain BS. Under the modi govt these frauds just came out while cleaning up the NPA's but they never arrest anyone, no heads will ever get rolled. Let me tell you now, even kalmadi walks free. What frustrates me is this, in UPA 2 atleast people like kalmadi, kanimozi, Raja, Axis chairman got arrested. In this govt everyone walked free after the cases got cleared against them. Fraudsters are happily leaving the country and the media cell of BJP wants to blame everything on upa and the judiciary. When everyone knows the judiciary in India isnt completely free from govt interference. They are talking abt freeing jagan from his cases too. Modi and his team are so openly cheating us and showing us middle fingre. The only solace that bhakts want people to believe is that he is btr than rahul. This is ridiculous bro.

I don't want to get confrontational and attack you.
I had big hopes with the NDA govt. I believe he could have done way more in increasing the transparency of the system. I am against poorly thought-out schemes like the health insurance just to name one. High interests are another. Many. Promising AP a special package is another one.
But nobody controls the entire thing in our India. In the police station, my friend is posted at, all the criminals belonging to the same caste as the SHO get counselled and sent home. No FIRs. You have judges, who have actively rebelled against the CJI. One of our CMs got shot because her bodyguards felt their religion was disrespected.There is a potential mole in every office in our country as long as he is the right religion and caste. For every side.
Realistically, with magical fires happening, which burn away evidences in the govt offices. Getting conviction in courts might not be easy. There is an effort to hunt these guys when they were thriving just few years before. We have got back 5000crores of the 12000 crores already from Nimo. Another raid was done in the last two days. This is stellar performance considering one of the investigating officers might potentially have his loyalties with his community rather than our constitution , as is extremely common in our country. Something is better than nothing. Atleast in the episode of these frauds, this might be the best we can hope for.

 

[_Anonymous_]

I don't want to get confrontational and attack you.
I had big hopes with the NDA govt. I believe he could have done way more in increasing the transparency of the system. I am against poorly thought-out schemes like the health insurance just to name one. High interests are another. Many. Promising AP a special package is another one.
But nobody controls the entire thing in our India. In the police station, my friend is posted at, all the criminals belonging to the same caste as the SHO get counselled and sent home. No FIRs. You have judges, who have actively rebelled against the CJI. One of our CMs got shot because her bodyguards felt their religion was disrespected.There is a potential mole in every office in our country as long as he is the right religion and caste. For every side.
Realistically, with magical fires happening, which burn away evidences in the govt offices. Getting conviction in courts might not be easy. There is an effort to hunt these guys when they were thriving just few years before. We have got back 5000crores of the 12000 crores already from Nimo. Another raid was done in the last two days. This is stellar performance considering one of the investigating officers might potentially have his loyalties with his community rather than our constitution , as is extremely common in our country. Something is better than nothing. Atleast in the episode of these frauds, this might be the best we can hope for.

Please use this to underline your argument .

The Hindu explains: The Fugitive Economic Offenders Bill, 2017


If this government were not serious , you wouldn't see this bill. Something the previous government would never consider . For obvious reasons.

 

[Bali78]

I don't want to get confrontational and attack you.
I had big hopes with the NDA govt. I believe he could have done way more in increasing the transparency of the system. I am against poorly thought-out schemes like the health insurance just to name one. High interests are another. Many. Promising AP a special package is another one.
But nobody controls the entire thing in our India. In the police station, my friend is posted at, all the criminals belonging to the same caste as the SHO get counselled and sent home. No FIRs. You have judges, who have actively rebelled against the CJI. One of our CMs got shot because her bodyguards felt their religion was disrespected.There is a potential mole in every office in our country as long as he is the right religion and caste. For every side.
Realistically, with magical fires happening, which burn away evidences in the govt offices. Getting conviction in courts might not be easy. There is an effort to hunt these guys when they were thriving just few years before. We have got back 5000crores of the 12000 crores already from Nimo. Another raid was done in the last two days. This is stellar performance considering one of the investigating officers might potentially have his loyalties with his community rather than our constitution , as is extremely common in our country. Something is better than nothing. Atleast in the episode of these frauds, this might be the best we can hope for.

I would suggest to wait for the implementation of health insurance schemes before forming an opinion. I was hugely skeptical about Jan than accounts and thought they will be unnecessary burden for PSU banks. But look at the final outcome !! They are not only self sustaining, but brought in 75000 crores into banking system.

Same with Ujwala scheme and toilets built under Swach Bharat yojana. Now both our maids have gas connections as well as Jan dhan accounts. Few years back both facilities were completely out of reach for them, since they live in illegal slums!!

So one thing which this government is really good at is implementation of schemes at a huge scale and at breakneck speed. Neem coating of Urea is another example. Pilferage stopped and now there is no shortage of urea.

I completely agree with you regarding our Judicial system. It's one branch of governance which has completely failed and nobody can question it due to fear of contempt of court.

 

[Shajida Khan]

Simply a disgusting, casteist comment. He derides the PM as a teli who needs to be "put in place" while claiming to be liberal, inclusive and against bigotry.

