Indian Political Discussion

[BlackOpsIndia]

We the people of India.

Not

We the Muslims of India

You should teach this to Congress or the Muslims first instead of BJP.

I never said they are foreigners, they are one of us. Its not the mistake of Muslims that they got spoiled by preferential treatment, but the mistake of Congress who divided India purely for vote bank. The most communal party and the one that is attacking India is left and Congress, everytime they go to pamper a section it creates more space for Hindu extremists and more acceptability for them.

From ideological point of view, forum debates, TV shows "two wrongs don't make a right" looks fancy but unfortunately at least in UP, only two wrongs makes it right. If Modi insult them they pay back in kind forgetting what lies ahead and if Congress insult them they wipe it out.

 

[vstol Jockey]

Spit n scoot later apologize after law suit, who will pay for the damage and loss of reputation caused by such faker party politicians. He should be made to pay the fine, so he learns a lesson that wild allegations cause loss of money.

And ask for apology only after all elections including local body elections are over.

 

[Aravind]

LOL

Under the Hindu right, they still get and have all of that.

So what has Modi done for you?

Mesees a topi in there somewhere.

Cheers, Doc

you change team again you havent answered why these privileges were given and pampered by your Nehru Secularism in first place, if there is a topi its a Nehru with a Mullah topi.
Triple Talaq ban was a start of Modi and Hindu right 10 years is a long time to see a lot of changes. wait for it.
You are not a good salesman for Secularism, nobody buys it now and you are worried about it.

 

[vsdoc]

everytime they go to pamper a section it creates more space for Hindu extremists and more acceptability for them.

So similar to the Islamist refrain of how evil America is forcing them to strap bombs to their chests and blow stuff up.

Hope you get it.

Cheers, Doc

 

[BlackOpsIndia]

you change team again you havent answered why these privileges were given and pampered by your Nehru Secularism in first place, if there is a topi its a Nehru with a Mullah topi.
Triple Talaq ban was a start of Modi and Hindu right 10 years is a long time to see a lot of changes. wait for it.
You are not a good salesman for Secularism, nobody buys it now and you are worried about it.

During Hindu code bill introduction which was radical step when asked why such bill is not introduced for Muslims Nehru was of opinion Muslims are not ready for it yet. Maybe he got cold feet or was trying not to antagonize Muslims and create them a vote bank. But the preferential treatment started right from that time in independent India.

 

[vsdoc]

you change team again you havent answered why these privileges were given and pampered by your Nehru Secularism in first place, if there is a topi its a Nehru with a Mullah topi.
Triple Talaq ban was a start of Modi and Hindu right 10 years is a long time to see a lot of changes. wait for it.
You are not a good salesman for Secularism, nobody buys it now and you are worried about it.

Except for the educational institutions, which I have always opposed, Muslim or Christian, what is there in the rest that you feel tickled about?

You want to marry 4 wives? Seriously?

Their right to have and run their masjids?

Their right to education? Do you know how much of the bandwidth of education is being eaten by you guys?

Why the hell should a Muslim or a Sikh or a Christian or a Parsi student have to suffer because of stuff your religion institutionalized and is now expecting ALL OF US to pay for?

Why man? As a Parsi what have I done to your dalits?

Then why he gets 50% of the seats and I rub my butt raw to compete for the general seats? Why no privilege to this minority? YOU give him YOUR seat. How's that for a starter?

Cheers, Doc

 

[BlackOpsIndia]

@vsdoc @Infowarrior @BlackOpsIndia

I am following this entire conversation for national election in 2019 and here is my understanding: For better or for the worse, leaving BJP and Modi, there is no party or leadership in the country which wants rather is even willing to talk about economic progress. This is the main and the biggest determinant of anything and everything about a nation of size like India. All justice, freedom etc etc etc become meaningless if you simply do not have enough economic means to support a population of scale of India which is still growing and still quite young. It does not matter if inequality becomes even ten folds higher. At the current economic size, even if you distribute all the economic output equally to all Indians, you will be left with a very anemic living condition. What I guess most people have trouble in understanding is the scale part of the problem. Pickup the biggest riot or most brutal unrest you have seen in your life. I can bet it will be bounded by 10 million people. An economic depression will impact 100s of million for 10s of years to come. These are two completely different scales.

I can see there are few ways in which scenario can play out:

1. BJP emerges with clear mandate: 2/3rd or not but clear mandate. Not NDA but BJP. You will have 5 more years in which there is a chance that economic progress will accelerate.

