Oh golly! What a dilemma!! What if one has Reliance shares but also wants the Congress to return to power, IAF & Rafale be damned? This is terrible. @Guynextdoor? Suji hain?
Rafale DH/EH of Indian Air Force : News and Discussions
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Rafale's F3-R Standard Aircraft Completes Maiden Flight in France
Rafale’s first aircraft upgraded to F3-R standard completed its first flight from Air base 118 at Mont-de-Marsan on 10 December, 2018, French Air Force said in a statement Thursday.
The F3-R version will be armed with a combination of the new Meteor long-range air-to-air missile and the RBE2 active electronic scanning radar; a new TALIOS pod that enhances day/night target detection, recognition and identification.
The upgrade also consists of an Automatic Ground Collision Avoidance System (AGCAS) that forms a sort of protective bubble around the aircraft to avoid a collision with the ground when, for example, a pilot loses consciousness. This is the first time such a system has been fitted to a French military aircraft.
The new standard also takes into account operational lessons learned, notable for the Modular Air Ground Armament (AASM), as well as interoperability and regulatory requirements.
The F3-R upgrade project for all 144 Rafale aircraft currently in French service was launched in October this year.
Rafale’s first aircraft upgraded to F3-R standard completed its first flight from Air base 118 at Mont-de-Marsan on 10 December, 2018, French Air Force said in a statement Thursday.
The F3-R version will be armed with a combination of the new Meteor long-range air-to-air missile and the RBE2 active electronic scanning radar; a new TALIOS pod that enhances day/night target detection, recognition and identification.
The upgrade also consists of an Automatic Ground Collision Avoidance System (AGCAS) that forms a sort of protective bubble around the aircraft to avoid a collision with the ground when, for example, a pilot loses consciousness. This is the first time such a system has been fitted to a French military aircraft.
The new standard also takes into account operational lessons learned, notable for the Modular Air Ground Armament (AASM), as well as interoperability and regulatory requirements.
The F3-R upgrade project for all 144 Rafale aircraft currently in French service was launched in October this year.
Or you simply can't admit to the flaws in the judgement, let alone the revelations the whole SC joke brought with it? No guarantees, confirmed deveations in the procedure, judgement based on wrong informations provided by the government, copy and paste by the SC of the contents from the government documents...Denial of facts, doesn't make the facts go away and not looking into an issue, doesn't mean there isn't one.
Rafale: HAL, which Rahul Gandhi is shedding tears for, is itself happy about Modi's deal with France
Even HAL just wants Rahul to shut up already.
Even HAL just wants Rahul to shut up already.
India inaugurates a bridge near the border with China on which its Rafale could also land
The Prime Minister has inaugurated a 4.9 km combined road-rail bridge, the longest of its kind in India, to strengthen its defences near its border with China. The structure, which crosses the Brahmaputra River, allows a fighter aircraft to land there in an emergency.
India inaugurated, in the presence of Narendra Modi, the Indian Prime Minister, the Bogibeel Bridge over the mighty Brahmaputra River in Assam State (north-east). Its construction required nearly 16 years of work and 800 million dollars (about 700 million euros). The bridge was built for a double track and a two-lane road, so that a fighter aircraft could land there in case of emergency. Could we ever see one of the 36 Rafales that India bought from Dassault Aviation in September 2016 land there?
Bogibeel is the first and only example of all-welded bridge construction in India. It has two levels: the railway track was built on the lower level to pass under the road, located on the upper level. The launch of its construction site was decided by the government, as part of an agreement dating back to 1985 and ending years of bloody unrest caused by Assamese nationalist groups.
Close to the Indian city of Dibrugarh (122,000 inhabitants), the bridge facilitates connections between the northern and southern banks of the Brahmaputra River in the eastern regions of Assam State and Arunachal Pradesh.
China and India disagree on the demarcation of their border
But above all, it has a strategic aspect because this structure allows the Indian army to deploy its forces more quickly in the neighbouring state of Arunachal Pradesh, which borders China. The two major powers still disagree strongly on the delineation of their borders in this state, which was integrated into Indian territory at the time of British colonization but whose sovereignty China strongly claims.