I don't know about 'teli' or 'chai-wala'. Our PM got his basics right. China in 1979 or so was at a similar juncture: Literacy rate in high 60s, Life expectancy in high 60s or low 70s, relatively young and numerous, lots of untapped potential in terms of natural resources when they began their limited experiment with capitalism and manufacturing. Soon they started their meteoric rise.

 

[vsdoc]

I don't remember bringing Congress or BJP in my reponse to your question. I told you what soft hindutva is according to me and I strongly believe it to be true. People who preach Hindus about Ganga Jamuni tehzib, and Vasudev Kutumbkum by saying nice things once in a while but still sucking up to the "MINORITIES" for their secular cred.

Ranjeet, just because you did not bring political parties (and their ideological camps) in, does not mean it was not implied.

If you read Infos post and my response (to which you responded) that is exactly what the context was.

Regardless, your not bringing them in does not preclude me from doing so.

Hindutva is a fascist ideology using the Hindu identity and the dharam khatre mein paradigm to spread fear and hatred and coalesce the Hindus of the nation's into one large vote bank.

Born out of the fear and insecurity and jealousy of a cowardly bunch of collaborators who never fought for Independence but are self claimed patriots and nationalists today.

There is nothing fancier about it.

No higher ideal.

It's the saffron equivalent politically of Islam khatre mein.

Both are utterly abhorrent and have no place in secular India.

Cheers, Doc

 

[vsdoc]

Soft Hindutwa is not targeted at BJP core votebank, but fence sitting Hindus(especially OBC SC ST), it is to weaken the Kamandal.

‘I must thank the BJP for telling me that I am a backward, not forward, but no matter how backward we are, our work is forward,’ he said in a recent speech.
UP bye-poll victory recasts Akhilesh Yadav as backward class leader – and that will worry BJP --link

Agree largely.

Only disagree about who you think are being targeted.

2019 should make things clearer.

Cheers, Doc

 

[_Anonymous_]

A premium on minorityism: Why Lingayats, and pretty much all other communities, crave minority status in India

@Notsuperstitious ; @RATHORE ; @Aravind ; @Bali78 @Dagger

 

[_Anonymous_]

View: Not Rahul versus Modi contest, 2019 polls will be a battle between BJP and the regional parties

 

[Dagger]

A premium on minorityism: Why Lingayats, and pretty much all other communities, crave minority status in India

@Notsuperstitious ; @RATHORE ; @Aravind ; @Bali78 @Dagger

Exactly. There are so many castes , communities and philosophies which can be considered to be different, that everyone is in a minority. I hope the BJP govt starts the ball rolling to lure the votes of communities it doesn't get votes from too. Play them at their own game till the referees (SC) decide to wake up from deep slumber, and trashes this majority -minority circus.

 

[vsdoc]

I hope the BJP govt starts the ball rolling to lure the votes of communities it doesn't get votes from too. Play them at their own game till the referees (SC) decide to wake up from deep slumber, and trashes this majority and minority.

Like Triple Talaq.

Like the Haji Ali Dargah case.

Lie the Goolrukh Gupta case.

Cheers, Doc

 

[Dagger]

Like Triple Talaq.

Like the Haji Ali Dargah case.

Lie the Goolrukh Gupta case.

Cheers, Doc

The triple talaq case was an insult to modern civilization. Something even Pakistan has reformed. It improved some people's lives from being a use and throw towel. It definitely needed politics to get it done. It could have been done the easier way, by the Shah Bano case. But nursing a grudge for this is simply whoring out one's morals.
And well, if you think politics had anything to do with the last two. This is beyond pretending to sleep. More like pretending to have a nightmare.
Traditional wisdom suggests you let these people cry it out, instead of attempting to console. No?

 

[vsdoc]

The triple talaq case was an insult to modern civilization. Something even Pakistan has reformed. It improved some people's lives from being a use and throw towel. It definitely needed politics to get it done. It could have been done the easier way, by the Shah Bano case. But nursing a grudge for this is simply whoring out one's morals.
And well, if you think politics had anything to do with the last two. This is beyond pretending to sleep. More like pretending to have a nightmare.
Traditional wisdom suggests you let these people cry it out, instead of attempting to console. No?

insult, whoring, towels, nightmares, crying notwithstanding

The examples were specifically selected to show you that the BJP is already ahead of the curve when it comes to appeasing sections of the minorities and splitting their vote.

Nothing unexpected. Just a reality check to allay your fears that the BJP was missing out on the game.

Cheers, Doc

 

[_Anonymous_]

insult, whoring, towels, nightmares, crying notwithstanding

The examples were specifically selected to show you that the BJP is already ahead of the curve when it comes to appeasing sections of the minorities and splitting their vote.

Nothing unexpected. Just a reality check to allay your fears that the BJP was missing out on the game.

Cheers, Doc

So, the Goolrukh Gupta case is why some Parsis are cut up with the BJP ? Funny reasoning but not entirely unexpected . Whether the SC rules or not , damn the BJP & Modi.

 

[vsdoc]

So, the Goolrukh Gupta case is why some Parsis are cut up with the BJP ? Funny reasoning but not entirely unexpected . Whether the SC rules or not , damn the BJP & Modi.