2. You get a regional party coalition -- third front of sorts -- with support of Congress. It is HD Devegowda once again all over. Nothing will ever get done. Major political instability. There is no chance in the hell any economic reform will be undertaken. Essentially these folks do not have any chops to even think about economic progress, rather they do not have any inclination to work on any strategic thought. Their entire time and energy will be spent to maximize grabbing lucrative cabinet ministries with reshuffling every 2-3 months. The issue with these folks is that they have never been exposed to the reality of running a political system for 1.3 billion people and honestly, they don't even want to attempt that. Most of them have not seen India beyond their own state.

3. You get Congress with support of regional parties: Marginally better than above, may be.

4. You get NDA government. It will be Atal Bihari type government with all effort to keep the coalition going for 5 years. I guess no different than 3.

5. Congress in clear majority. Unlikely. If it happens, it will be Rajiv Gandhi 2.0 all over. We will have an incompetent and insecure leader in the centre being driven by month's or week's Rasputin.

If we go beyond ideological lines in electoral politics public sees own benefit. You waived farmers loan you get vote but when you tax the public for being poor they will definitely get angry and won't bother it's BJP or Congress next.

By tax on being poor I mean the minimum balance charges they have to pay for not being able to maintain the average monthly balance in savings account. Tough 100Rs may look very insignificant to most of us but anyone charged that fine for not having 3000 in back account it's a lot of them. They feel cheated and that irritation become frustration and doubt on credibility when they see big corporates scamming and running out of country.


They pay for being poor and big corporates run away with billions! That's when spinning of Ravish Kumar type people comes into play. They cleverly hide who gave them money but tell who let them walk away. No wonder your supports ditch you and rightly so.

If Turkey can pressurize every country for Gulen supporters and bring them back, the mighty superpower laxity to even ask for extradition for Mallya makes them disappointed in BJP and very rightly so. By being this non serious you are either complicit in making them run or you are encouraging more of them.


There are many small small things like that which makes people sit at home even when they know very well that SP-BSP curse is heading towards them.

 

[Aravind]

During Hindu code bill introduction which was radical step when asked why such bill is not introduced for Muslims Nehru was of opinion Muslims are not ready for it yet. Maybe he got cold feet or was trying not to antagonize Muslims and create them a vote bank. But the preferential treatment started right from that time in independent India.

Agree , but he found it convenient to draft a Hindu code bill without consulting any Hindu stakeholders and thrust it in their faces.
Kashmir was also a festering wound created by so called Nehru Secularism.
When all Politicians including BR Ambedkar was asking for a total migration of Hindu and Muslim population during Partition, Nehru wanted them to stay.

 

[Aravind]

Except for the educational institutions, which I have always opposed, Muslim or Christian, what is there in the rest that you feel tickled about?

You want to marry 4 wives? Seriously?

Their right to have and run their masjids?

Their right to education? Do you know how much of the bandwidth of education is being eaten by you guys?

Why the hell should a Muslim or a Sikh or a Christian or a Parsi student have to suffer because of stuff your religion institutionalized and is now expecting ALL OF US to pay for?

Why man? As a Parsi what have I done to your dalits?

Then why he gets 50% of the seats and I rub my butt raw to compete for the general seats? Why no privilege to this minority? YOU give him YOUR seat. How's that for a starter?

Cheers, Doc

Whats this except for their educational institutions ?

Why is it allowed for muslims to marry 4 wives and not allowed for us?

Our temples are taxed and our donations taken over by govt. and then given grants to churches,masjids ,haj travel subsidies etc. from our temple money

How much bandwidth? OUR educational institutions are forced to act as per RTE ,while minorities get free schooling and no charges in their institutes.

Muslim already get reservation quota in some states. Same for Christians, Sikhs are exempted from RTE, What exactly are you cribbing about, you get a free piggy back ride on the back of Hindus, if there is reservation quota, it is provided by majority community not you.
All subsidies are paid by our money. We should be complaining not you.

You can take my seat if you can secure it in General category. LOL

 

[BlackOpsIndia]

Agree , but he found it convenient to draft a Hindu code bill without consulting any Hindu stakeholders and thrust it in their faces.
Kashmir was also a festering wound created by so called Nehru Secularism.
When all Politicians including BR Ambedkar was asking for a total migration of Hindu and Muslim population during Partition, Nehru wanted them to stay.

