Consolidation. At present they are sitting quietly and consolidating. Also they are sitting on the land where there is supposed to be no one. That's how they changed the status quo. If we accept this change in status quo simply coz they are sitting quietly, what stops them from coming in further and sitting quietly? as long as they don't fire and they don't want to, we are playing into their hands. Win the war without firing a bullet. War is not something that you can fight at your convenience. China is exploiting this to perfection, technically we are never ready to hit back, we always need more stuff and we always have to buy stuff and that's an endless loop.
It's time GoI grows a pair and replies in a language the Chinese understand. They want to do this without bloodshed. The moment the bloodshed starts, it will become a problem for China (they had to cover up 50 odd casualties to prevent internal repercussions), imagine how they will handle the casualties in case we strike.
This sitting quietly is really a bad excuse and judgement. They are not supposed to be sitting there, quietly or not is immaterial.
India confident in standing solo against China in any future border dispute: European think tank
Post the violent June 15 Galwan Valley clashes, India has shown the confidence of standing solo against China in any future border dispute despite the United States’ offer of forming a Quad alliance against Beijing, a Europe-based think tank said.
Since the clashes in Eastern Ladakh, several negotiations between India and China have taken place. Though they have yielded some results as troops of both countries started pulling back in some of the disputed sectors, Chinese troops are still present in the Depsang Plains region, Gogra, and the Fingers region along the Pangong Tso.
“In the initial phase of disengagement at Pangong Tso, the Chinese moved back from Finger 4 to Finger 5, but continued with their deployment on the ridge line. India is insisting that China move back from Finger 5 to its old position on the Finger 8 spur. In the face of repeated demands by the Chinese negotiators that India move its troops back from the forward areas, India has refused to consider any de-escalation until the disengagement process through the withdrawal of Chinese intrusions is complete,” the European Foundation for South Asian Studies (EFSAS) said in its commentary.
“Just like in Doklam in 2017, the firmness and resolve displayed by the Indian political and military leadership in the face of the Chinese transgressions have surprised China,” the think tank said.
Citing a recent report by the Indian Defence Ministry, EFSAS said, “While engagement and dialogue at military and diplomatic level are continuing to arrive at a mutually acceptable consensus, the present standoff is likely to be prolonged.”
In other words, both countries are prepared to “dig in for the winter despite the harsh climatic conditions that prevail at such high altitudes. India has mounted a massive logistics and stocking exercise similar to what it does every year to retain its hold over the even more unwelcoming Siachen glacier”.
This preparedness by India shows that it is strong enough to counter any serious confrontation at the border despite China offering a lucrative offer of focusing on improvement of the bilateral relations instead of the border issue.
“There has been an argument in Indian public opinion on the boundary question, which worries me, suggesting the Indian government adjust its policy towards China, and change its stance on issues related to Taiwan, Tibet, Hong Kong and the South China Sea to put pressure on China...(Both sides need to) correctly analyse and view each other’s strategic intentions and prevent misinterpretation and miscalculation in a positive, open and inclusive attitude,” Sun Weidong, Chinese Ambassador to India was quoted as saying at a webinar on ‘India-China Relations: The Way Forward’ organised on July 30.
He further said, “The purpose of clarification of Line of Actual Control (LAC) is to maintain peace and tranquillity. When we look back into history, if one side has unilaterally stated its own perception on the LAC during the negotiations, then that will lead to disputes. That is why this process cannot...move on. I think that this is a departure from the original purpose.”
“The important thing is that we must follow those agreements and continue our discussion and consultation along the diplomatic channels and also among corps commanders, and also find out a way to de-escalate the situation and restore peace and tranquillity,” he added.
According to EFSAS, “China has periodically been needling India at the border and routinely violating agreements reached between the two sides to maintain peace and tranquillity there, India has now been bitten enough times to realise the futility, even counter-productivity, of dealing with the border issue in isolation.”
