Indian AESA Radar Developments

Rajput Lion · Oct 10, 2024

Those who think MKI's engine won't produce enough electrical power to juice up this airborne beast. Well let me remind all of you that an Uttam early prototype with ~736 GaAs TRMS tracked another Tejas(0.3m2 RCS) from 140kms away. Yes tracked not just detected. MKI even now has way more electrical power than Tejas.

MKI1A with 992 TRMs will do even better. MK2 with ~1200-1400 GaN TRMs would enhance this range substantially. Just think what an AESA radar with 2400 GaN TRMs would be able to do

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To look far away as compared to Uttam is "the basic" design objective of Vipupaksha. It may track a Tejas like LO/RO RCS from way farther away than what the erstwhile Uttam prototype achieved. That's a given. Here is the proof directly from the horse's mouth:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1825908881098174924

Dr. B. K. Das: "Virupaksha will have a far bigger range than Uttam."

Gautam · Oct 10, 2024

This company makes radar & EW thermal management systems:

RASALGHUL · Oct 10, 2024

Rajput Lion said:
Well let me remind all of you that an Uttam early prototype with ~736 GaAs TRMS tracked another Tejas(0.3m2 RCS) from 140kms away.

Source?

Rajput Lion · Oct 10, 2024

Why is that whenever I post/claim something good about Indian Defense Industry; some people here start to ask for proofs or source

.

RASALGHUL said:
Source?

Bro, are you part of Khangress group?

Anyways:

In the screenshots, Uttam appears to be keeping a 'FOX3-worthy' lock at a Tejas well beyond 140 kilometers and that's really something. Tejas easily has the lowest radar signature (for a non-stealth combat aircraft) in its class. Air-to-Air mode is where Uttam has exceeded expectations. It also has advanced NCTR and imaging capabilities.

Source: Thoughts About the New Uttam AESA RADAR- MK1A (and some other stuff)

Ashwin · Oct 10, 2024

Rajput Lion said:
Why is that whenever I post/claim something good about Indian Defense Industry; some people here start to ask for proofs or source.

Bro, are you part of Khangress group?

Asking for proof is a good habit that needs to be encouraged. It is important to be cautious about accepting limited information that aligns with your pre-existing beliefs. There is a significant trust deficit created by the continued failures of institutions like DRDO and PSUs. It will take time to take them for their word.

Today, without editors to fact-check, we must draw our own conclusions when consuming videos or blogs where the incentive is to exaggerate. Most things we discuss here is based on very limited information, with the actual results being far into the future. Therefore, it is difficult to self-correct our biases and reset our expectations. The longer you follow these programs, the more cynical you become. Maybe its just part of getting old.

marich01 · Oct 10, 2024

See Uttam was a TD , a project to establish and prove the aesa radar and its core tech with subsystems. Do not think it as a single radar. Think it as the technical building block that enables to build the radar.

Think it like how cheeni, or sugar is in nature. It is sweet on its own, but you do not eat it solely as a sweet. You eat different food items that contains sugar in it for the sweetness. Those different food items are the applications of sugars sweetness and the content varies from one item to another. Similarly the Uttam config trm nos , size etc would vary across the platform it will be put on, which in turn will be based upon the power level available on the said platform. All these are specific input satisfying condition permitting, not any kind of blind plug and play method. Virupaksha will go through a lot of testing, the rigs will be made both satisfying power requirement , max/min level, mimicking airborne condition everything , for airworthy certification process.

Sathya · Oct 10, 2024

Even without any data, I feel India would like to maintain the philosophy behind the Su 30 Mki,

Big fighter with big radar and long range missile.. To see first and fire first.

Maximum power that could be drawn from engines will the sought out power..

Very Long range missiles will be part of its arsenal.

Adm_Kenobi · Oct 10, 2024

Rajput Lion said:
Those who think MKI's engine won't produce enough electrical power to juice up this airborne beast. Well let me remind all of you that an Uttam early prototype with ~736 GaAs TRMS tracked another Tejas(0.3m2 RCS) from 140kms away. Yes tracked not just detected. MKI even now has way more electrical power than Tejas.

MKI1A with 992 TRMs will do even better. MK2 with ~1200-1400 GaN TRMs would enhance this range substantially. Just think what an AESA radar with 2400 GaN TRMs would be able to do.

To look far away as compared to Uttam is "the basic" design objective of Vipupaksha. It may track a Tejas like LO/RO RCS from way farther away than what the erstwhile Uttam prototype achieved. That's a given. Here is the proof directly from the horse's mouth:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1825908881098174924

Dr. B. K. Das: "Virupaksha will have a far bigger range than Uttam."

The LCA in a clean configuration isn't 0.3m^2 from all angles, and it did not track a clean configuration Tejas, external fuel tanks act like a truck when it comes to radar returns.
The prototype Uttam can track a 2m^2 target at around 150km.
Mk1A will have 912 TRMs, and Mk2 will have around a thousand (not 1200-1400).

Rajput Lion · Oct 10, 2024

Adm_Kenobi said:
The LCA in a clean configuration isn't 0.3m^2 from all angles

Yup, only from frontal 90° arc.

Adm_Kenobi said:
, and it did not track a clean configuration Tejas, external fuel tanks act like a truck when it comes to radar returns.

It's not clear whether the "target" aircraft was loaded with EFTs or not.

Adm_Kenobi said:
The prototype Uttam can track a 2m^2 target at around 150km.