The construction of the bridge shortens the rail journey between Dibrugarh and Itanagar, capital of Arunachal Pradesh, by 750 km and the road by 150 km.
India had already opened a 9.1 km road-only bridge in 2017 linking Assam and Arunachal Pradesh, between the cities of Dhola and Sadiya, with the stated aim of improving its defences.
L'Inde inaugure près de la frontière avec la Chine un pont sur lequel pourraient aussi atterrir ses Rafale
The Prime Minister has inaugurated a 4.9 km combined road-rail bridge, the longest of its kind in India, to strengthen its defences near its border with China. The structure, which crosses the Brahmaputra River, allows a fighter aircraft to land there in an emergency.
India inaugurated, in the presence of Narendra Modi, the Indian Prime Minister, the Bogibeel Bridge over the mighty Brahmaputra River in Assam State (north-east). Its construction required nearly 16 years of work and 800 million dollars (about 700 million euros). The bridge was built for a double track and a two-lane road, so that a fighter aircraft could land there in case of emergency. Could we ever see one of the 36 Rafales that India bought from Dassault Aviation in September 2016 land there?
Bogibeel is the first and only example of all-welded bridge construction in India. It has two levels: the railway track was built on the lower level to pass under the road, located on the upper level. The launch of its construction site was decided by the government, as part of an agreement dating back to 1985 and ending years of bloody unrest caused by Assamese nationalist groups.
Close to the Indian city of Dibrugarh (122,000 inhabitants), the bridge facilitates connections between the northern and southern banks of the Brahmaputra River in the eastern regions of Assam State and Arunachal Pradesh.
China and India disagree on the demarcation of their border
But above all, it has a strategic aspect because this structure allows the Indian army to deploy its forces more quickly in the neighbouring state of Arunachal Pradesh, which borders China. The two major powers still disagree strongly on the delineation of their borders in this state, which was integrated into Indian territory at the time of British colonization but whose sovereignty China strongly claims.
The construction of the bridge shortens the rail journey between Dibrugarh and Itanagar, capital of Arunachal Pradesh, by 750 km and the road by 150 km.
India had already opened a 9.1 km road-only bridge in 2017 linking Assam and Arunachal Pradesh, between the cities of Dhola and Sadiya, with the stated aim of improving its defences.
L'Inde inaugure près de la frontière avec la Chine un pont sur lequel pourraient aussi atterrir ses Rafale
Yes it seems so, but finally the ends supporting the light bulbs seem to be at about the level of the white line.
An interesting document that compiles a large amount of information on the "Rafale" case
Is there any scam in the Rafale deal?
https://www.quora.com/Is-there-any-scam-in-the-Rafale-deal
A few excerpts to give an idea of the content:
First of all, there is a reminder of the whole history of Indian aeronautics with the emphasis on what the author considers to be blunders
Second there is a Rafale price analysis:
In next post
Is there any scam in the Rafale deal?
https://www.quora.com/Is-there-any-scam-in-the-Rafale-deal
A few excerpts to give an idea of the content:
First of all, there is a reminder of the whole history of Indian aeronautics with the emphasis on what the author considers to be blunders
Second there is a Rafale price analysis:
Further what are the issues in the deal?
PRICE
INC’s Deal never happened, so they technically don’t have any right to ask for costs nor are they citing their sources, but general public may compare our deal to other customers via a simple google search.
Here we find that:
So considering the fact that each country has different requirement hence different customisations therefore fully furnished aircrafts final cost may vary BUT from which angle does it looks that there has been a huge difference between us and other customer’s deal . There is only a mere difference of 6.3% on cost per piece at the two polar ends.
- Rafale has 3 Customers:
- India
- Qatar
- Egypt
- Each Country has bought
- 36 Pcs
- 36 Pcs
- 24 Pcs
- Deal for each country was sealed in (Bn Euros)
- 7.87
- 7.4
- 5.2
- Cost per piece for each country( million euros)
- 218.61
- 205.5
- 216
This effectively and brutally demolishes RaGa’s and INC’s hullabaloo claim of the deal being over priced. It’s a complete BS.
Further now to real facts:
- The figure of Rs.525 crore or approximately €79 million per Rafale, which the Indian National Congress has been citing, is based on Dassault’s 2007 RFP response at the then exchange rate (€I = Rs.66) and that too for only the 18 Rafales that were to be delivered off-the-shelf .
