Kashmir : Counter Terror Operation Updates and Discussions

[Hellfire]

What is the need for a colonel to participate in killing rats ?

Reasons:

1. Not trusting others to be able to do the job.
2. Personal glory
3. Thinking he has command over the situation
4. Personal glory
5. Thinking he can command the militants to surrender
6. Personal glory
7. Thinking that he can 'persuade' them to surrender
8. Personal glory.

 

[Sulla84]

The solution to this madness lies in terror central Rawalpindi....killing bunch of jihadis will not solve anything

Raging at Rawalpindi for Indian Army sloppiness does not help...

 

[Hellfire]

Between .. any idea what is standard policy in situations where hostages are taken in kashmir. Does the Army prioritize hostage rescue... or does it prioritize eliminating the terrorists, while ensuring safety of its personnel, since the hostages themselves are terror sympathizers...

There are no hostages in Kashmir in the sense one would assume hostage. They are human shields, oft willing, mostly coerced (as they have no option as have helped earlier for survival).

Obviously, Army will draw flak for citizens killed. And it does look bad on career prospects. So, orders will be to avoid collateral damage.

The solution to this madness lies in terror central Rawalpindi....killing bunch of jihadis will not solve anything

How?

 

[Hellfire]

We need retribution. Restart the TSD.

You wish. Every politician is scared of that aspect. Equipment still exists ... as is needed for Army's SIGINT operations. Whatsapp chat, messages, voice calls, browsing habits .... amazing equipment. But cant be used as Politicians have ordered shut down. Once in while when you switch them on for maintenance, it is amusing.

 

[janme]

I think both the government and army doesn't want to play dirty. That's one more of the major problem. Everything has to be according to the rulebook.

 

[BlackOpsIndia]

The solution to this madness lies in terror central Rawalpindi....killing bunch of jihadis will not solve anything

If there was no Corona PM world have made a speech by now as it's close to election in Bihar, who knows 5% action and 95% PR would have made us believe we killed 300 terrorists in strike. But since it's lockdown these 5 will die unavenged, like those 5 PARA before and hundreds before.

A complete failure on both internal amd external security front. Assign a short key to "RIP" we may need to use it quite frequently.

 

[zapper]

I think the Army saying the colonel led the operation to save hostages is just trying to make a martyr out of a fool... And a fool the colonel surely was... guess with nothing to do but counter terrorism operation on home soil, senior officers feel there is a need to visit the front(house where rats are holed up). Not the first time senior officers have visited the area too soon, and made a mess of things..

Few reports said the colonel actually went in to talk with the village elders where they've been ambushed

Between .. any idea what is standard policy in situations where hostages are taken in kashmir. Does the Army prioritize hostage rescue... or does it prioritize eliminating the terrorists, while ensuring safety of its personnel, since the hostages themselves are terror sympathizers

Outside Kashmir, it's usually to rescue hostages and that applies to Kashmir as well based on the locality. Few villages are pro-India while some are not and it depends on which region they're dealing with

From whatever has been published in last couple of weeks, it was very clear that tangos were looking for a major strike to boost their morale. They had been on the backfoot for over two months now and they needed to do something spectacular. This op in Handwara was a well laid trap and our guys walked straight headon into it. Lot of OGWs are also informents of security forces. Plus many allow tangos to hide in their homes only to get money to rebuild their houses. Every house which gets blasted, the house owners are given a hefty compensation. And at times also the reward money for giving information. In this operation, It is very clear that the so called hostages were helping the Tangos and they lured the officers to the house where the Tangos were already hiding and waiting. As per my information, the officers had died within an hour of the start of operation. It was that well planned. They could not even put up a proper fight.

Might be a double agent who leaked to both sides and we bore the brunt. While this is partly an intelligence failure, it's also to do with training and obsolete SOP's in such situations. This debacle is definitely a lesson well learn for the IA and I hope they start acting mercilessly going all out from now on

 

[zapper]

If there was no Corona PM world have made a speech by now as it's close to election in Bihar, who knows 5% action and 95% PR would have made us believe we killed 300 terrorists in strike. But since it's lockdown these 5 will die unavenged, like those 5 PARA before and hundreds before.

A complete failure on both internal amd external security front. Assign a short key to "RIP" we may need to use it quite frequently.

While the numbers are still in our favor with 64 terrorists dispatched against 21 security personnel in 2020, it's still a poor record given our numbers advantage. The deaths of 5 Para commandos and 2 senior IA officers is definitely a morale booster for our adversaries

 

[thinkingcap81]

Reasons:

1. Not trusting others to be able to do the job.
2. Personal glory
3. Thinking he has command over the situation
4. Personal glory
5. Thinking he can command the militants to surrender
6. Personal glory
7. Thinking that he can 'persuade' them to surrender
8. Personal glory.

That is a wonderful reply.

I guess that it is unlikely that such a person will be a good leader. He will most likely be dismissive of the soldiers he commands.

We need to see if there is a response by the IA or is the situation interpreted as a lapse in SOP.