Well total migration was never a pragmatic idea and nor was morally justified to people who choose India as motherland instead of a Islamic state even when they have choice.

Ambedkar was another character in himself and I would call him moderate Jinnah. He had more cordial relationship with British then even with Gandhi and was always ready to accept anything that helps in his goals even when it meant division of Indian national movement (separate electorate etc.). If he was a bit more extremist I am sure he would have asked for separate country for his followers too.

 

[Aravind]

Well total migration was never a pragmatic idea and nor was morally justified to people who choose India as motherland instead of a Islamic state even when they have choice.

Ambedkar was another character in himself and I would call him moderate Jinnah. He had more cordial relationship with British then even with Gandhi and was always ready to accept anything that helps in his goals even when it meant division of Indian national movement (separate electorate etc.). If he was a bit more extremist I am sure he would have asked for separate country for his followers too.

We shouldn't be bothered about morals when you gave away a piece of land for those who voted 90% for Muslim league in elections then rioted killed 1 million people for it. What was the need for us to let them stay back when they fought for it. You are creating 10s of Pakistans in India's future, Kashmir, Kerala ,West Bengal, Assam are latest samples of new Pakistans because you let them stay due to your morals.

It is not logical, medically speaking its like using surgery for cancer removal, but letting a part of tumor intact, because it was morally wrong?
This sort of foolish morals get you killed, Prithviraj chauhan paid for such morals. why are stupid Hindus still after fake morals when your opponents follow none.

 

[BlackOpsIndia]

We shouldn't be bothered about morals when you gave away a piece of land for those who voted 90% for Muslim league in elections then rioted killed 1 million people for it. What was the need for us to let them stay back when they fought for it. You are creating 10s of Pakistans in India's future, Kashmir, Kerala ,West Bengal, Assam are latest samples of new Pakistans because you let them stay due to your morals.

It is not logical, medically speaking its like using surgery for cancer removal, but letting a part of tumor intact, because it was morally wrong?
This sort of foolish morals get you killed, Prithviraj chauhan paid for such morals. why are stupid Hindus still after fake morals when your opponents follow none.

But it was not Muslims who demanded Pakistan so why target them as whole?

Even Jinnah didn't want Pakistan in first place, all he wanted was a separate constitution for few states that were Muslim majority and later given to Pakistan. Even after giving up Pakistan we incorporated most of his demands in India too, be it dragging reservation for vote bank or religious preference, Muslim personal law, separate constitution in Kashmir etc. In a way the discrimination kept on going and multiple states functioned inside a state which we sugarcoat now as "diversity".

But who would have thought what future hold for us, they did their best as per conditions prevailing at the time.

 

[Aravind]

But it was not Muslims who demanded Pakistan so why target them as whole?

Even Jinnah didn't want Pakistan in first place, all he wanted was a separate constitution for few states that were Muslim majority and later given to Pakistan. Even after giving up Pakistan we incorporated most of his demands in India too, be it dragging reservation for vote bank or religious preference, Muslim personal law etc. In a way the discrimination kept on going and multiple states functioned inside a state which we sugarcoat now as "diversity".

But who would have thought what future hold for us, they did their best as per conditions prevailing at the time.

What do you mean Muslims didnt demand Pakistan? If there was no demand there would be no supply , simple.
if Muslims didnt want pakistan, was Direct Action day done by aliens?
It is quite foolish to give separate constitution, laws,rights for a section of people mainly Muslims when they already got a separate land called Pakistan.

Nehru etc. knew exactly what was going to happen in future, if they left Partition and total migration unfinished.They were laying foundation for future Pakistans and chose to close their eyes because they wouldn't be around to see it. Jinnah was more than happy for such foolishness from Indian politicians he let 10% Hindus stay ,who are now 1-2% in Pakistan, while Muslims grew to 200 million here and adamantly ask for temple bells and loudspeakers to be removed ,while they blare azan 5 times a day. Won't let Hindus build Ram Mandir in Ayodhya despite proof of a temple existing there. Wage love Jihad and other sorts of things.

In which country does a owaisi like minority gets away by asking police to step aside, and he would wipe out 1 billion Hindus.
In other countries if minorities behave or say such things their communities will be snuffed out and removed.

 

[BlackOpsIndia]

What do you mean Muslims didnt demand Pakistan? If there was no demand there would be no supply , simple.
if Muslims didnt want pakistan, was Direct Action day done by aliens?
It is quite foolish to give separate constitution, laws,rights for a section of people mainly Muslims when they already got a separate land called Pakistan.