“Despite the temptation to take the easy road proposed by the Chinese, India believes that it is now resolute and strong enough to sustain a serious confrontation at the border in order to secure the future from unpredictable and unprovoked acts of aggression by China,” the think tank added.
“India realises as well the potential serious consequences of a Chinese intrusion that goes out of hand, as the one on June 15 in Galwan well-nigh did,” the commentary stated.
“While India hopes that the current standoff will be resolved through dialogue, it has also left little doubt about its preparedness for conflict escalation in order to safeguard its territory. It may, therefore, be the optimal option for India and China to work out a mutually acceptable solution that involves a face-saving Chinese exit. Russia, as India’s traditional partner and China’s newfound ally, could potentially play a useful role in hammering this out,” it said.
Meanwhile, several offers of “help” from the US to India have been made since the Galwan clashes.
US Secretary of State Michael Pompeo was quoted as saying, during a Congressional hearing on July 30, “They talk about bringing socialism with Chinese characteristics to the world. Claims that they have now made for real estate in Bhutan, the incursion that took place in India, these are indicative of Chinese intentions, and they are testing, they are probing the world to see if we are going to stand up to their threats and their bullying.”
“I am more confident than I was a year ago that the world is prepared to do that. There is a lot more work to do and we need to be serious about it. Our diplomatic efforts are working and momentum is building to mitigate the threats that the Chinese Communist Party presents,” he said.
Proposing a new alliance to counter China, Pompeo said, “Our Quad (Quadrilateral Security Dialogue) -- the US, Australia, India, and Japan -- has been reinvigorated. We have worked hard at this. Our diplomats have done wonderful work. I am very proud of the progress we are making.”
“The challenge of China demands exertion, energy from democracies -- those in Europe, those in Africa, those in South America, and especially those in the Indo-Pacific region,” he further said.
Earlier this week, Chairman and Ranking Democrat Member Eliot Engel and Ranking Republican Member Michael McCaul wrote on behalf of the US House of Representatives Committee on Foreign Affairs to India’s External Affairs Minister S Jaishankar saying that they wanted to demonstrate the strong bipartisan support for the India-US relationship.
“Members of both parties recognise the impact that a strong US-India partnership will have on the trajectory of the 21st century. As Prime Minister Modi said in February this year, our ties ‘are no longer just another partnership. It is a far greater and closer relationship’. This closer relationship is all the more important as India faces aggression from China along your shared border, which is part of the Chinese government’s consistent pattern of unlawful and belligerent territorial aggression across the Indo-Pacific. The United States will remain steadfast in support of India’s efforts to defend its sovereignty and territorial integrity,” the letter read.
Citing another instance of US trying to woo India, EFSAS said, “In early July, White House Chief of Staff Mark Meadows stressed that the US will continue to stand strong in the ongoing conflict between India and China. He alleged that no one in China’s periphery was safe from Chinese aggression.”
On July 2, Republican Senator Rick Scott wrote a letter to Prime Minister Narendra Modi saying, “Communist China believes that in order for them to be strong, America, India and other freedom-loving countries must be weaker. They are cracking down on freedom and autonomy in Hong Kong, and continue to threaten Taiwan and India. As you continue to stand against Communist China and General Secretary of the Communist Party Xi (Jinping), I want to offer help in any way I can to the Republic of India, the world’s largest democracy and our ally. The United States will always defend our allies and those fighting for freedom.”
Instead of accepting the US’ help, India has maintained that it will not join the US and other countries who have been victims of China’s aggressive behaviour unless pushed to the brink.
The EFSAS quoted Jaishankar at a virtual conference held on July 20, “Non-alignment was a term of a particular era and geopolitical landscape. One aspect was independence, which remains a factor of continuity for us.”
“The consequence of repositioning of the United States, that the big umbrella is now smaller than it used to be, has allowed many other countries to play more autonomous roles. It does not affect us as much because we were never part of an alliance system and we will never be. But countries who depended more on the US are finding they have to take a call themselves on many issues,” he said.