Some conservatives (many actually) definitely. For them it is sacrilege.

Not me.

I've said it before on this forum. And the reasoning behind why women were excommunicated, in addition to their kids not getting to be Parsi Zoroastrians.

Though I had also said at the time that I was not fully informed on the arguments against, and rationale, and would be willing to see the conservative point of view if it was backed by evidence either from the Avesta or the Gathas. And not heresay by the powerful Mumbai Dastur body alone.

But really, I do not want to get back into the nitty gritty of my community here.

Its the principle that is being discussed. Namely, appease a significant section of the minorities, and split the vote of traditional anti-BJP vote banks.

Cheers, Doc

 

[vsdoc]

Some conservatives (many actually) definitely.

Not me.

I've said it before on this forum. And the reasoning behind why women were excommunicated, in addition to their kids not getting to be Parsi Zoroastrians.

But really, I do not want to get back into the nitty gritty of my community here.

Its the principle that is being discussed. Namely, appease a significant section of the minorities, and split the vote of traditional anti-BJP vote banks.

And if I am not mistaken, it was the HC that gave the ruling, not the SC?

Cheers, Doc

 

[_Anonymous_]

Some conservatives (many actually) definitely. For them it is sacrilege.

Not me.

I've said it before on this forum. And the reasoning behind why women were excommunicated, in addition to their kids not getting to be Parsi Zoroastrians.

Though I had also said at the time that I was not fully informed on the arguments against, and rationale, and would be willing to see the conservative point of view if it was backed by evidence either from the Avesta or the Gathas. And not heresay by the powerful Mumbai Dastur body alone.

But really, I do not want to get back into the nitty gritty of my community here.

Its the principle that is being discussed. Namely, appease a significant section of the minorities, and split the vote of traditional anti-BJP vote banks.

Cheers, Doc

Aren't all parties guilty of it ? Why single out the BJP ?

 

[vsdoc]

Aren't all parties guilty of it ? Why single out the BJP ?

I wasn't singling out the BJP.

Just allaying Daggers unfounded fears about their perceived babe-in-the-woods innocence.

Personally I am in favor of all 3.

But lets not kid ourselves about altruistic motivation here.

Cheers, Doc

 

[vsdoc]

@_Anonymous_ @Dagger

I do not know the legislative route that will be followed for each of these three, but each of them do establish precedence now, which can and will be used for other faiths as well by political dispensations.

Maybe this one. Maybe their rivals when the pendulum swings.

If you look at each of the three, only triple talaq comes under the ambit of a uniform civil code on marriage and divorce.

But the Dargah and Dokhma are both private religious places, with Right of Entry reserved.

As such the government nor the judiciary has no business interfering.

A counter-point.

Cheers, Doc

 

[Dagger]

@_Anonymous_ @Dagger

I do not know the legislative route that will be followed for each of these three, but each of them do establish precedence now, which can and will be used for other faiths as well by political dispensations.

Maybe this one. Maybe their rivals when the pendulum swings.

If you look at each of the three, only triple talaq comes under the ambit of a uniform civil code on marriage and divorce.

But the Dargah and Dokhma are both private religious places, with Right of Entry reserved.

As such the government nor the judiciary has no business interfering.

A counter-point.

Cheers, Doc

insult, whoring, towels, nightmares, crying notwithstanding

The examples were specifically selected to show you that the BJP is already ahead of the curve when it comes to appeasing sections of the minorities and splitting their vote.

Nothing unexpected. Just a reality check to allay your fears that the BJP was missing out on the game.

Cheers, Doc

The English language is what it is. None of them are personal. You are mature enough to get a metaphor no?
I addressed the triple talaq in the previous post. If its not clear to you, I agree the TT was a political issue because it was plain moral highground, easy to defend and fight with complete moral vacuum and pandering to a degrading custom. All by parties who yell liberalism, feminism and secularism. The gave a pretty juicy opening and the BJP took the shot.

You are insinuating that I want BJP to do minority appeasement. Truth is, I want justice and equality. You know yourself, that in the TT case as well as the minority privilege issue, You have no moral ground. You cannot argue the merits of the issue. But , you still want to stall it and you go ahead shouting appeasement, reflecting the wishes of a vote bank and politics. I hate to break it to you, but thats the purpose of different parties and having a democracy.
Argue the merits of the cases and I will be there.

 

[Dagger]

@_Anonymous_ @Dagger

I do not know the legislative route that will be followed for each of these three, but each of them do establish precedence now, which can and will be used for other faiths as well by political dispensations.

Maybe this one. Maybe their rivals when the pendulum swings.

If you look at each of the three, only triple talaq comes under the ambit of a uniform civil code on marriage and divorce.

But the Dargah and Dokhma are both private religious places, with Right of Entry reserved.

As such the government nor the judiciary has no business interfering.

A counter-point.

Cheers, Doc

Temples, Dargah and Dokhmas may belong to private parties. But any establishment in a democracy is not supposed to discriminate. Thats fundamental rights Art 14. Its been active on the majority Hindus since a long time. Its got a bitter initial taste sometimes , but its very healthy and the leaving taste is heavenly.