Project 75 India Diesel-electric Submarine Programs (SSK) : Updates and Discussions

Who will win the P75I program?

  • L&T and Navantia

    Votes: 13 37.1%

  • MDL and TKMS

    Votes: 9 25.7%

  • It will get canceled eventually

    Votes: 13 37.1%
  • Total voters
    35
Ashwin said:
What if germans offer us Type-212CD ?
Bigger, fuel cell AIP, New hull design, optronics masts, lithium ion battery. Basically, everything state of the art. I would consider it a highly appealing offer.
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We could get the same or a modification of it. What the Germans say they are offering is a new design. But whether it's a modernisation of the Type 212CD or a brand new design is unclear. The CD is the right size though. Then there's the Type 216.

It's not clear if the sub will be similar in grade to the Type 212CD or some export-grade crap. And instead of kta's CMS, they could give us an older model from Atlas. I don't mind an Indo-German JV for it though.
 
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randomradio said:
We could get the same or a modification of it. What the Germans say they are offering is a new design. But whether it's a modernisation of the Type 212CD or a brand new design is unclear. The CD is the right size though. Then there's the Type 216.

It's not clear if the sub will be similar in grade to the Type 212CD or some export-grade crap. And instead of kta's CMS, they could give us an older model from Atlas. I don't mind an Indo-German JV for it though.
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Type 216 & soryu class are the right sub for IN, sadly both are not offered.
 
Hydra said:
Type 216 & soryu class are the right sub for IN, sadly both are not offered.
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Type 212CD or its derivative is a better option than 216.

Soryu has been replaced by the Taigei class. But I guess Japan and SoKo's lack of participation has a lot more to do with China than anything else.
 
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Ashwin said:
The main modification here is for SLBM. Which we don’t need.

Not big enough!

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Depends on what the IN plans to equip the submarine with.

CD has a draft of 7m, so it cannot handle a 9m long Brahmos without making it look like an SSBN. But the IN could decide to carry the Brahmos NG instead. They can easily make it more capable than the current lot of Brahmos 1. And we don't yet know much about Brahmos 2, hope it's made to fit, unlike Zircon.

S-80 Plus has the same problem.

So either both subs get a hump or they settle for NG.

Both subs need a VLS module attached.

Both subs can carry the LR-LACM.
 
randomradio said:
Depends on what the IN plans to equip the submarine with.

CD has a draft of 7m, so it cannot handle a 9m long Brahmos without making it look like an SSBN. But the IN could decide to carry the Brahmos NG instead. They can easily make it more capable than the current lot of Brahmos 1. And we don't yet know much about Brahmos 2, hope it's made to fit, unlike Zircon.

S-80 Plus has the same problem.

So either both subs get a hump or they settle for NG.

Both subs need a VLS module attached.

Both subs can carry the LR-LACM.
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We have discussed this before. There is no requirement of adding 3 ton missiles on a SSK. There is zero operational rationale to it. Its too much work for nothing.

They want SLCM (approximately 1ton) to be integrated which is under development. Thats all.

All of these submarines can accommodate these missiles with limited change.
 
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SLCM is being developed for the P-75 and P-75I class submarines. It won't make sense to add Brahmos to the subs. Even the LRLACM will not be required for the subs as the SLCM is supposed to have both anti-ship as well as land attack versions.

20220823_014429.jpg
 
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Ashwin said:
We have discussed this before. There is no requirement of adding 3 ton missiles on a SSK. There is zero operational rationale or logic to it. Its too much work for nothing.

They want SLCM (approximately 1ton) to be integrated which is under development. Thats all.

All of these submarines can accommodate these missiles with limited change.
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Sub-launched Brahmos 1 exists for a reason.

Submarine Launch Version - BrahMos.com

a universal supersonic cruise missile.different types of indian missile and russian missile.
www.brahmos.com

The IN had their eyes on much bigger subs like the Soryu, before more practical considerations came to the fore post Japan's withdrawal and the govt's approval of the SSN program. Kinda like Australia.

But the requirement is still there. More like a minimum Brahmos NG, optimal Brahmos 1, and they will award points based on what the OEM can achieve. So, it's not the IN backing out, any decision made will be made based on the limitations of the OEM.

Also, there's no hard and fast rule saying the same subs under construction will have to be offered. Both Germany and Spain could very well offer bigger designs inspired from existing designs. So both subs could very easily have a draft of 8m, making Brahmos 1 viable.
 
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Fatalis said:
SLCM is being developed for the P-75 and P-75I class submarines. It won't make sense to add Brahmos to the subs. Even the LRLACM will not be required for the subs as the SLCM is supposed to have both anti-ship as well as land attack versions.

View attachment 28312
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This refers to a horizontally-launched missile, very likely a derivative of the LR-LACM.

Further derived from Nirbhay. News from 2008.
 
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randomradio said:
Type 212CD or its derivative is a better option than 216.

Soryu has been replaced by the Taigei class. But I guess Japan and SoKo's lack of participation has a lot more to do with China than anything else.
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We cannot dream about the top end specimens from Japan or Germany. So thats why I was in impression that these two, ie soryu & 216 will be offered. Its shame that, Germany recently wants india to detach from Russia by offering weapons, and now they are willing to sell type 214 which is a kila class type sub.
If Japanese really want to tackle china, they should have offer soryu to us, it will be political statement & will start the seed of interoperability between these two Navies.

Honestly speaking the french offer of al sub design based Barracuda is more lucrative than the current state of P75I.
 
Hydra said:
We cannot dream about the top end specimens from Japan or Germany. So thats why I was in impression that these two, ie soryu & 216 will be offered. Its shame that, Germany recently wants india to detach from Russia by offering weapons, and now they are willing to sell type 214 which is a kila class type sub.
If Japanese really want to tackle china, they should have offer soryu to us, it will be political statement & will start the seed of interoperability between these two Navies.

Honestly speaking the french offer of al sub design based Barracuda is more lucrative than the current state of P75I.
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The only two companies willing to offer proven tech are the Germans and Spaniards, so that's all we got. Jap and SoKo have their own domestic problems to deal with.

If anything, we have to develop new capabilities on our own through P76.
 
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Yes, we are actively exploring opportunities to participate in the P751 project. One such example is providing our cutting-edge Energy Storage System technology for the submarine’s battery pack. The Indian government has presented us with a clear vision for the future plan, and we are confident in actively proceeding with this project.
 
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