There's much more to it "kiddo". Such as software and firmware.
Now go build Tejas with western avionics and American Engine and call it indigenous
Pakistan AirForce : Updates & Discussions
- Thread starter Ashwin
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Now go build Tejas with western avionics and American Engine and call it indigenous
And you just paint JF17 and call it Pakistani , whats Pakistani in JF17 anyways? Nothing.There's much more to it "kiddo". Such as software and firmware.
Now go build Tejas with western avionics and American Engine and call it indigenous
Glorified CKUs similar to our Su30s
If some one gives you a radar, engine, ew components, radio, missiles wilp you be able to make a jetfighter? If yes what you will call, a pakistani fighter or foreign fighter?There's much more to it "kiddo". Such as software and firmware.
Now go build Tejas with western avionics and American Engine and call it indigenous
You need indepth knowledge of aerodynamics, or you have to develop that knowledge base by modeling, trial & error method, you need industrial base to support that jet fighter program. Requirements of Some unique components will arise if you start developing a fighter and you have to develop by your self. Tejas is Indian fighter jet designed by indians, may have take some technical support from abroad, and ofcourse we have sourced many crucial components form others. Still, facts wont change, it is an indian orgin fighter jet.
Yup.
We don't reinvent the wheel.
As a result JF-17 is operational since 2008 and LCA Tejas only recently got inducted.
So there's the difference.
Also 58% components of JF-17 are made in Pakistan also the entire software was written in Pakistan .
This last bit of information is the proverbial game changer.
What is this logic? Jf17, which designed by chinese, tested & tweaked by chinese and licence produced in pakistan, which flying with russian engine is indigenous to pakistan ! But tejas which is designed & tweaked by india with foreign sub components is not indigenous to india, Only because its inducted after 2008 ! Is there any treaty exist like any fighter inducted after 2008 is not indigenous fighter?
The learning curve you mentioned is too expensive in both financial terms and time .
However all that can be useful if a financially profiting industrial base is created based on that learning experience.
Did India do that? I don't know.
Man dont dodge my query by raising another query, the objective for financial gain and all may varies with country to country. Question is how com Tejas isnt an indigenous fighter for india & JF17 is a indigenous fighter for pakistan?
Apparently painting green makes it Pakistani or doing screwdriver giri makes it indigenous
We dont need to undermine someone else's hard work for he being our enemy. Jf17 is more than a paint job for pakistan and many components may have manufactured by pakistan itself. But one thing we need to admit, jf17 a well managed project by pakistani military and tejas is not.
Not only tejas our lch too. I saw one video, which claim IA wants hellfire on lch but drdo doesn't want it.
You and i both know that this question cannot be settled, as it hasn't been settled since 2004 when JF-17 project came to public attention.
You and i, both have seen multiple arguments from both sides on this subject, and it didn't end well.
There's a reason new blocks of JF17 are tested in China first because its a chinese aircraft made for PAF and other poor nations. I agree they are ahead of the curve though
Because current jf17 is incapable to deal with the emerging threat, naturally people will try to upgrade the existing platform. We can see that with f16, sukhoi 27, rafale, tejas etc
They aren't ahead of the curve in anyway. The JF-17 is their mainstay. Till date that's the only aircraft program they've got going and various iterations of it are going to replace all those Chinese derivatives of the MiG-21 & the Mirages.
Apart from that we do hear of fancy proposals of PAF opting for the Su-35 or the J-31 or even being part of the Turkish 5th Gen FA program from time to time but nothings come out of it.
So , what is the future PAF we're looking at but for various iterations of the Thunder & the F-16. How respectable an Air Force is that?
It didn't end well because blind nationalist from both sides wants to ridiculed opponent's product as dud. Fact is Tejas is an Indian origin fighter with hell lot of limitations and struggled a lot to see the lime light and finally somehow it managed to gat in to service.
Jf17 in other hand is a chinese designed fighter for pakistan and license producing in pakistan with the aid of china, which is inducted long back.
As on now, jf17 is a hugely successful fighter program while comparing with Tejas fighter program. Its something like ( not exactly same) b52 is a hugely successful bomber program than b2 stealth.
Hugely successful fighter is a funny term. HAL tomorrow can build 1000 mig 21, doesn't mean it's successful....as it doesn't bring anything new to the table in terms of capability. You can say it's a success in a sense that Pakistan have started to learn some screw giri , that's it. Bunder is very underpowered fighter jet, with p** poor EWS, Power , Radar, electronic , pilots to name a few with no future upgrade prospect. It's even worse than Tejas.
It's whole goal by chink was to undermine Tejas and make sure India remain pitched with Pakistan and not with China. They are gonna do same with J 35 when AMCA come along.
Put it this way.
How many countries of the world want to sell weapons to India? Pretty much everyone.
How many countries want to sell weapons to Pakistan?
May be china and Turkey.
So we can only do as per our options.
India has the luxury of buying weapons from anywhere and then on a side , running an indigenous program for as long as it takes.
We can't do that.
We have to meet our defence needs while putting in as much input of our own as we can without causing any delays.
India could and still can take as much time as they want to tweak Tejas.
Their defence needs are covered by SU-30 and will be enhanced by Rafale.
Pakistan walks on a tight rope. The F-16 is a bubble which cam burst anytime by US sanctions.
So taking time to hone oqn skills for building own jet is not an option as defence needs won't be met.
That's why JF-17 was and still being fast tracked and tested while being in use.
If you remember there was a JF-17 crash on 14-NOV-2011 near Attock. The plane crashed due to a design flaw.
Under certain G force and meneuvering conditions the wings flexed so much that the plane became instable beyond the capability of the flight control computer.
So the flaw was two folds. Structural and computational.
Normally fighter jets only come into service after such flaws are ironed out.
But like I said, Pakistan don't have this luxury.
Most Indians and many Pakistani who constantly tease Pakistan for not going 100% indigenous, ignore or are ignorant of above mentioned situations Pakistan is facing.
The cosines we are enjoying for the past 10 years nothing infront of pakistan's romance with west during last half century, you even been in to a military pact with united states. What did you achieved in military engineering sector which india didn't had? Nothing...
What i meant to tell is pakistan miss the bus in past in developing military industrial base, we too did the same. Only time will tell how much india can develop our military industrial infra structure by being cosy with west.
Bro 58% of components are made in Pakistan
With tot from China....or with license from China,
Do you know India overhaul s su30 engine s without Russian help