- The 2007 price for each of the 18 Rafales would have amounted in 2015 to €100.85 million (Rs.765.4 crore at 2015 exchange rate of €1 = Rs 75.90).
- In comparison, the average price of each of the 36 “bare/green” Rafales bought in 2016 is €91.7 million (Rs.696 crore at the 2015 exchange rate), lower than both the earlier 2007 Rafale and Eurofighter EF-2000 RFP responses.
In next post
OFFSETS
To understand the offsets crystal clear we need to get the one fact clear
“DASSAULT ALONE DOESNOT MAKE ENTIRE AIRCRAFT”
The pic aboves shows how different companies are invloved in entire Rafale Jet.
The major companies are:
Now here are the Indian off set partners:
*OEM= Original Equipment Manufacturer
*IOP= Indian Offset Partner
The Customer specific modifications of India are as follows:
To understand the offsets crystal clear we need to get the one fact clear
“DASSAULT ALONE DOESNOT MAKE ENTIRE AIRCRAFT”
The pic aboves shows how different companies are invloved in entire Rafale Jet.
The major companies are:
- Dassault
- MBDA
- Rheinmetall
- Snecma
- Thales
Now here are the Indian off set partners:
*OEM= Original Equipment Manufacturer
*IOP= Indian Offset Partner
The Customer specific modifications of India are as follows:
- RAFAEL- LITENING target acquisition/designation pod
- Spice-1000 standoff PGM
- MBDA- Meteor BVRAAM and ALARM anti-radiation missile
- RAFAEL- X-Guard towed-decoy
- SPECTRA EW
- TARGO-2 HMDS supplied by Elbit Systems
- THALES- traffic collision avoidance system (TCAS)
- THALES- standby radar altimeter
- Optimisation of the M88 turbofan’s jet-fuel starter for operating in sub-zero temperatures at altitudes above 9,000 feet ASL
- Increase in the capacity of the on-board OBOGS
- Inclusion of weather-mapping mode of operation in the THALES-supplied RBE-2 AESA-MMR
- Development of quad-pack ejectors for the DRDO-engineered and Spice-250 PGM-derived SAAW EMP-generating standoff PGM
- JV in flight-qualification of DRDO-developed 450kg laser-guided HSLD bomb and integration of the bomb’s FOG-based inertial navigation system with the Rafale’s on-board Sigma-95N RLG-INS through a MIL-STD-1553B interface
- Modification of the Sigma-95N RLG-INS’ coupled GPS transceiver in order to receive MIL-STD PY-code coordinates from India’s NAVIC/IRNSS constellation of GPS satellites.
And then the Kaveri saga (to be seen by following the link)
And then the question is WHY NOT HAL?
And then the question is WHY NOT HAL?
DRDO has been quite honest with R&D despite hiccups but when it comes to manufacture en mass which is supposed to be done by HAL, there work ethos has been questioned for many years.
Latest News:
- 15 December 2018: Now Kharge is a key member of INC. Yes the same INC whose president shows sympathy to HAL in rallies while his key minister scre*s them in Parliament.
You want to see more proofs why Dassault was hesitant to go with HAL?
Here it is:
- Wanna have more? This same congress during it’s tenure set up a Standing Committee to review HAL and made 88 page long report rebuking it left and right. Here is the proof[http://164.100.47.193/lsscommitt...]
Continuation
These are some vital excerpts from the said reports. These go on to reinstate two things:
Further several more questions arises here and ought to be asked to congress and it’s highly knowledgeable supporters
- Neither HAL is a victim, it’s history would make any foreign company think twice before collaborating, otherwise they may permanently loose market as big as India like Denel did . No body wants that.
- Nor Congress is a Saviour. It has roasted HAL while in tenure today Kharge roasted whilst in opposition. So RaGa’s HAL visit is a mere farce nothing else.
But here are some hard and cold facts regarding the same during Modi’s regime:
- In 2010 INC signed a $4.1 Bn deal for C-17 Globemaster with US, what stopped them from going for offset programme and include HAL as beneficiary if they were so concerned about it?
- In 2011 C-130 Hercules were inducted in IAF, but the off set was given to TATA, why was HAL kept out?