 

[Sulla84]

From whatever has been published in last couple of weeks, it was very clear that tangos were looking for a major strike to boost their morale. They had been on the backfoot for over two months now and they needed to do something spectacular. This op in Handwara was a well laid trap and our guys walked straight headon into it. Lot of OGWs are also informents of security forces. Plus many allow tangos to hide in their homes only to get money to rebuild their houses. Every house which gets blasted, the house owners are given a hefty compensation. And at times also the reward money for giving information. In this operation, It is very clear that the so called hostages were helping the Tangos and they lured the officers to the house where the Tangos were already hiding and waiting. As per my information, the officers had died within an hour of the start of operation. It was that well planned. They could not even put up a proper fight.

Nothing justifies a colonel walking into a rat infested house before its sanitized. The plan might have been good, but it needed a sucker of a colonel at the other end to work..

 

[thinkingcap81]

You wish. Every politician is scared of that aspect. Equipment still exists ... as is needed for Army's SIGINT operations. Whatsapp chat, messages, voice calls, browsing habits .... amazing equipment. But cant be used as Politicians have ordered shut down. Once in while when you switch them on for maintenance, it is amusing.

I suppose that we are still in the often abused mindset of significant retaliation. That said did we expect the kind of retaliation on 27 Feb? Pakistan military will do a lot to protect its turf.

We are still short of a stronger military strategy. Economic strategy is a slow process; it is further slowed down by Chinese support. It speaks volumes of the lack of creative capabilities. Sadly this malaise exists in almost all spheres of our lives.

 

[Sulla84]

But since it's lockdown these 5 will die unavenged, like those 5 PARA before and hundreds before.

Drone aided artillery strikes avenged the death of the 5 para troopers.. The deaths today if they lead to better SOPs that no glory hunting officer strays from, and lead to better tactics, equipment and training, would be good enough..

 

[Milspec]

You wish. Every politician is scared of that aspect. Equipment still exists ... as is needed for Army's SIGINT operations. Whatsapp chat, messages, voice calls, browsing habits .... amazing equipment. But cant be used as Politicians have ordered shut down. Once in while when you switch them on for maintenance, it is amusing.

When you get some time, we need to talk a little more about TSD offline.

 

[randomradio]

It was 150 people not 180. SSG reached the spot within 15 minutes and snipers took out majority of attackers. There were 1100 kids in school, death toll would have been many times if they didn't arrive in time.

The terrorists did not kill anybody who were 8th standard and below, that's why only 150 students were killed. Only 9th and 10th kids.

 

[Sulla84]

One observation: It is often hard for the IAF to disguise its sloppiness.. like the shooting down of the mi-17 in friendly fire.. but time and again whether it's the colonel being killed yesterday.. or the lieutenant colonel and Brigadier injured in an encounter on feb 18 2019 after pulwama, the army always gets to disguise its sloppiness as "Top army officers leading from the front" as if it's some military campaign against China or Pakistan...

 

[screambowl]

Pakistan army is better. That's why they are able to counter adversary 5 times bigger Indian army. They improvise from the experiences in Arab countries and Afghanistan, they know how to use proxy and contain the after effects to outskirts. Indian army needs to re-evaluate , improvise, go more technical, more intel-oriented and preemptive when its about CTops.

 

[screambowl]

Reasons:

1. Not trusting others to be able to do the job.
2. Personal glory
3. Thinking he has command over the situation
4. Personal glory
5. Thinking he can command the militants to surrender
6. Personal glory
7. Thinking that he can 'persuade' them to surrender
8. Personal glory.

Question should be how come no KIA of Colonel and Lt Colonel on Pakistani side even though they are the aggressors. They have brilliantly fooled the Indians and diverted all of India's attention towards the proxy, be it Kashmir separatism, khalistan, tamil etc. And themselves they tend to handle high grade intel operations inside other parts of India. That's the only conclusion.

Result: Both sides to Pakistani mainland, they have created buffer zone. One is Nuristan other is Kashmir.

Their weak points: Sea, but they have managed to leak info from IN as well.

 

[RISING SUN]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1256858774024810496

 

[Sulla84]

Question should be how come no KIA of Colonel and Lt Colonel on Pakistani side even though they are the aggressors

You tend to be too enamoured by Pak Army.. They lose more Colonels from Pak Army as well as SSG than India..
This one is from March.. A Pak Army Colonel was killed in KP. God knows how many top officers' killings Pak Army has attributed to heart attacks and road accidents

Pakistani Colonel, Two 'Terrorists' Killed In Army Operation In Northwest

www.rferl.org

 

[screambowl]

You tend to be too enamoured by Pak Army.. They lose more Colonels from Pak Army as well as SSG than India..
This one is from March.. A Pak Army Colonel was killed in KP. God knows how many top officers' killings Pak Army has attributed to heart attacks and road accidents

Pakistani Colonel, Two 'Terrorists' Killed In Army Operation In Northwest

www.rferl.org

Read what does the article says.

But the area bordering Afghanistan has continued to be the scene of violent attacks, targeted killings, and land-mine blasts.

It's near Afghanistan border 10 times more volatile, porous and deadly areas than Kashmir. Had India been handling the way they are handling Kashmir , 5 colonels would have KIA every day.
By the way, unka mara hai to apna bhi marwa dogey kya? By God!!