Rafale DH/EH of Indian Air Force : News and Discussions

The purpose of the mission was to demonstrate the capabilities of the Talios in the air-to-air, air-to-ground and air-to-sea domains. For this first flight, the Indian pilot was able to note the added value provided by the Talios compared to the (older Damocles) sensors.
Or compared to the Litening... :LOL: A product placement mission!
 
First Flight of French AF Rafale in F3R Standard has Indian Co-Pilot

The first flight of the French Air Force (FAF) Rafale jet in the F3R standard-equipped with the new generation Talios Targeting Pod- took off in the skies of Mons, France, on September 22.

A unique feature of the mission was that an Indian air force (IAF) pilot operated from the rear-seat of the twin-seater jet, French Ministry of Defense announced on September 30.

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The flight was undertaken by the fighter and experimentation squadron of the (FAF) Center of Military Air Expertise (CEAM), whose core business consists of testing future equipment.

The Air and Space Army is contributing to the rise of the Indian Air Force on the use of the Rafale. It was therefore natural that the Indian partners could realize the possibilities offered by the Talios Pod,” the release said.

The purpose of the mission was to demonstrate the capabilities of the Talios in the air-to-air, air-to-ground and air-to-sea domains. For this first flight, the Indian pilot was able to note the added value provided by the Talios compared to the (older Domacles) sensors.


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Concerning the air-to-ground capacity, the effectiveness of the Pod Talios both in its use during deep strike missions and in the detection and engagement of small moving targets was comprehended. In the air-to-sea domain, the Talios has proven itself in the tracking of boats.

The first operational capability of the Talios is expected for October 2020, in order to be able to deploy it very quickly in theaters of operations. It brings extended capabilities compared to the (older) Damocles pod, in particular by the increased precision of its optics, the improvement of the geo-location, the tracking of moving targets, the augmented reality to add markers on the area, and an infrared capability.
Are we having Talios with our Rafale? I think we are using lightning pods in rafale too.
 
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Are we having Talios with our Rafale? I think we are using lightning pods in rafale too.
They've been optioned but not bought. Kind of like the Hammer (which ended up being emergency-purchased due to Ladakh troubles), it's something that India reserved the right to buy later at an already-negotiated price but was not interested in getting with the main purchase because integration of a competing product (Litening pod, SPICE bomb kit) had been bought instead.
 
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How will we know which is better
Talios or Litening

We operate the Litening while we will have already tested the Talios.

Plus it's not easy to retrain pilots on a new system, so it's easier to use the Litening instead. Especially when the entire fleet uses it.

Also Litening has better specs. The latest Litening G5 even includes a SAR, which is a pretty significant upgrade.
 
This delusion is why we can't fix our problems. Why would they sanction spares when we are fighting there biggest adversary. America is not Germany. Their political leadership might be corrupt hacks who want to screw over their people but they are not people devoid of understanding of realpolitik and geopolitics. We won't have a problem of spares. Pakistan never had it even though they were screwing them for the last 50 years. It's only after Trump that they got screwed. And we have already signed most of alliance agreements with us. So as an ally they won't screw with our fleet. There MIC also will block it. India is the biggest arms market you think that they will try to screw with their biggest potential arms market. There is a reason why they are so desperate to shift there production lines of there aircrafts. Any other country would happily sign the deal for production lines. It's only we in our delusion of Nehruvian NAM that we can't understand who our friends are.
LOL wa
Oh goody. Kaveri redux.
Its a mirage. Good luck chasing it . again....
 
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We operate the Litening while we will have already tested the Talios.

Plus it's not easy to retrain pilots on a new system, so it's easier to use the Litening instead. Especially when the entire fleet uses it.

Also Litening has better specs. The latest Litening G5 even includes a SAR, which is a pretty significant upgrade.

I had another question

There have been reports that Rafale simply "disappears "from Radar screens using Spectra

So now that we are devising Battle Tactics and Plans , using Rafale
We would be able to see on our own ground Radars how far this is true

But Our Ground Controllers must be able to see the Entire Air Picture in a conflict , to direct the planes properly

So is it possible to be Invisible to the Enemy but Visible to your own Radars
At the SAME TIME
 
I had another question

There have been reports that Rafale simply "disappears "from Radar screens using Spectra

So now that we are devising Battle Tactics and Plans , using Rafale
We would be able to see on our own ground Radars how far this is true

But Our Ground Controllers must be able to see the Entire Air Picture in a conflict , to direct the planes properly

So is it possible to be Invisible to the Enemy but Visible to your own Radars
At the SAME TIME
Logically speaking, if both parties are using pesa radar then we can go invisible only towards enemy. But if both are having aesa, i think @Picdelamirand-oil will explain it.
 