- During the Rafale’s offset why was Mukesh ambani’s company allowed to be offset partner, what experience did he have, however the pact expired dassault finally collaborated with Anil Ambani RDEL to form RADA which was 49:51 sharing between Dassault and Reliance hence Ambani don’t owns the entire company. Therefore even if “Modi ji puts 30000 Crore in Ambani’s pocket” Ambani still actually gets 153000 Crs but that’s not possible as said DRDO, BEL, THALES etc wanna have their share too, How do you justify his 30000 Cr jibe? BS again!
- What was the total value of deals given to HAL during UPA tenure?Don’t know.
That’s a failrly well order book as well as prospect for a company . How many solid orders did congress give?
- LCA MK-1A: 123 (Biggest Order book)
- LCH: (65 + 114)Pcs (IOC granted, first batch of 15 purchased for user assisted trials[UAT])
- ALH Dhruv: 33Pcs
- DO-228 for Civil use under UDAAN scheme.
- HTT-40 : 100 Pcs (DAC cleared, but order only when project completed on time else opt for Pilatus trainer further.)
- Drones for CRPF in Naxal regions.
- Upgradation for SU-30 .
- Formed a collaboration with Boeing and Mahindra for taking part in Naval MRCBF tender for 57 fighters.
- Modi regime re-started the NAL-HAL Saras aircraft programme after 9 years whose potential order will go upto 70, if HAL don’t scre*s up.
5. INS Vikramaditya, we bought earlier negotiated 800Mn$ carrier for navy from Russia finally in 2.5Bn$, Why?
6. FGFA(5 th generation aircraft),T-90 deals were very faulty:
- we are the co-developer of FGFA we paid for it’s R&D we got nothing but only the disappointment, our pilots and engineers are not even allowed to get near to it.Project started in 2007(Congress), we were almost 40% financing the project, but our workshare was below 15% of this project.
- T-90: Deal was signed in 2007, Transfer of Technology was agreed upon, but never happened, all this has to be replaced by modifying technologies developed from our very own Arjun Tank. T-90 never had a crew cabin cooling system(curse in desert area), Night vision, thermal vision, all are modified tech from Arjun and produced by BEL. T-90 even lost against Arjun Mk-1 in comparative trials which eas later re-iterated by CAG but but but again second batch was ordered of the same loosing T-90 sidelining arjun for reasons of being “Heavy” when it has a ground pressure lower than T-90, when it is not night blind and when IT HAS WON IN A FACE TO FACE TRIALS.
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And then WHY RELIANCE?
You see this big boys here? Guess who is it?
United States Navy 7th fleet [USS 7th fleet]
It’s based in Japan and it’s sole purpose is to maintain power balance in Indo-Pacific region along with other allies including India against any Chinese domination in International waters. At present, it is the largest of the forward-deployed U.S. fleets, with 60 to 70 ships, 300 aircraft and 40,000 Navy and Marine Corps personnel.
Now it’s certain these ships requires lot of maintainance and it can’t be done by some Joker, guess who is the maintainance contractor?
ANS: RDEL [Proof: Reliance Defence to maintain USN's 7th Fleet ships]
Perhaps this alone is sufficient to settle down the fact that “AMBANI HAS NO EXPERIENCE IN DEFENSE BUSINESS”.
Now let’s come to said deal
It remains a no brainer to say Ambani has no experience of Defense sector or knowledge about it, that’s a utter crappy logic let’s take an solid example:
Ever heard of Lockheed Martin?
Yes the one which has churned legends like F-22, SR-71. It’s the biggest arms manufacturer on this planet
Who is it’s CEO?
Marillyn Adams Hewson
You know her education?
It’s nowhere closely related to the field concerned neither engineering nor applied science.
She is a BBA and a Master of Arts in Economics.
Anil Ambani is a BSC and MBA.
Education wise their is not much difference albeit Anil Ambani does have a STEM background.
Now he is not going to have to go to the factory personally and personally make those products, he has the finacial resources with which he can hire appropriate people who can get his job done same stands with him buying out Pipavav Yard same applies to him joining hands with Dassault albeit this time Dassault shall provide the technical know how and Know-what and Reliance will be the Indian host to Dassault to enter Indian Markets as DPP only allows foreign company for 100% FDI only under automatic route which is not the case here.
