Sukhoi Su-30MKI

Rajput Lion said:
This current combined effort by HAL, BEL and MIDHANI could be part of much secretive 'Project Ganga' to improve AL-31FP's service life(&TBO), reduce its maintenance and maybe even increase its power to 130KN.

If our scientists can achieve the above, then no need for a new engine, IMO. I already proved that empty weight of MKI(MKM) is sub 18 tonnes. Now with modern electronics and systems in the MLU, further weight reduction shall be achieved. So maybe even upgraded and uprated AL-31FP may achieve the same results as AL-41F-1S.

But a lot of work seems to happen behind the curtain about future roadmap of MKI upgrades.

And it's 2022😉 @randomradio @_Anonymous_
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Btw that 2022 doesn't apply to you . It's exclusive & patented out here .

Jokes apart , what you're suggesting is transformational . I don't think it's anything like that . Whatever improvements HAL & team's made would be incremental . That's in the nature of such upgrades else NPO themselves would've come out with such a development.

Think about it - if every Turbofan OEM could thru upgrades increase the thrust of the engine substantially & double their service life , what're we even talking about here ?
 
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Rajput Lion said:
This current combined effort by HAL, BEL and MIDHANI could be part of much secretive 'Project Ganga' to improve AL-31FP's service life(&TBO), reduce its maintenance and maybe even increase its power to 130KN.

If our scientists can achieve the above, then no need for a new engine, IMO. I already proved that empty weight of MKI(MKM) is sub 18 tonnes. Now with modern electronics and systems in the MLU, further weight reduction shall be achieved. So maybe even upgraded and uprated AL-31FP may achieve the same results as AL-41F-1S.

But a lot of work seems to happen behind the curtain about future roadmap of MKI upgrade.

And it's 2022😉 @randomradio @_Anonymous_
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If the AL-31FP modernisation works out, then we don't need the 117S. But you can bet it's gonna take a long time to get it to work whereas 117S is available today. The AL-31FP is HAL's cash cow though, so they are defintiely going to resist the change to 117S.

Yep, 2022.
 
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HAL test pilot had said different engine change seldom occurs for a fighter.

And i dont believe any Major upgrade of Su 30 mki will happen in next 3 years atleast.

Post 2025 , if we sign the deal, it may take another 3 years to upgrade.

My pessimistic prediction is , super sukhoi will fly after 2028.
 
Sathya said:
My pessimistic prediction is , super sukhoi will fly after 2028.
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Minus the engine upgrades I think the FOC of the Super Sukhoi should be thru by 2026 . It's a question of how many MKIs will go thru the Super Sukhoi upgrades & how fast will they accomplish it ? Apparently , IAF isn't keen to upgrade it's entire lot of MKIs which I think is another foolish blunder considering our numbers against the Chinese.

As far as the upgradation of the engines go I think it's more an issue of finances besides the AL-41 F-1S being certified on the MKIs ( which prima facie shouldn't be an issue ) & the torturous negotiations . If that's not all it's the payment route , which took nearly 2-3 yrs to resolve for the S-400, which needs to be sorted & I'm not sure if whatever was devised then as a payment mechanism was a one off solution or could be a permanent one .
 
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_Anonymous_ said:
Btw that 2022 doesn't apply to you . It's exclusive & patented out here .
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Yeah, I know! Just happen to mention it ever so "randomly",lol😂
_Anonymous_ said:
Jokes apart , what you're suggesting is transformational . I don't think it's anything like that . Whatever improvements HAL & team's made would be incremental . That's in the nature of such upgrades else NPO themselves would've come out with such a development.

Think about it - if every Turbofan OEM could thru upgrades increase the thrust of the engine substantially & double their service life , what're we even talking about here ?
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True, if we get any substantial thrust gain, it's going to be awesome. Lets see!
randomradio said:
If the AL-31FP modernisation works out, then we don't need the 117S. But you can bet it's gonna take a long time to get it to work whereas 117S is available today. The AL-31FP is HAL's cash cow though, so they are defintiely going to resist the change to 117S.

Yep, 2022.
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Apparently, these components are already tested and validated on our reserve Su-30MKI test-bed. Now, HAL is looking to ask the Russians to provide certification, so that fleet wise upgradation could be done without voiding OEM's warranty or pissing off the Russians.

