Money is available, with changed threat scenario other welfare projects will get less priority.
MMRCA 2.0 - Updates and Discussions
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15 Bugatti Type 55 out of the 38 in circulation in the world came to wish the Rafale a good flight and to support it for a start under the best auspices.
This is a complex subject. At the moment we are focusing on 83 LCA. The other plan for follow up is 114 MRFA, line of LCAs and AMCA. Whether MRFA or more Rafale, this entire subject is under discussion. @ThePrintIndia
— Snehesh Alex Philip (@sneheshphilip) October 5, 2020
The question isn't whether it can wait, the question is whether it will have to wait regardless.
To get their sanctioned strength of 42+ squadron, the IAF would need for several aircraft projects to be conducted in parallel, both domestic productions and imports. It's just not possible to get new aircraft at the required speed otherwise, given the sheer number of ancient aircraft that cannot credibly have their service life extended further.
However, India does not have the defense budget for that. Not without going full wartime economy and sacrificing everything else. And the covid recession is definitely not helping in that regard.
To get their sanctioned strength of 42+ squadron, the IAF would need for several aircraft projects to be conducted in parallel, both domestic productions and imports. It's just not possible to get new aircraft at the required speed otherwise, given the sheer number of ancient aircraft that cannot credibly have their service life extended further.
However, India does not have the defense budget for that. Not without going full wartime economy and sacrificing everything else. And the covid recession is definitely not helping in that regard.
Nope. But it can be delayed as long as a second GTG deal for 36 Rafales is signed.
Not at all. The govt spends a lot of money on populist schemes and investment, hence there's no money. This is not even including COVID.
The issue right now is the private sector is down due to NPAs, so investment from their side is very less and the govt has increased spending to compensate for it. This has been happening ever since the UPA destroyed our economy after the financial crisis through excessive easing and the private sector became overleveraged.
The expectation was things would settle down in the early 2020s and with private investment gaining ground, govt spending would be focused elsewhere, like defence. This is also about the time the economy would start compounding rapidly on a higher base, indigenous R&D programs would bear fruit (as is happening) and the stress on security would increase as the country begins stepping on the toes of other powers, so the importance of defence to India will start increasing on an exponential basis.
The major slew of reforms taking place within the govt and the economy has not helped matters in the short term, although there are obvious long term benefits. And COVID has definitely dampened the govt's expectations on growth for the next 2 years at the minimum.
But if the MRFA program is really important, then it can be sped up as needed, since the economy can easily absorb a few hundred jets if necessary. We definitely do not need to shift to a war economy in order to afford a measley 100-200 Rafales when the average growth of yearly govt spending is more than the bill for the whole fleet.
Decision to buy more Rafale aircraft or new fighter jets under consideration, IAF chief says
During his annual press conference, Air Chief Marshal R.K.S. Bhadauria also announced that the 36 Rafale fighter jets will be operationalised completely by 2023.
theprint.in
Decision to buy more Rafale aircraft or new fighter jets under consideration, IAF chief says
During his annual press conference, Air Chief Marshal R.K.S. Bhadauria also announced that the 36 Rafale fighter jets will be operationalised completely by 2023.
New Delhi: Indian Air Force (IAF) Chief Air Chief Marshal R.K.S. Bhadauria Monday for the first time officially indicated that the decision to buy two more squadrons of Rafale fighter jets is under consideration.
He, however, made it clear that the IAF was currently focusing on the order to be issued soon for 83 Light Combat Tejas Mark 1A.
“At the moment, we are concentrating on 83 LCA Mk 1A. After that, the follow-up planned is MRFA (multi-role fighter aircraft), which is ‘Make in India’ and the other line is on LCA versions, and Advanced Medium Combat Aircraft (AMCA),” said the IAF chief while addressing the media during his annual press conference.
“In terms of whether we go in for more Rafale or MRFA, it will be an open competition as it is currently planned. We have received the RFI (Request for Information) responses. So this entire subject is under discussion and debate. As and when this situation and the picture becomes clear and we finalise the way forward, we will share with you,” he added.
Asked by ThePrint on what the IAF favours as the next lot of Rafale aircraft will be cheaper than the 36 jets bought in 2016 and that logistics are already in place to cater to two more squadrons, the IAF chief said the issue is “on the table in terms of taking a final call”.
“I can’t discuss that question and answer before we take a final decision. This is a subject, which is under discussion. The current status is that we have received all of the RFI (Request for Information sent out for 114 MFRA) responses. All these issues are on the table in terms of taking a final call. As and when we decide, we will then tell you,” he said.
“There is no point in saying because of this (next lot will be cheaper and logistics in place) let us do this. There are various issues to be considered. All these facts are there. As soon as we take it, we will tell you”.
Rafale procurement
Chief of Defence Staff Gen. Bipin Rawat had in February said the government will go in for staggered purchase of fighter jets, which was seen as an advantage to Rafale.
As reported by ThePrint, there is a thinking within the government that India should go in for two additional squadrons of the Rafale fighter jets besides better versions of the indigenous LCA Tejas and AMCA.
This was because a large component of the €1,700 million paid for India Specific Enhancements in Rafale will come down as the majority of the cost was for Research and Development, modification and certification.
The cost of setting up the base and training will also come down since India had paid for setting up two bases for just 36 aircraft. These bases can easily accommodate more squadrons of the aircraft without additional cost.
Also, future Rafale fighter jets will come with no offsets under the new policy of the government, thereby bringing down the cost further.