Here several points are to be remembered:
- Rafale will be bought off the shelf from France and all of it will be completely manufactured by France and In France.
- Reliance doesnot have any job to do regarding Rafale.
- Reliance will not alone be benefited by offset clause, it is JV of Dassault and Reliance called DRAL in Nagpur that will cadre to the offset clause.
- DRAL will manufacture composite nose cones for Dassault’s Falcon passenger jet, which has lucrative market in India keeping in mind the UDAAN scheme that requires smaller chartered flights.
Other projects:
Reliance Defence speeds up Rs 2,500-crore patrol vessel project
Now I will debunk the exprience lie further?
Let’s get into some technical detail.
The nose cones are basically a composite material made of various kinds of composites.Because they protect sensitive instruments while allowing electronic signals to pass through, nose cones – also known as radomes – must be made from specific materials. These materials often include fiberglass, quartz, honeycomb and foam cores; as well as various chemical resins. All comes under various types of Composites.
Further divided into A-Sandwich and C-Sandwich, Sandwich radomes tend to offer better performance over narrow frequency bands, making them the preferred option for military and scientific applications. A-Sandwich radomes are comprised of low-dielectric foam or a honeycomb core between two slender laminates.
A C-sandwich radome is made up of three skin layers and two foam layers. The solidity of each foam layer can be tuned for ideal RF performance, allowing for many probable constructions that offer high-quality RF performance and mechanical strength. C-sandwich also provides better performance than A-sandwich radomes.
[More at :Honeycomb structure - Wikipedia, Aircraft Nose Cone Construction and Maintenance]
Now since same RDEL is related to ship business for a long while here comes the next part how even ship building has composites manufacturing and application playing vital part.
Composite materials have been used in the marine industry for a number of years. The more traditional applications for composites include gratings, ducts, shafts, piping, hull shells, etc for several decades. Wood and ferrocement are some of the other composites techniques that are still being used for marine applications.
Marine Composite Materials
Ferrocement
Ferrocement is probably the earliest use of composites in the Marine industry, used for developing low-cost barges. A steel frame formed of reinforcing rod that is covered with chicken wire, is used as a 'template' to form the hull by pouring cement around the template. It is then plastered with ferrocement and then cured. Although it is an inexpensive composite, armature corrosion is a common problem under chemically aggressive marine conditions. However, there are still a number of ferro boats in use today.
Glass reinforced plastic
Glass fibers became available just after the development of polyester resins. Glass reinforced plastic boats came into existence since the early 1950s and are a significant composite construction technique in Marine applications today.
Wood/Adhesive Composites
Wartime requirements led to the development of 'hot molded' and 'cold molded' boat building techniques based on laying thin wood veneers over a frame. On the other hand, high-performance, urea-based adhesives have also been widely developed for molding marine hulls and in aircraft manufacture to help speed up the production process and reduce dependency on Aluminum and steel.
Aramid fiber Composites
Aramid fibers are being widely used to strengthen sailing yacht structures like keel and bow sections. Also, Aramid Fiber composites also have improved shock absorption characteristics, perfect for ocean racing applications.
Carbon fiber
Carbon fibers are increasingly used for sailboats, furniture on super-yachts and high strength interior moldings as they offer vessel stability benefits and high performance with minimal weight.
So if RADA is making composites part for aerospace they are not completely new to it ,they have been in composites application, Defense Business, but in marine defense application here they just stepped in aerospace composites application. Hence they are new to aerospace but neither to defense nor to composites technology.
The statement is more about the strength of the bridge than its actual use. You can't land any aircraft on that bridge due to side walls also.
Exactly. in India a three lane road has each lane of just about 3.25m. Its the lowest in the world. The world average is 3.5m.
It just doesn't seem practical to me to try to land something on a bridge. Besides, what would be the point? You can't park the supply trucks to the side since to the side you've got the void. Landing on highways can make sense in a pinch; landing on a bridge would be a pure stunt with no practical uses. Even if the bridge was wide enough to actually land anything on it!
Yeah. It's one of the few strips of road which is straight though, but the width seems to be the problem.