These desi components have helped increase the life of AL-31FP and also improve its performance. Now by how much? Only time will tell.
 
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Sathya said:
HAL test pilot had said different engine change seldom occurs for a fighter.

And i dont believe any Major upgrade of Su 30 mki will happen in next 3 years atleast.

Post 2025 , if we sign the deal, it may take another 3 years to upgrade.

My pessimistic prediction is , super sukhoi will fly after 2028.
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Engine change is quite frequent on Russian birds. Both Mig-21 and Mig-29 got new engines during MLUs. Mig-27's reengine plan failed, as did Jaguar's.
 
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As far as i know, the al-31fp indi plan was more of making the core metal component stuff, superalloys & those built as per Russian specification, sometimes bought directly from rus, now these are turned as local made indigenous superalloy & get international certification for that, esp for the titanium. It was a hint in an old Midhani booklet I think. This helps in 2 ways, first you get a local supplier for those independent of Rus that can now manufacture without rus spec sheet, not rely on one country as source. Secondly, with int certification, that local company can get into export & even foreign oem who have Indian mfg unit but had to procure those alloy from outside, now have local supplier. Titanium is a classic case, Airbus got shortfall problem as Rus are major supplier, now they can buy from Midhani if Midhani can certify those product to Int standard, Nedcap etc.

 
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marich01 said:
As far as i know, the al-31fp indi plan was more of making the core metal component stuff, superalloys & those built as per Russian specification, sometimes bought directly from rus, now these are turned as local made indigenous superalloy & get international certification for that, esp for the titanium. It was a hint in an old Midhani booklet I think. This helps in 2 ways, first you get a local supplier for those independent of Rus that can now manufacture without rus spec sheet, not rely on one country as source. Secondly, with int certification, that local company can get into export & even foreign oem who have Indian mfg unit but had to procure those alloy from outside, now have local supplier. Titanium is a classic case, Airbus got shortfall problem as Rus are major supplier, now they can buy from Midhani if Midhani can certify those product to Int standard, Nedcap etc.

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That's what I thought . It's more about import substitution than anything .
 
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marich01 said:
https://twitter.com/x/status/1611649107839582208

https://twitter.com/x/status/1611644178039197696
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Over the years I've seen many people online who just shit over Su-30MKI, but..

But, just look at the pride and confidence of those who actually fly this super plane.

As per S.L. Bhavna Kanth ma'am it can carry air-to-air and air-to-ground mission simultaneously. That's makes it a pefect swing role/omni role plane.

According to G.C. Arpit Kala sir, it's one of the best planes around. As per him the capability of the plane plus the IAF's training gives it combat edge over the others.


That's what I've always believed myself😃
 
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Rajput Lion said:
Over the years I've seen many people online who just shit over Su-30MKI, but..
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Because its shit.
Rajput Lion said:
But, just look at the pride and confidence of those who actually fly this super plane.
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Its the same case with all IAF guys on every aircraft, including widowmaker-21 aka Mig21

Rajput Lion said:
As per S.L. Bhavna Kanth ma'am it can carry air-to-air and air-to-ground mission simultaneously. That's makes it a pefect swing role/omni role plane.
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Tye only advantage MKI is having is, it can carry Brahmos standard & ER version.
Regarding a2a &a2g simultaneously? Really? @vstol Jockey do MKI posses such capabilities in single mission?
Rajput Lion said:
According to G.C. Arpit Kala sir, it's one of the best planes around. As per him the capability of the plane plus the IAF's training gives it combat edge over the others.


That's what I've always believed myself😃
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He is clearly wrong on first, second i think yeas. But you cannot win battle only with training, its like expecting a well trained swordmen to survive in 21st Battlefield.
 
https://twitter.com/x/status/1612697408571584512

FmFzpdHaUAAUWL-
 
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Rajput Lion said:
So our MKI is omni-role fighter then. But no one talks about this ability anywhere at all. While whole Dassault marketing around Rafale is based upon this omni-role/swing-role term.
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Just like Dassault overhypes the EW suite of Rafale by fancy names like SPECTRE while everyone has got one.
 
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