36 Rafale jets to be operationalised by 2023
Meanwhile, the IAF chief said that the 36 Rafale fighter jets will be operationalised completely by 2023.
While the IAF has operationally inducted 5 such French fighters, an additional 3-4 jets will come by end of this month or early November. “This will keep happening every 3-4 months,” he said.
The IAF chief also said integration of Rafale brings in a platform, which is the way ahead and would give the force an edge and capability to strike first and deep.
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God knows. The alphabet soup never stops flowing!
MRCA -> MMRCA -> Single Engine something something something -> MRFA -> WTFA
Seriously, WTF is wrong with these people! They have spent 20 years and they are still playing RFI RFI.
Bring in Make in India and Atma-Nirbhar Bullshit and we will ensure that there will never be any procurement till 2047.
India SERIOUSLY DESERVES A CRUSHING DEFEAT! A defeat so bad that there will be a reckoning to all of its bureaucrats.
I SERIOUSLY WISH CHINA INVADES INDIA ALL THE WAY TILL DELHI. THESE IDIOTS IN MINISTRIES, BEAUROCRACY AND PARLIAMENT DESERVE TO BE SHOWN HOW INCOMPETENT THEY ARE!
@Falcon Once more dude, how you folks in forces actually tolerate these idiots in ministries and leadership.
@Mods @Ashwin etc. I respect your pain to moderate this forum but I guess MMRCA thread needs to be closed. Its over.
I mean look at ACM. He is saying that there is a new procurement target (fighter) called MRFA!!! HA! They even have RFIs for that.
I guess we should open a new thread on this, after all its all new again.
I mean look at ACM. He is saying that there is a new procurement target (fighter) called MRFA!!! HA! They even have RFIs for that.
I guess we should open a new thread on this, after all its all new again.
I understand you want to rant out of frustration. Then i would advice you to look into respective threads and see what is happening and join there. No need to open a new thread.
There was no official name. For reference here is the tender. There is no new tender. Airfoce people has now started calling it MRFA. They are still deliberating to go for AoN approval or not. (We named the thread MMRCA 2.0 for easy understanding then).
Can I ask, when will you close this thread then? I mean when will the name MMRCA disappear? I am hearing it since 2000s.
If Airforce is calling "it" MRFA, I guess "it" is MRFA then.
In India, a lot of money is wasted just in political feud. Programs like MGNREGA.
In 2017, we wasted 48,000 Carore in MGNREGA. Thats 6.5 BILLION DOLLARS!
The only reason Modi government is keeping MGNREGA alive is to use it as a cane to bash congress.
All this money ultimately goes into pockets of middle men and beaurocrats.
Here is an excerpt from a Finnish magazine called Siivet on Rafale. I thought you might like to read a translation:
"What about SPECTRA? Can you fly safely in the forbidden airspace?
Former Rafale pilot Joseph Barraco answers:
We have proof of that. We have faced the most difficult defences, such as the Russian S-300. The latest MACE (Multidomain Airborne Cyber and Electronic warfare) exercise included the Rafale, Typhoon, Hornet, Growler and Gripen.
The Finnish Exercise Manager said at the press briefing that the Rafale was the best of the exercise. It is not just SPECTRA, but many capabilities. The SPECTRA is part of the Survivability Capability, as are the two engines and the AGCAS. The problem is that we cannot talk about SPECTRA. It is difficult to explain the power of the system. But it has a status that everybody knows.
I have worked with Growlers, which are pretty much the same but different. We did the same mission, but in a different way. We deal with the whole spectrum of targeting. SPECTRA is part of sensor fusion and is designed for passive targeting. It is part of the stealth aircraft detection system. It does targeting, jamming, protection and information sharing.
One of the characteristics of the system is its adaptability. If you are stealthy, you always use the same tactics, because it only protects you in one way. Stealth is a geometric feature. It's not 360 degrees, so it's predictable. If the radars are operating on a different frequency or in a different direction, they will detect you. The Rafale can operate with great flexibility and use different systems and tactics," says Barraco.
"What about SPECTRA? Can you fly safely in the forbidden airspace?
Former Rafale pilot Joseph Barraco answers:
We have proof of that. We have faced the most difficult defences, such as the Russian S-300. The latest MACE (Multidomain Airborne Cyber and Electronic warfare) exercise included the Rafale, Typhoon, Hornet, Growler and Gripen.
The Finnish Exercise Manager said at the press briefing that the Rafale was the best of the exercise. It is not just SPECTRA, but many capabilities. The SPECTRA is part of the Survivability Capability, as are the two engines and the AGCAS. The problem is that we cannot talk about SPECTRA. It is difficult to explain the power of the system. But it has a status that everybody knows.
I have worked with Growlers, which are pretty much the same but different. We did the same mission, but in a different way. We deal with the whole spectrum of targeting. SPECTRA is part of sensor fusion and is designed for passive targeting. It is part of the stealth aircraft detection system. It does targeting, jamming, protection and information sharing.
One of the characteristics of the system is its adaptability. If you are stealthy, you always use the same tactics, because it only protects you in one way. Stealth is a geometric feature. It's not 360 degrees, so it's predictable. If the radars are operating on a different frequency or in a different direction, they will detect you. The Rafale can operate with great flexibility and use different systems and tactics," says Barraco.
Then Rename the thread as MRFA. I will say restart the thread because the connection to MMRCA is getting severed.