The EFSAS stated that the US should move “beyond general assurances of standing by India and spelt out exactly what it was willing to offer to attract India enough to take the plunge and the risk” of aligning with forces against China.
India confident in standing solo against China in any future border dispute: European think tank
This preparedness by India shows that it is strong enough to counter any serious confrontation at the border despite China offering a lucrative offer of focusing on improvement of the bilateral relations instead of the border issue, the EFSAS said.www.hindustantimes.com
The reason I'm worried to what happens in the U.S even though we do not depend on them is because from the way the democrats are working it seems that they are heavily backed by the Chinese. The CCP does seem to have a stranglehold on American decision making. That is done through the democrats, silicon valley and the Bloomberg owned media. If Biden wins there are predictions that he would be immediately sidelined by the Clinton-bush cabal and that could effect us.The US election results doesn't preclude the US President from acting. The incumbent retains office till 31st Dec 2020. Moreover, unlike in 1962 where China feared US joining in the war the former prosecuted on India coz of what China did to the US in the Korean War & their support for the Viet Cong against the French & later the US in Vietnam & what was then Indo China apart from Chinese support for communist movements all across SE Asia, nothing like that has occured in the recent past between both parties nor is India dependant on direct US intervention as opposed to US support .
Their initial plan of surprising India has half worked . Unless they want to press home their advantage which always remains a possibility they'd not precipitate anything beyond what they've already initiated & leave the remaining work to Phase -2 which in all probability will follow in a few years. Having said that a good deal is dependant on how the CCP retreat goes for Xi scheduled in mid August. If he faces tumult within the ranks, you can bet it'd be reflected on the LAC.
The deputy research director of biden is a pak American , sharmeen khan. No wonder he has started making statements on kashmir, anti Indian.The reason I'm worried to what happens in the U.S even though we do not depend on them is because from the way the democrats are working it seems that they are heavily backed by the Chinese. The CCP does seem to have a stranglehold on American decision making. That is done through the democrats, silicon valley and the Bloomberg owned media. If Biden wins there are predictions that he would be immediately sidelined by the Clinton-bush cabal and that could effect us.
We are definitely not like the French of WW2 atleast I hope so. From whatever I have seen and read the PLA soldiers don't have an appetite of fighting wars. But if we do get into a long drawn out war their technological and industrial superiority might make up for their initial losses. And the CCP has a huge appetite for casualties unlike the Indian government...
Does not matter.. the US deep state is seeing China as a long term threat.. Biden might lessen the economic pain for China.. but, those halcyon days of 80s and 90s are not coming back for China w.r.t relationship with US..The reason I'm worried to what happens in the U.S even though we do not depend on them is because from the way the democrats are working it seems that they are heavily backed by the Chinese. The CCP does seem to have a stranglehold on American decision making. That is done through the democrats, silicon valley and the Bloomberg owned media. If Biden wins there are predictions that he would be immediately sidelined by the Clinton-bush cabal and that could effect us.
We are definitely not like the French of WW2 atleast I hope so. From whatever I have seen and read the PLA soldiers don't have an appetite of fighting wars. But if we do get into a long drawn out war their technological and industrial superiority might make up for their initial losses. And the CCP has a huge appetite for casualties unlike the Indian government...
The deputy research director of biden is a pak American , sharmeen khan. No wonder he has started making statements on kashmir, anti Indian.
What Biden winning will do is similar to what happened pre WW2 where the Americans assisted the Germans technologically. The Democrats are going to transfer a lot of technology to the Chinese before the deep state finally wakes up and changes its tone. If anything China has as much manchurian candidates in the U.S senate as they have in U.N. They have shrewdly used there financial power to turn the tables to their side. A lot of defections might happen in the coming years...Does not matter.. the US deep state is seeing China as a long term threat.. Biden might lessen the economic pain for China.. but, those halcyon days of 80s and 90s are not coming back for China w.r.t relationship with US..