Nehru etc. knew exactly what was going to happen in future, if they left Partition and total migration unfinished.They were laying foundation for future Pakistans and chose to close their eyes because they wouldn't be around to see it. Jinnah was more than happy for such foolishness from Indian politicians he let 10% Hindus stay ,who are now 1-2% in Pakistan, while Muslims grew to 200 million here and adamantly ask for temple bells and loudspeakers to be removed ,while they blare azan 5 times a day. Won't let Hindus build Ram Mandir in Ayodhya despite proof of a temple existing there. Wage love Jihad and other sorts of things.

In which country does a owaisi like minority gets away by asking police to step aside, and he would wipe out 1 billion Hindus.
In other countries if minorities behave or say such things their communities will be snuffed out and removed.

I may not be very clear in my last post, by Muslims I meant all Muslims, it's Jinnah and it's supporters that wanted a separate State in a state. The division was done by Mountbatten, maybe there was a back door deal between Jinnah and British or they did it to get rid of it and head back home, it's not very clear what was the exact reason.


Directed action was Jinnah and his supporters.


That's what I am saying we are already giving separate rights to not just one section but multiple sections, we only end up losing large land mass and ofcourse an enemy at our border.


Regarding in which world it happens that a minority get away with provocative speeches, well in western world it happens quite frequently. What doesn't happen is open support to them by any major party like in India, legitimizing and protecting the extremists. Its same with majority too in India.

You need to treat them equal and not lesser son of gods like they treat you when in power.

 

[Parul]

Bye Bye!

https://twitter.com/x/status/974510574204694528

 

[Bali78]

Bye Bye!

https://twitter.com/x/status/974510574204694528

In this game the only loser are people of Andhra Pradesh. CBN is just taking them for a ride. I guess he has been successful in diverting the blame to central government and most likely will win next assembly election as well. After Lok sabha election, he will extract his pound of flesh depending on the situation.

 

[vsdoc]

Things seem to be moving faster than I honestly personally hoped for.

The momentum of so-called allies ditching what is quite openly now considered to be a sinking ship is increasing by the day.

It is going to be interesting to see how the new alliances play out.

When the history of Modi's stint in power is written, I believe it will be Demonetisation that will emerge as the turning point. From where the honeymoon ended and reality sank in.

Cheers, Doc

 

[Itachi]

In this game the only loser are people of Andhra Pradesh. CBN is just taking them for a ride. I guess he has been successful in diverting the blame to central government and most likely will win next assembly election as well. After Lok sabha election, he will extract his pound of flesh depending on the situation.

What did we get being with Biased Janata Party ? Those scumbag cheaters went back on all the promises they gave us.

CBN again proved to be the most effective CM in India. He brought Isuzu and Kia manufacturing plants to the state and established them in some of the most backward districts in the country. Google X signed an mou to establish a centre in vizag He is attempting to bring water to the driest regions of the state.

 

[vsdoc]

What did we get being with Biased Janata Party ? Those scumbag cheaters went back on all the promises they gave us.

CBN again proved to be the most effective CM in India. He brought Isuzu and Kia manufacturing plants to the state and established them in some of the most backward districts in the country. Google X signed an mou to establish a centre in vizag He is attempting to bring water to the driest regions of the state.

A southern India Mahagathbandhan is going to be the way to go.

With secular forces from the north.

If this has a serious chance, we get an alternative that is neither BJP nor the Congress (until they find their feet and leadership that has wider appeal).

Cheers, Doc

 

[Itachi]

Things seem to be moving faster than I honestly personally hoped for.

The momentum of so-called allies ditching what is quite openly now considered to be a sinking ship is increasing by the day.

It is going to be interesting to see how the new alliances play out.

When the history of Modi's stint in power is written, I believe it will be Demonetisation that will emerge as the turning point. From where the honeymoon ended and reality sank in.

Cheers, Doc

Demonetisation was a political move. The economic sense if any is secondary. I have a theory that Modi wants to go down in the history like Vajpayee or Indira. Since he lacks in both class and administration he thought demonetisation would make up for the gap sadly it backfired. Today when I think about the time people wasted by standing in the ATM lines, the marriages and property registrations stopped because of the paucity of money in the country, it riles me up. Modi took us for a ride. Congis for all the blame are right about one thing Modi is nothing but a PR master.