Regardless, tracking another Tejas from 82NM(147.8kms) is amazing performance.

Adm_Kenobi said:
Mk1A will have 912 TRMs, and Mk2 will have around a thousand (not 1200-1400).

Earlier Uttam MK1 was supposed to be with 736 TRMs. But as our tech matured Uttam MK1 version that is going on Tejas MK1A has anything from 912 to 992 TRMs. The exact count is not clear. Anyways, both 912/992 TRM count itself is very close to 1000 TRMs.

So my guess is that with Vivaldi TSAs Uttam MK2 will have even superior/tighter/denser TRM packaging. So it should have more than 1000 TRMs, IMO. Anyways, even with 1000 GaN TRMs, it should clearly outperform RBE2 AESA. So good for us

flanker · Oct 10, 2024

Rajput Lion said:
Vivaldi TSAs on a tile array is my guess. Maybe @marich01 and @Chain Smoker sirs shall clear it!

Yeah the previous uttam had TSA

flanker · Oct 10, 2024

Speedster1 said:
Let's hope they also replace the current metallic radome wiith a composite, frequency selective one, derived from AMCA tech. This will improve the radar's resistance to EW.

Yes they're is already a project going on it will also have stealth characters

Speedster1 said:
And while they're at it, hope they delete the pitot tube too. That will give the bird so much more oomph!

The Bars weighed some 600kg and could detect 5m2 targets out to 400km iirc. If the Virupaksha can provide comparable performance at about half the weight, we have a winner. Good thing that the Astra family will finally allow MKI pilots to exploit nearly the full range of the radar.

Bars was mammoth weighed 650kg. This also boost the potential of what they can put in it.
I believe 2400 elements are not alone for x band. They already put L band into mk1As radar. The 912 trms out of 992 where for x band and rest of for L band and could be for even diverse bandwidth. This all will go in virupaksha but much improved as GaN has greater bandwidth. I wish tejulal gets a GaN uttam.

Rajput Lion · Oct 10, 2024

flanker said:
Yeah the previous uttam had TSA

Nah. Uttam MK1 that will enter production from the 41st Tejas MK1A still uses "Dipole Antenna"(using GaAs semi-conductor). It's still a wide-band antenna, but.......

........But, MK2, MKI UPG. & AMCA will use TSA(Tapered Slot Antenna) or Flared Notch Antenna/Vivaldi(using GaN semi-conductor). It's ultra wide-band in nature and can have bandwidth as large as 5GHz. Just call it game-changing for the future of air-warfare.

flanker · Oct 10, 2024

Rajput Lion said:
Nah. Uttam MK1 that will enter production from the 41st Tejas MK1A still uses

Rajput Lion said:
"Dipole Antenna"(using GaAs semi-conductor). It's still a wide-band antenna, but.......

Dipole isn't that wide ig.
But I have heard Tejas mk1a uttam will have TSAs. Ig the dipole was in the predecessor with 700trms

Rajput Lion said:
........But, MK2, MKI UPG. & AMCA will use TSA(Tapered Slot Antenna) or Flared Notch Antenna/Vivaldi(using GaN semi-conductor). It's ultra wide-band in nature and can have bandwidth as large as 5GHz. Just call it game-changing for the future of air-warfare.

I think the astra seeker has Vivaldi so we have both the techs.
Btw I had heard TSA is transverse slot array and is different from Vivaldi trms. Can u guys shed some light @Rajput Lion

Rajput Lion · Oct 10, 2024

flanker said:
Dipole isn't that wide ig.
But I have heard Tejas mk1a uttam will have TSAs. Ig the dipole was in the predecessor with 700trms
View attachment 37037

Not the MK1 variant but from MK2 variant, AFAIK. Though I hope you are correct on this one as I would love to see TSA TRMs on MK1 itself

flanker said:
I think the astra seeker has Vivaldi so we have both the techs.

Correct:

flanker said:
Btw I had heard TSA is transverse slot array and is different from Vivaldi trms. Can u guys shed some light @Rajput Lion

Nope. Both Tapered and Transverse Slot Antenna are known as Vivaldi. They both are Ultra Wide Band and almost identical in form or function(the latter used in a more miniaturized form).

SkNajidHossain · Oct 13, 2024

marich01 said:
See Uttam was a TD , a project to establish and prove the aesa radar and its core tech with subsystems. Do not think it as a single radar. Think it as the technical building block that enables to build the radar.

Think it like how cheeni, or sugar is in nature. It is sweet on its own, but you do not eat it solely as a sweet. You eat different food items that contains sugar in it for the sweetness. Those different food items are the applications of sugars sweetness and the content varies from one item to another. Similarly the Uttam config trm nos , size etc would vary across the platform it will be put on, which in turn will be based upon the power level available on the said platform. All these are specific input satisfying condition permitting, not any kind of blind plug and play method. Virupaksha will go through a lot of testing, the rigs will be made both satisfying power requirement , max/min level, mimicking airborne condition everything , for airworthy certification process.

Sir as Virupaksha being devloped for Su-30 has more than 2000+ TRM, will the current AL31FP engine has the power capacity to for such Radar?

marich01 · Oct 13, 2024

SkNajidHossain said:
Sir as Virupaksha being devloped for Su-30 has more than 2000+ TRM, will the current AL31FP engine has the power capacity to for such Radar?

Already answered in the above posts.