What Biden winning will do is similar to what happened pre WW2 where the Americans assisted the Germans technologically. The Democrats are going to transfer a lot of technology to the Chinese before the deep state finally wakes up and changes its tone. If anything China has as much manchurian candidates in the U.S senate as they have in U.N. They have shrewdly used there financial power to turn the tables to their side. A lot of defections might happen in the coming years...
I dont see what will we GAIN by Rushing into War
Kargil was different
They were firing on our convoys
So we had to.evict them
Here they are sitting quietly
Our convoys Are moving
Our infrastructure work is in progress
So let us acquire More Rafales , MBRLs
Brahmos and ATGMs before striking them
The problem is that their is a massive lobby that can influence this. Biden is like advani a likeable person but will be sidelined. He is literally a walking dead man. Biden is going to be manmohan for the Americans if he leads them...Pentagon and State Department Bureaucracy , the Uniformed Services
CIA, FBI will all give detailed briefings about the Chinese Threat
Biden has been VP for 8 years
He understands National Security threats because the VP in USA is also involved in such meetings and discussions
Guys while American backing is always welcome, India has to rely only on itself for its defence.
Americans are very transactional and trump has turned out to be very fickle.
He has pressurised Modi to buy expensive arms,oil , reduce duties on their clunkers, hb1, etc at government to Government level, But what has India gained on the ground , whether financially or security wise , except a few words ?
China will tomorrow fold and give trump a good deal and he will dump India faster than a eyeblink. Expect lectures on kashmir, caa, etc immediately afterwards.
Our greatest moment militarily was when we opposed usa and cut Pakistan up into 2 pieces.
Realpolitik is the name of the game, not jhupies.
Modi unfortunately is a easy target because of his Gujarat inaction and is easily sent on the defensive using Gujarat. He expends Indian interests to shore up his reputation.
He has to be a total hard *censored* and forget all this personal touch business.
Biden is senil..he is just a face for the democrats, listen to his speeches and you can see he is not all there. There won't be a president announced for a few months after the election ends since they are going to do bail out boxes and mail in voting this time which will lead to a lot of confusion and voter fraud called by the democrats just like our congress and kejriwal do in india. Democrats are looking at a historical defeat since all the cities in blue Democrat states are burning from BLM anti-police (antifa = communist/Marxists/Islamists/Chinese funded) protests nurtured by the democrat mayor's and governors which is going on for 72 days now. Since,most of the American people in lockdown are following all this drama well and know what democrats are doing.
The point is Trump will be back as president but there will be a lot of chaios in the election process before he is declared one , that's what the Pelosi and team are working on...they want to burn it all down since they understand the results and want to build a base for 2024 elections. But other stuff like cheap real estate in big cities is also fuelling this, New York governor Andrew cumo is supporting the protests to cash in big on cheap real estate since the cities are being abandoned and people will be selling the places for dirt cheap prices which he and his big wig friend want to buy...scumbags all of them.
American public are not that stupid to watch all this and not vote red...It is almost like BLM - Antifa is protesting to get Trump re-elected. I am fairly confident Trump will get re-elected since he delivered well in the economic front throughout his tenure until covid happened.
chances of trump winning due to anger against BLM is high but at the same time ppl are also repulsed at this character. That makes things more dicey & unpredictable.The economy was already slowing down even before COVID, but Trump has done a pretty good job in distracting the public by blaming the disease and China. And then, the BLM protests have almost killed Democrat chances overnight.
But what may come back to bite him is his handling of the virus. If Trump's lucky, a vaccine will be ready a month before America goes to the polls and that could clinch him the seat a second time. Otherwise he's got a tough fight ahead of him.
I feel Trump is better for India's foreign policy than Biden. Also, Trump's anti-immigration policy will be very good for India's economic rise over the next 4 years. We need all the brains staying put, making unicorns, while we transition from a lower middle income country to an upper middle income country. He's also a big fan of raising the navy's budget, which is very important for India since it would mean reduced pressure at the LAC.