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I had another question

There have been reports that Rafale simply "disappears "from Radar screens using Spectra

So now that we are devising Battle Tactics and Plans , using Rafale
We would be able to see on our own ground Radars how far this is true

But Our Ground Controllers must be able to see the Entire Air Picture in a conflict , to direct the planes properly

So is it possible to be Invisible to the Enemy but Visible to your own Radars
At the SAME TIME

Although I'm sure it's possible, I don't think it's desirable. We don't want any radar to see the Rafale, be it enemy or friend. But the Rafale will be able to stay on our screens through other means, using datalinks, where the aircraft can communicate its location to the ground controller.

But there are certain scenarios where the aircraft will be visible. For example, during ingress into enemy territory, the aft portion of the Rafale doesn't need to perform AC, so it will be visible on our radars. And during egress, SPECTRA will be active in the aft portion facing the enemy, so our radar will be able to see the Rafale coming back to base. So it's all specific to tactics and geography. Like over the oceans, we will need all-aspect stealth.
 
Although I'm sure it's possible, I don't think it's desirable. We don't want any radar to see the Rafale, be it enemy or friend. But the Rafale will be able to stay on our screens through other means, using datalinks, where the aircraft can communicate its location to the ground controller.

But there are certain scenarios where the aircraft will be visible. For example, during ingress into enemy territory, the aft portion of the Rafale doesn't need to perform AC, so it will be visible on our radars. And during egress, SPECTRA will be active in the aft portion facing the enemy, so our radar will be able to see the Rafale coming back to base. So it's all specific to tactics and geography. Like over the oceans, we will need all-aspect stealth.
Active Cancellation (AC) is not omnidirectional it is against Radars that were localised by SPECTRA so you can choose against what you use it.
For passive stealth you have no choice.
 
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Active Cancellation (AC) is not omnidirectional it is against Radars that were localised by SPECTRA so you can choose against what you use it.
For passive stealth you have no choice.

Shouldn't it be automatic though? With the exception of standard fixed radars that are well-known and can be geo-tagged beforehand, most ground radars are constantly on the move and hence the Rafale would rather stay invisible than do a full length IFF check with every single radar around.
 
Shouldn't it be automatic though? With the exception of standard fixed radars that are well-known and can be geo-tagged beforehand, most ground radars are constantly on the move and hence the Rafale would rather stay invisible than do a full length IFF check with every single radar around.
I don't know exactly what the whole process is, but it's clear that SPECTRA has to do threat assessment, technical analysis and classification of Radar, so it knows very well which are the Friendly Radar and which are the Enemy Radar.
 
I don't know exactly what the whole process is, but it's clear that SPECTRA has to do threat assessment, technical analysis and classification of Radar, so it knows very well which are the Friendly Radar and which are the Enemy Radar.

I suspect the Rafale pilot will query the threat level of the radar through control before flagging it and will remain invisible to the radar until it's cleared by control instead of simply relying on SPECTRA alone. Particularly in the case of army radars that are operating inside captured enemy territory. Or radar positions are geolocated and updated before the Rafale flies. Basically, I think it's much more manual than automatic.
 
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I suspect the Rafale pilot will query the threat level of the radar through control before flagging it and will remain invisible to the radar until it's cleared by control instead of simply relying on SPECTRA alone. Particularly in the case of army radars that are operating inside captured enemy territory. Or radar positions are geolocated and updated before the Rafale flies. Basically, I think it's much more manual than automatic.

It would make more sense to self tag friendlies and treat the rest as hostile.
 
It would make more sense to self tag friendlies and treat the rest as hostile.
It's not that easy since every radars have hidden modes even friendly ones. You also have to consider that your enemy is able to classified your signal very quicly. Then you very often have to change your modes. This means that you always have to classified signals whatevever the origin. But you can perhaps transmit codes in the signals or in a network link that help SPECTRA to recognize you.